SIGforum
The Colorado Initiative and Referendum Process; A Life Lesson for the Entire Country
August 29, 2026, 11:53 AM
TMatsThe Colorado Initiative and Referendum Process; A Life Lesson for the Entire Country
Colorado’s wolf reintroduction has been a disaster from the start, and now another wolf had to be put down for killing cattle. It seems like every few weeks there’s another problem, livestock killed, wolves relocated, wolves removed, and ranchers left dealing with the consequences. The people who wanted this voted it in from the cities, while the people living in rural Colorado are the ones who actually have to live with it.
If nothing else, this whole mess is a pretty good reminder of why the Electoral College exists. Population centers shouldn’t get to dictate how everyone else has to live.— Stephen Ziegler
Outdoor writer | Rack Junkies Podcast
Emphasis mine. The Dems want the Electoral College gone, and the ability to amend the Constitution at will. BTW, Colorado's I&R process allows for citizen efforts to add or subtract from their state constitution.
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despite them
August 29, 2026, 12:00 PM
DoctorSoloThey have used that process to force all kinds of bullshit down our throats, like the plastic bag insanity. We are being held hostage by liberal arts indoctrinated assholes.
I hate this state government more than words can express.
August 29, 2026, 12:17 PM
sandman76quote:
Originally posted by DoctorSolo:
They have used that process to force all kinds of bullshit down our throats, like the plastic bag insanity. We are being held hostage by liberal arts indoctrinated assholes.
I hate this state government more than words can express.
You sir, have taken the words right out of my mouth.
Embarrassment and disgust have taken the place of pride of living in this state.
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“There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the universe, and it has a longer shelf life.”
― Frank Zappa
August 29, 2026, 12:22 PM
Gustoferquote:
Originally posted by TMats:
Colorado’s wolf reintroduction has been a disaster from the start,
Not just wolves and not just Colorado. Reintroduction/relocation has been a disaster everywhere it has been done. There was a reason why they got rid of them 100+ years ago. We've now got grizzlies, wolves, and cats where they have never been. You've really got to keep your head on a swivel out in the woods these days or you'll end up as lunch.
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It is long past time for a Convention of States. The Founding Fathers gave us this tool to fix an out of control government and we need to use it.
August 29, 2026, 12:51 PM
TMatsquote:
Originally posted by Gustofer:
quote:
Originally posted by TMats:
Colorado’s wolf reintroduction has been a disaster from the start,
Not just wolves and not just Colorado. Reintroduction/relocation has been a disaster everywhere it has been done. There was a reason why they got rid of them 100+ years ago. We've now got grizzlies, wolves, and cats where they have never been. You've really got to keep your head on a swivel out in the woods these days or you'll end up as lunch.
I get your point, Gus, but this is not a case of
Same, same, all same. Wyoming held out when neighboring Idaho and Montana initiated designated hunting seasons in an attempt to limit wolf population growth. “Nope,” Wyoming said, “we’ll manage wolves outside of the primary introduction area (the GYE), as predators and allow them to be eliminated without restriction everywhere in Wyoming outside that area.”
This has caused more than a few wolf lovers in Colorado to bemoan the fact that their wolves can, and do, cross into Wyoming, where they can be eliminated.
Grizzlies are a whole ‘nother smoke. USFWS has stated for years that the population has recovered, and that they should be delisted. Politics and judicial activism rears its ugly head. They need to be shot at and to, once again, learn to fear humans.
I don’t know about cats, but yeah, incidents appear to be up.
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despite them
August 29, 2026, 01:05 PM
sig2392I am not an environmental biologist; if you are, chime in.
My understanding is that reintroducing wolves into Yellowstone National Park was considered a big success.
Here is the timeline.
This is an interesting documentary.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4K15lYKAB8https://greateryellowstone.org...-wolf-reintroduction.
I am also not a rancher. I understand their dislike of wolves.
August 29, 2026, 01:10 PM
sig2392quote:
Originally posted by sig2392:
I am not an environmental biologist; if you are, chime in.
My understanding is that reintroducing wolves into Yellowstone National Park was considered a big success.
Here is the timeline.
https://greateryellowstone.org...-wolf-reintroduction.
This is an interesting documentary; this is the trailer.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4K15lYKAB8I am also not a rancher. I understand their dislike of wolves.
