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Baltimore's colossal Key Bridge collapses in moments after container ship crashes into it flinging 'multiple' cars into the river
March 26, 2024, 10:12 AM
corsairBaltimore's colossal Key Bridge collapses in moments after container ship crashes into it flinging 'multiple' cars into the river
quote:
Originally posted by spunk639:
Does the Port of Baltimore require Harbor Pilots? In Boston Harbor the Harbor Pilots know every nook and cranny of the Harbor. Maybe mechanical issues with the ship.
Absolutely, you're not pulling into any port without a pilot, particularly in a vessel of that size, you absolutely need someone with local knowledge of the channels, terminals/piers and tugs.
March 26, 2024, 10:14 AM
pedropcolaIf they suffered a engineering plant malfunction they could have had all the Baltimore pilots onboard and it wouldn't matter. Now tugs on each side or at least nearby, that would make a difference.
I agree with 92fstech, opening the waterway is the priority. You can get vehicles around without I-695 albeit with massive delays and backup.
March 26, 2024, 10:15 AM
PASigIt's my understanding that it WAS a local crew that was piloting when the accident took place.
March 26, 2024, 10:31 AM
abnmacvAn unqualified fuc*up.
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March 26, 2024, 10:33 AM
Sig2340I was talking with a former Navy diver, now commercial diver, I know.
His take is the harbor is closed a minimum of six months.
Why?
It will take three months to mobilize the people and machines necessary to clear the harbor. The machines are the long pole - finding a large floating crane or two on short notice for a long contract isn't easy. Then another three months to sufficiently clear just the channel to allow large vessel navigation.
Rebuilding is at least five, more like ten, years and will run into billions.
Then there is the inevitable litigation.
Nice is overrated
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March 26, 2024, 10:51 AM
corsairquote:
Originally posted by pedropcola:
If they suffered a engineering plant malfunction they could have had all the Baltimore pilots onboard and it wouldn't matter. Now tugs on each side or at least nearby, that would make a difference.
The tugs are there to pull and orient the ship to/from the terminal, this ship was already clear of her maneuvers and was making steam into the channel, tugs would've helped but, at this point they had already been cast-off.
quote:
Originally posted by PASig:
It's my understanding that it WAS a local crew that was piloting when the accident took place.
There's another bridge at Annapolis where they'd need navigation assistance I would assume pilots are necessary.
Are pilots needed to navigate the ENTIRE Chesapeake or, only between anchorages and terminals?
March 26, 2024, 10:53 AM
ZSMICHAELquote:
It will take three months to mobilize the people and machines necessary to clear the harbor. The machines are the long pole - finding a large floating crane or two on short notice for a long contract isn't easy. Then another three months to sufficiently clear just the channel to allow large vessel navigation.
Rebuilding is at least five, more like ten, years and will run into billions.
Then there is the inevitable litigation.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Quite the pessimist. It will be a priority of the Federal Government and people will be impresssed as it will be done quickly. America has the resources and knowledge. It is not going out for bids.
March 26, 2024, 11:10 AM
c1steveThe ship turned amazingly fast, I have not seen a container ship turn like that before. A single screw vessel would have a slight tendency to turn in one direction, but nothing like the video shows.
It is possible that the autopilot system malfunctioned, and caused the boat to turn sharply. Other possibility is sabotage.
-c1steve
March 26, 2024, 11:18 AM
stoic-oneI can see it taking months to clear out the wreckage of the bridge, but I simply don't see how it could take 6 months to clear
"A" channel for navigation.
March 26, 2024, 11:35 AM
erj_pilotquote:
Originally posted in the article:
"Governor Wes Moore has declared a state of emergency in Maryland in order for local officials to access funds from the Biden administration. The governor also said his office is in close contact with Secretary of Transportation Pete Buttigieg."
Well...they may have to hit up Zelenskyy for THOSE funds. The Biden Administration's coffers are probably pretty empty. But they'll find a way to print the money...
