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I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
posted
Townhall.com
Bruce Bialosky

At times it seems that America is at war with itself. This has been going on for many years, only temporarily interrupted in the aftermath of 9/11. Even that national harmony only lasted so long, but the question is: Why are we so divided?

The thought really came into focus while I was sitting in my Rabbi’s office. I brought with me three people well-versed on gun operation and ownership. The idea was to have an event entitled “Why I am a Jewish Gun Owner.” This was in answer to having had two Parkland students speak at our Shabbat services about their experience during the murderous rampage by a deranged young man.

Based on all of our experiences we had the thought that the clear majority of the people we know who don’t own guns don’t know people who own guns. These people have never shot a gun and don’t interact with people who have. They don’t make the effort to understand why someone owns guns, yet they vote to restrict gun owners’ rights.

One of the gentlemen who came to the meeting works for a veterans’ group. As things go in a meeting like this -- even with our best efforts – one’s mind can drift off in thought about something not directly related to the matter at hand. It occurred to me I really do not know anyone who is a veteran (one of the rabbis at the meeting happened to be).

We are living in a different time in America that has not occurred for many generations. On January 27, 1973, the military draft ended, and a divide happened in our country that grew and grew and grew.

When I grew up everyone knew veterans of the armed services. My father was a tank commander in Patton’s army. As I grew older the World War II veterans started to die off, then the Korean War veterans started to and then the Viet Nam veterans did as well. My generation came at the tail-end of Viet Nam and none of the people I knew were part of the Armed Services.

Since the 1970’s and the advent of the volunteer army, the people who served largely came from different communities. I met some Vets at college because I went to San Diego State where the military was heavily represented, but as I entered the business world my interaction became more limited.

Israel does not have this divide as virtually everyone serves in the military. They all understand the sacrifices. How does one understand the sacrifices and the importance of the military if it is foreign to you?

This divide became even more prevalent with a major social event that happened recently. That was when an estimated 4,000 Google employees signed a petition stating that Google should have 'a clear policy stating that neither Google nor its contractors will ever build warfare technology.’ My friend, Dennis Prager, wrote an excellent column about this issue.

I have met a couple people who work for Google, but I do not know any of the people who signed this petition. I can surmise though that likely few of them have any interaction with people who have military experience. They most likely went through school without any instructors who had military experience or friends with military experience.

Think about it: when in the history of this country have the employees of a major company asked their bosses not to do work for the military that is essential to keep this country protected in a dangerous world? If someone has an example, please let me know because I am guessing the answer is never. Not only that, they are urging other tech companies to stay away from helping our military develop these technologies.

These kind of divides do not shock me. I am a pro-choice with caveats Republican. Being in the Republican party I have often spoken to pro-life individuals and had in-depth conversations with them about their beliefs. When speaking to my pro-choice friends, they have rarely if ever engaged a pro-life person to solicit their viewpoint.

We have people in this country who are so far from each other and never interact. How many people personally know a cop? Not many in my community. I have a friend who is a volunteer sheriff. If people do not know individuals who are police, military, gun owners or pro-life, and have never tried to engage and/or become sympathetic or empathetic to their beliefs, how would they ever understand their way of thinking?

These are the real divides in our country. A lot of it is manifested in the differences between the coasts and the rest of the country, but we are living in different universes and that may be the first time it has ever happened in America.

This is why we have a real divide in our country.

Link




Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
 
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
delicately calloused
Picture of darthfuster
posted Hide Post
I disagree. If I understand his point, it is that we do not expose ourselves to the thoughts and ideology of the other side. I think it is because one side is selfish, emmotive and immoral. I have listened to their beliefs. I have watched their behavior. I have examined their principles. I cannot be part of it. That is the divide.



You’re a lying dog-faced pony soldier
 
Posts: 30153 | Location: Norris Lake, TN | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of konata88
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But WHY do we have the divide? What is, for example, resulting in the other side to be selfish and immoral (while believing the opposite?)?




"Wrong does not cease to be wrong because the majority share in it." L.Tolstoy
"A government is just a body of people, usually, notably, ungoverned." Shepherd Book
 
Posts: 13367 | Location: In the gilded cage | Registered: December 09, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Gracie Allen is my
personal savior!
posted Hide Post
^^^ A deep-seated (if vague, or even wrong) belief that the other side is fundamentally wrong tends to make a great excuse for ignoring the details that don't lend themselves to whatever you want to believe. Remember being a teenager?
 
