If you have older vehicles, go ahead and have your brake system flushed. I flushed two of my vehicles today using a pressure feed system from the master cylinder, and the old fluid was orange colored (corrosion) and smelled funky. Fresh brake fluid has a distinctive but fresh smell that's easily recognized, old brake fluid has a slightly (or worse) rancid smell and will be darker in color, ranging from orange to brown to black.

My point though is older vehicles have older technology in the metallurgy of their hard brake lines and internal brake control and proportioning components, and my guess is they corrode faster than newer vehicles.

My F150 was flushed at a shop 3 years ago, and today when I flushed it, the fluid was orange and smelled funky. If the car was a newer model, I imagine the brake fluid would have lasted longer than 3 years for this level of contamination, but being a 2010 model, this is not the case for my model.

If your car is new and you plan on keeping it more than five years or so, I'd recommend you flush it at that point, and every two or three years afterwards as long as you keep it.

If you're a DIY driveway mechanic and enjoy doing work like that, the gear needed to pressure flush from the master cylinder is not expensive, and will save you about $350 per visit to the shop for this procedure.

It's amazing how long you can keep a car if you maintain all the normal systems, and all the other (very) important systems most everyone ignores like brake flushes, transmission flushes, power steering flushes, and cooling system flushes.

If you do these "other" flushes along with changing oil (full synthetic) every 5k or so, proper brake service including quality brake pads and cleaning/re-greasing the slide pins etc., changing out your plugs, running fuel system cleaners through your tank, changing your air filter, and cleaning your MAF and throttle body on a schedule, your car will go much farther, run much smoother, and run much more reliably than than you would otherwise imagine.

You don't have to buy a new car as often as you would think, but if you're a DIY driveway mechanic, I believe these procedures pay off in the long run.

Of course after a certain amount of time, even these procedures have their limitation. I have one vehicle like that, which is 24 years old now. I have done all these things, but when something big gives up the ghost, it's going to the junkyard, so my recommendations only go so far.

Anyway after today's maintenance exercise, I thought you guys who like doing your own work on vehicles, if you want to step up your game, I've had very good success with this approach over time, saved god only knows how many thousands of dollars in shop costs, have not had a car payment in more than 30 years, and never break down.

Of course there are limits. If I want to drive out of state or take a longer trip, I may rent a vehicle, but for stomping around within one or two day's drive, this has worked for me.

This whole post suggests you're not driving an expensive sports car or a truly high performance machine. I don't have those kinds of skills or budget, but for daily drivers this is a good way to ride.

I bought a pressure pot style bleeder. A guy can do it all by himself. Did all of my older vehicles. This is good advice and thanks for the reminder.

100% agree!

Then there is the “Turkey baster” method. Actually much better than nothing if done thoroughly… once a month for three consecutive months.

I advise non mechanically inclined friends and family to at least have a complete flush done with every brake job. One local shop charges an extra 1/2 hour labor to do it then vs just bleeding the brakes.

quote:

Originally posted by wrightd:


It's amazing how long you can keep a car if you maintain all the normal systems, and all the other (very) important systems most everyone ignores like brake flushes, transmission flushes, power steering flushes, and cooling system flushes.

If you do these "other" flushes along with changing oil (full synthetic) every 5k or so, proper brake service including quality brake pads and cleaning/re-greasing the slide pins etc., changing out your plugs, running fuel system cleaners through your tank, changing your air filter, and cleaning your MAF and throttle body on a schedule, your car will go much farther, run much smoother, and run much more reliably than than you would imagine.

A great reminder, but don't forget rear differential fluid & transfer case fluid for rear or 4wd vehicles. This is often overlooked.

Also consider having the rubber hoses that link the hard system to the caliper replaced at that time. They swell up on the inside and restrict the caliper from moving freely. I think this is of particular concern in the release movement. Which can cause brake drag, diminished gas mileage and increased pad wear.

I have a hand vacuum pump that works good, but I was having other
preventive maintenance done so I had the shop do it. Brake fluid is
hydroscopic so good to replace. Peace of mind.
I made a list of everything I wanted done including new belts and hoses.
He called me and said if he puts aftermarket on like Gates, they would be
inferior to the OEM's. The factory parts were in good shape. I bought Gates all my life, he said their not the same.
So many companies have cheapened their products over the years. It's nice to have a shop owner you can trust.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Also consider having the rubber hoses that link the hard system to the caliper replaced at that time. They swell up on the inside and restrict the caliper from moving freely. I think this is of particular concern in the release movement. Which can cause brake drag, diminished gas mileage and increased pad wear.

I had that happen! Took a long time to figure that one out. I also had a local garage flush the radiator and Tranny. I got hosed big time! They charged me more than the local Ford dealer. Never went back.

I checked this out on a dozen You tubes,
Three say one thing,
Another three say something else and then you watch too many and
I got all confused.

Some want you to purchase stuff others say take it to a guy,
And still more say you can't trust other people.