August 29, 2026, 01:16 PM
TMatsI’ve seen several articles touting wolves as the Jesus Christ of the Yellowstone Ecosystem. The willows thrive, the beaver are building dams, the elk held in check. I keep returning to this quote, often attributed to former Chief of the Forest Service, Jack Ward Thomas (actually Frank Edwin Egler).
Nature Is Not More Complicated Than You Think, It Is More Complicated Than You CAN Think.
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despite them
August 29, 2026, 01:41 PM
Biker_dudeI worked in kalifornia for a few years and learned that their tree huggers want humankind eradicated so that the spirits that live in the rocks, trees and bear scat can return.
It's an indian pantheistic thing. A forestry ranger in the PNW planted some hair from an endangered critter with the intent of having that area declared a sanctuary. He got caught but his intent made the papers.
They say what they say, but their intent is to return the nation back to an uninhabitable wilderness. And they're getting funding from somebody for all these nuisance environmental lawsuits. New refineries, water reservoirs, desalinization, nuclear power. All obstructed by dark money funding the environazis.
August 29, 2026, 02:25 PM
Fly-Sigquote:
Originally posted by TMats:
I’ve seen several articles touting wolves as the Jesus Christ of the Yellowstone Ecosystem. The willows thrive, the beaver are building dams, the elk held in check. I keep returning to this quote, often attributed to former Chief of the Forest Service, Jack Ward Thomas (actually Frank Edwin Egler).
Nature Is Not More Complicated Than You Think, It Is More Complicated Than You CAN Think.
There are 2 evolutionary biologists who frequently say on their podcast that there is a big difference between
complicated and
complex, and biological systems are
complex. Which is what your quote gets at, that humans cannot understand how the whole thing works.
Remove wolves and the system changes substantially. Reintroduce wolves, and it changes again.
The other thing they frequently say is that everything biology is a tradeoff.
August 29, 2026, 03:06 PM
TMatsquote:
Originally posted by Fly-Sig:
quote:
Originally posted by TMats:
I’ve seen several articles touting wolves as the Jesus Christ of the Yellowstone Ecosystem. The willows thrive, the beaver are building dams, the elk held in check. I keep returning to this quote, often attributed to former Chief of the Forest Service, Jack Ward Thomas (actually Frank Edwin Egler).
Nature Is Not More Complicated Than You Think, It Is More Complicated Than You CAN Think.
There are 2 evolutionary biologists who frequently say on their podcast that there is a big difference between
complicated and
complex, and biological systems are
complex. Which is what your quote gets at, that humans cannot understand how the whole thing works.
Remove wolves and the system changes substantially. Reintroduce wolves, and it changes again.
The other thing they frequently say is that everything biology is a tradeoff.
I’ll add, the difference between the Jack Ward Thomas quote and Egler’s is that Thomas substituted “ecosystems” for nature, and I actually prefer that version.
I’ll also re-emphasize what I wrote in the OP. I was struck by both angles of the quoted post. First, managing wildlife by the initiative and referendum process, directly impacting friends I made on Colorado's Western Slope. Second, as pointed out, the larger issue of the effort to dismantle the Electoral College. I don't want to be governed by 5 population centers.
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despite them
August 29, 2026, 03:17 PM
GustoferWe've got the Initiative/Referndum process up here as well and I don't care for it. It's given us everything from abortions to pot dispensaries on ever other corner.
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It is long past time for a Convention of States. The Founding Fathers gave us this tool to fix an out of control government and we need to use it.
August 29, 2026, 03:53 PM
FredwardLiberals refuse to understand predators of any type.
August 31, 2026, 09:13 AM
sourdough44I’m rather familiar with the wolves in the U.P. Of MI, N Wisconsin. One thing I mildly envy is a legal season like they have out West, MT, ID, WY in particular. There was a short period 10+ years ago, WI & then a very watered down season in MI. For whatever reason, the left goes judge shopping to find a court to put things on hold.
Alliances have been organized, the tribes have joined the left to call the wolves ‘sacred’. It’s all political.
After that we end up at the ‘social carrying capacity’, wolves just quietly disappear. Wolf tracks, scat & sign are very common, NW U.P..
The moose numbers are in a long term decline, same as MN. Most deer are around the town edges. At least deer hunting brings in some $$, less than decades ago.
The elk herd in CO is big business, very big. Any wolves won’t bring in a fraction of that $$. Yes I realize, the leftist don’t care about that.