"If you’re a leader, you lead the way. Not just on the easy ones; you take the tough ones too…” – MAJ Richard D. Winters (1918-2011), E Company, 2nd Battalion, 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment, 101st Airborne
"Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil... Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel." - Isaiah 5:20,24 March 26, 2024, 11:35 AM
corsairquote:
Originally posted by c1steve:
The ship turned amazingly fast, I have not seen a container ship turn like that before. A single screw vessel would have a slight tendency to turn in one direction, but nothing like the video shows.
It is possible that the autopilot system malfunctioned, and caused the boat to turn sharply. Other possibility is sabotage.
It'd be a surprise if autopilot was engaged, when transiting a channel and port area its all about pilot, master, helm and navigator/GPS
Other possibilities....
- Helm threw the rudder in an effort to keep the bow pointed in the channel
- Wind
- There was enough torque in the shaft to effect that movement while the ship drifted
Well find out in the investigation...
March 26, 2024, 11:37 AM
MikeinNCquote:
Originally posted by 92fstech:
quote:
Originally posted by MikeinNC:
All right sailors, why dit it turn to the starboard after losing power?
Single screw vessel, the screw was still turning and that’s what made it turn starboard.
The USN and USCG conduct loss of steering drills every time they sail, to try and combat and prepare for things like this. Same with fires and GQ.
Curious, as someone with absolutely zero experience with watercraft beyond a 25hp tiller-steer outboard on my aluminum fishing boat:
Is the proper reaction to immediately shut down the shaft when this happens?
No, you’d immediately put the shaft in neutral and let it slow down, while putting a step tiller on the rudder or use block and tackle to manually control the rudders And we're assuming from the outcome in this incident that that didn't happen?
based on the outcome I’d say they didn’t have time to set up emergency steerage or they gambled on getting power back on Can the shaft be disengaged/reengaged without shutting down the engine (which I assume would take a long time to restart)?
yes the shaft can be placed in neutral with the engine still running. But they had lost power, so the shaft was already free wheeling If so, how long would that take to accomplish?
just depends, on the 41’ boats it was a one minute job, on the patrol boat it took about ten minutes for the block and tackle to be rigged with experienced crew. One the big ship it was a ten to fifteen minute job to rig it.
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bald1quote:
Originally posted by c1steve:
The ship turned amazingly fast, I have not seen a container ship turn like that before. A single screw vessel would have a slight tendency to turn in one direction, but nothing like the video shows.
It is possible that the autopilot system malfunctioned, and caused the boat to turn sharply. Other possibility is sabotage.
They dropped one of their anchors as discussed in the video I posted on the previous page.
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March 26, 2024, 11:47 AM
V-Tailquote:
Originally posted by spunk639:
Does the Port of Baltimore require Harbor Pilots?
Per an earlier post in this thread, there were
two pilots on board.
הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים March 26, 2024, 11:58 AM
92fstechquote:
Originally posted by MikeinNC:
Thanks for the insight.
March 26, 2024, 12:05 PM
6gunsRegarding emergency steering, there are hand hydraulic pumps built into the system which would be used before any kind of block and tackle rigs. However, it's a very slow process as you can imagine.
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March 26, 2024, 12:05 PM
ChuckFinleyReports are coming out that because a mayday was sounded the traffic was in the process of being reduced onto the bridge. I am engaging in conjecture but I would not think that that would have provided time to realize that there were also work crews on the bridge and to get word to them for them to evacuate.
Perhaps once this is repaired they will extend the tug-escort protocols for this harbor (?)
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March 26, 2024, 12:28 PM
wcb6092Ship cited for previous propulsion deficiency before Francis Scott Key Bridge crash, crashed in 2016
https://nypost.com/2024/03/26/...ort-authorities-say/The container ship that apparently lost power and then smashed into Baltimore’s Francis Scott Key Bridge was cited last year for a “deficiency” with its propulsion.
The M/V Dali also crashed while leaving the Port of Antwerp in 2016.
Across 27 inspections conducted since the Dali was built in 2015, two “deficiencies” were flagged, according to records from the Electronic Quality Shipping Information System (Equasis) viewed by CNN.
Chilean authorities gave the Dali a “deficiency” for “propulsion and auxiliary machinery — gauges, thermometers, etc,” in June 2023, according to Equasis records.
More at link
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