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semi-reformed sailor |
So my big kid bought a 1950 home. It has an add on that was built around the 80's ish... I'm trying to replace all the outlets so they are white vs. ivory. I know they all work as we have used them to run extension cords to other areas of the house. the first one away from the switches has a GFI button on it and then there is an exterior outlet and then three more outlets.... Yesterday, I'm pulling out a random outlet to replace it and there is a red messenger leading out of the black side of the outlet and going who knows where and why... Why would an outlet have a messenger...? It was raining yesterday and I think the GFI was tripping and causing the others downstream to not work as I couldn't get the little doo dad I have to see if it's hot to beep...strange things are afoot. This circuit is wired out of the exterior power box and has its own 20 breaker (which was not tripped). I crawled under the house and the romex goes to where the switch would be and then the wires are buried in the wall. It only runs 5 outlets and a light on the outside door. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | ||
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| Member |
Two ideas on the GFI- It could be going bad and needs to be replaced. Rather sensitive, they seem to have shorter life spans than most 110v electrical equipment. There might be a poor connection in the circuit, causing connections/disconnections and resulting in tripping of the GFI. Going through replacing outlets might solve the problem. The red wire is a puzzle. Disconnecting it may tell you what it is supposed to do. Then you could rewire it correctly. Others might have better ideas. | |||
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| semi-reformed sailor |
Thanks, I was gonna pull the messenger and see what it was really powering... And I think the GFI is bad....it looks old...and it may be what's causing the rest of the outlets to not work yesterday. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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Itchy was taken |
The red one could be a traveler in a 3 way circuit. _________________ This space left intentionally blank. | |||
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Ammoholic |
Compare the left side of outlet to right side. If there is a piece of metal missing on right (hot) side then it's a half switched outlet. As far as outlets not working. Mark wires on the line side of outlet, remove it, then bypass with wire nuts, if it works, you need new GFI. When you reinstall it make sure to hook up marked wiring to line side or it will not work. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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| semi-reformed sailor |
That is what I have been able to find on the internet, yet there are only 5 outlets and one outside lamp (with one switch)..so I have no idea what it was going to...I'm gonna pull it and see what doesn't work or maybe someone buried something in the wall and left it sealed with a wire nut
Thank you! That is the kinda help I need. So simple I hadn't thought of it. And cheaper than buying a new one if it's still good. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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| Ammoholic |
Can't think of any other reason for a red wire to be hooked up to an outlet if it's not switched. Sometimes people will use three wire just because they have it. You mentioned only one switch in the room for an outdoor fixture, right? By code you need a switched outlet or light fixture when you enter the room. Something is odd here. Check the switch and see if there is a red wire in there. Sometimes people change switched plugs and don't realize it was switched. Maybe the old homeowner swapped it and forgot to break the tab between the screws. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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| Member |
But he would have a switch somewhere in the room other than the one that he mentioned for the exterior light. | |||
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| Ammoholic |
That's what is strange. He should have a switch entering the room from house and from exterior. If done to code, he should have three switches. It's possible there was a stack switch wherever his exterior fixture switch is that was removed. This is the reason I would check to see if there is a red wire where the switch is. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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| semi-reformed sailor |
Good to know, It makes sense but I don't know if there was a permit even pulled for the sun room. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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Member |
Just a WAG. You said the red is connected to the black side. Does this mean the power in side of the GFIC? Could the red wire bypass the outside and go straight to outlet #3? Like somebody wanted to run a freezer in that room and didn’t want it GFIC protected, but did want to maintain the protection for the exterior circuit. Where did the red wire reappear? Demand not that events should happen as you wish; but wish them to happen as they do happen, and you will go on well. -Epictetus | |||
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| semi-reformed sailor |
NO the GFI outlet is not the one with the red messenger.. so as you enter the room from the dining room (clockwise) there is a: switch-turns on the fan/lamp switch-for maybe outside flood light , doesnt' work so I don't know. GFI outlet exterior outlet outlet (one with the red messenger) door to outside exterior lamp that does work switch for this exterior lamp- no red wire outlet outlet outlet outlet I'll be back there on Sat and will pull all the outlets and see where the red wire goes..and I guess I need a bulb for the flood lamp to see if it works.... (sorry guys for the confusion-I did have a stroke and sometimes I don't express myself well) "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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