I drive a 2004 buick and other than tires and air shocks
Nothing has been a big concern.

Thanks for filling in the blanks guys. To summarise in addition to my OP post:

Turkey Baster to get the bulk out
Fill up with fresh, then pressure or vacuum complete system, pressure it better than vacuum. darthfuster is right about using a pressure system from the master cylinder, it's actually easier than pulling a vacuum from each cylinder, and faster, and cleaner, and less chance of unintentinally adding air to the system. And those manual pressure tools are NOT expensive.
And r0gue is right about the soft hoses that connect your hard lines to the calipers. They degrade naturally over time. If they're old just replace them. Not because they may burst, but because over time they naturally deteriorate AND delaminate. It happend to me on two of my vehicles. I have replaced all soft brake lines on 3 of my 4 old cars. I use the "Motive Products" brand pressure equipment. It's NOT expensive, but there are other equally good brands, MityVac pressure bleed equipment comes to mind.

for pressure bleed equipment, if the brand you use don't have pressure caps to fit your paticular master cylinder, you can jury rig caps from other brands, or make your own, like I did for my Nissan Xterra, which used multiple cap specifications sort of randomly, and NOONE makes a cap to fit that can be assured to fit your paticular car, so I made my own, and it holds 15 lbs of pressure without leaking, which is about the ideal avg pressure you want to use for pressure bleeding.

3 best things you can do to extend vehicle life - change oil and filter every 5000 miles, and change brake fluid and coolant every 3 years.

I bought a MOTIV kit for my last BMW. It works with my current BMW. It's only 4 years old and I just broke 50k miles. I just did rear pads and rotors at 50k. I'm probably due for front brake stuff before winter. I'm planning on doing brake fluid flush then.

Yup… just had mine flushed at 30k on my 2020 Ram 1500. My old 2004 F150 I think only got flushed once or twice 165k miles. I didnt have any issues, but I learned quite a bit about preventative maintenance since then.

quote:

Originally posted by Tgrshrk99:


3 best things you can do to extend vehicle life - change oil and filter every 5000 miles

That’s outdated info

Most modern synthetic oils can go 7,500-10,000 miles. I’ve even seen 15,000 mile oil change intervals on some cars.

Any/all fluids are subject to contamination and breakdown.

All synthetic, organic, fluid, compound or component, seals, gaskets, sealants as well as any or every metal component,are subject to degradation from a myriad of substances, temperatures, physical properties and interactions with others, and physical/mechanical/temperatures/environmental interactions will result in adverse conditions that compromise the system.

Or to say in "layman's terms", everything will turn to shit, eventually.

There is no "one size fits all", or any " do this in every event".

One must know the parameters for each and every system that applies, then act accordingly.

Failures and disappointment are realized as a result of expecting a specific
outcome from random set of input, to a reality unknown.

Those that know, know.

Those that do not, are frustrated.

Burma Shave.

Just did the whole flush a couple months ago.
I have check valve Speed Bleeders on all my calipers. Just crack the bleeder open and pump the pedal a bunch of times until it comes out clean while topping off. repeat for the other 3 and done.

I don't know any manufacturer that recommends "flushing" anything. Drain and then refill is all that is needed.

Ad hoc "flushing" methods are just cost-adds by shops and can cause damage if done incorrectly. Japanese cars usually recommend brake fluid replacement every so often. Like 60K miles to avoid water contamination over time.

My Honda tells me what service it needs and when it needs it. I tell the dealer to do exactly what the car says. Last time they gave me a "should change the coolant since it's over 60K miles". No the service manual says change at 100K and the car will tell me when it is needed.

quote:

Originally posted by Lefty Sig:
I don't know any manufacturer that recommends "flushing" anything. Drain and then refill is all that is needed.

That's basically what everyone is referring to when flushing the brakes- draining out the old and refiling with new.

quote:

Originally posted by PASig:

quote:

Originally posted by Tgrshrk99:


3 best things you can do to extend vehicle life - change oil and filter every 5000 miles

That’s outdated info

Most modern synthetic oils can go 7,500-10,000 miles. I’ve even seen 15,000 mile oil change intervals on some cars.

True, but not preferable for keeping a car with good performance and durability for a long time. Yes synthetics don't break down as fast dino oil, and modern additive technology can be pretty good compared to previous generation motor oils, but 10k and 15k drain intervals are not ideal, especially if any city driving is involved. But if you're going to use extended drain intervals, you would want to use the best synthetic oil money can buy. Overall that strategy doesn't compute for me. Better to buy a mid level or better synthetic oil and change it between 5-6k, IF you want to get lots of miles from your vehicles. Just because the manufacturer SAYS you're good with 10-15k drain intervals, that's not based on anything to do with the health and performance of the vehicle. Those same manufacturers also say the tranny fluid is good for the life of the vehicle, which is deceptive and wrong for all the wrong reasons.