Posts: 27322 | Location: Deep in the heart of the brush country, and closing on that #&*%!?! roadrunner. Really. | Registered: February 05, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Be Careful What You Wish For...
Picture of Monk
posted Hide Post
We have a divide because we've allowed the left to flourish unchecked.


____________________________________________________________

Georgeair: "...looking around my house this morning, it's not easily defended for long by two people in the event of real anarchy. The entryways might be slick for the latecomers though...."
 
Posts: 11865 | Location: Hoisting the colors in a strange land | Registered: February 09, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
I think the divide has to do with people not appreciating how exceptional our country is.
 
Posts: 958 | Registered: October 07, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
delicately calloused
Picture of darthfuster
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by Il Cattivo:
^^^ A deep-seated (if vague, or even wrong) belief that the other side is fundamentally wrong tends to make a great excuse for ignoring the details that don't lend themselves to whatever you want to believe. Remember being a teenager?


That describes me. Except my belief is not vague nor wrong. I know it is immoral to take what one has earned and give to another without an equitable and voluntary transfer of value. The other side advocates for that. I know it is immoral to attenuate the rights and liberties of the moral and innocent. The other side is driven by collective condemnation. I know it is immoral to raise generations of youth indoctrinated with lies and ignorant of truth and education. The other side has captivated the education system and culture to destroy our future. I know it's immoral to create a tyrannical and unaccountable gov't and bureaucracy. The other side is all about that. I know it is immoral to oppress a race of humanity. The other side did that and then blames our side. I know it is immoral to send pallets of cash to a terrorist State. The other side does not. I know it is immoral to murder the helpless and innocent. The other side refuses those definitions to continue advocating a monstrous policy and make other innocents pay for it. I know it is immoral to lie.

I cannot be part of the other side. As long as it exists and I am alive, there will be a division.



You’re a lying dog-faced pony soldier
 
Posts: 30153 | Location: Norris Lake, TN | Registered: May 07, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
posted Hide Post
The gift of certainty must be a gift beyond price.




Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
 
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ammoholic
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by JALLEN:
The gift of certainty must be a gift beyond price.

Is it part of the training of a lawyer to attempt to see an issue from all sides? It sometimes seems that (as much fun as it is to badmouth attorneys) attorneys have an increasingly uncommon ability to look at an issue and see more than one side to it. I wish that this ability were more present in the general population, but it seems to be getting less so.
 
Posts: 7299 | Location: Lost, but making time. | Registered: February 23, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by slosig:
quote:
Originally posted by JALLEN:
The gift of certainty must be a gift beyond price.

Is it part of the training of a lawyer to attempt to see an issue from all sides? It sometimes seems that (as much fun as it is to badmouth attorneys) attorneys have an increasingly uncommon ability to look at an issue and see more than one side to it. I wish that this ability were more present in the general population, but it seems to be getting less so.


Very interesting questions, indeed.

It is not expressly part of training, but more likely a natural unavoidable consequence. It is essential to analyze all sides, formulate an argument that best uses the evidence to support a position, or recognize when the evidence does not. Then, too, a lawyer is arguing his clients case, not necessarily what he believes or prefers.

One should be able, and prepared, to debate either side, just like formal debates used to be, maybe still are.

The broader problem is that human organizations, families, tribes, countries, usually feature a certain body of fundamental principles on which there is near unanimous agreement, what language will we use, what do words mean, what observances, manners are required, favored, what taboos will we insist upon, often religion influenced. Peterson talks a lot about these things, order (things that are known, familiar, relied upon) and chaos (things which aren’t). Diversity is contra to this, and may be what is behind a lot of the weird stuff us older types are suffering.




Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
 
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
posted Hide Post
We have reached a point in out history where our differences have caused us to think the worst of our fellow citizens. We no longer know our neighbors. And don't want to. And what contributes to this? Our friends in media. The constant bombardment of "if it bleeds it leads" stories brings right into your living room a wide variety of horror stories that encourage isolation. How many times have you seen a news report where after some horrific event, a scared neighbor is interviewed who said "He / she lived quietly". I recently read a headline on one of the NOLA news channels that read "Severed cat head found on sidewalk in XXX". If that doesn't turn you off to folks in that neighborhood, what would?
We have met the enemy, and he is us. And TV covered it.


End of Earth: 2 Miles
Upper Peninsula: 4 Miles
 
Posts: 16666 | Location: Marquette MI | Registered: July 08, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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