A question for the hive:

Both my '68 and my '77 have Edelbrock carbs on them. I've noticed that when I let them set for more than a few days, it takes about 20-30 seconds of cranking and pumping to get them to fire up.

Investigating this, one reason I found is that when carbureted vehicles sit without running, the gas in the bowls evaporates and it takes some cranking to fill them up before it'll fire.
Apparently when these vehicles were popular, gas had additives in it to prevent it from evaporating and those additives are no longer there.

Has anyone else experienced this? If so, how'd you fix it? Is there an additive that a fella could buy OTC to mix in that would prevent this evaporation?

It's not really a big deal, I guess...just kind of annoying.

ETA: I only run ethanol free gas in them, so it wouldn't be anything related to the corn juice.

Not sure if this would help prevent evaporation but Mechanic in a Bottle gets a good review for carbureted engines - at least for mowers, blowers, and such. Might be worth a try -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MmKSrkHjojc

Good thought, but AI says it doesn't do anything regarding evaporation.

The Ford FE engines will get carbon deposits on the back of the valves that soak up the fuel before it reaches the cylinder. Once the carbon is saturated it fires up.
Run some GM top engine cleaner through it, poured in slowly while running hot, get it to stall, then let it sit overnight.
The ethanol garbage fuel doesn't help matters any.
I sold my 77, had trouble starting it after it sat but the fuel in the tank wasn't in good condition either, If I drove it pretty much every week it was ok.
Just can't keep the old stuff sitting, The newer cars hold up better with the fuel system being pretty much sealed.

first step non ethanol fuel which you say you are doing. second step real gasoline appropriate for the era. Not sure what you have access to locally, and how many gallons you burn. But I would be using race gas in the appropriate type and then I think your issue would be gone.

quote:

Originally posted by rizzle:
The Ford FE engines will get carbon deposits on the back of the valves that soak up the fuel before it reaches the cylinder.

I did see that that was one possibility, but a rather big job to get someone to clean them out. I figured I'd start with something simple if it's available, and hopefully that'll solve the issue.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:
second step real gasoline appropriate for the era.

No leaded gas around unfortunately. Just regular unleaded and ethanol free.

Local airport should have 100 octane leaded. Expensive, illegal and a pain to acquire. Like most good things....

OZ

quote:

No leaded gas around unfortunately.

I'm 100% sure there is a local source for race gas. See the VP website, and in any case you can have it shipped to you.

I wonder if adding Techron fuel additive every month would help. I now have been doing it on my 23 year old truck for almost a year and I am seeing a real difference. I wish I had started added the fuel additive every month as soon as I bought it.

My wife just got a new vehicle and I am adding the fuel additive every month with her new vehicle and will keep doing it. I am sure it will make a difference.

quote:

Originally posted by hrcjon:

quote:

No leaded gas around unfortunately.

I'm 100% sure there is a local source for race gas. See the VP website, and in any case you can have it shipped to you.

^^^^^ This.

I doubt there is any solution in a bottle

Those have to be aftermarket performance oriented carbs correct? Likely they are less conducive to the easier start-up after sitting than the OEM stuff. Not just the carbs themselves, but also the air cleaner set-up you may have on them now.

What's your choke set-up? That would be my first guess (You don't mention how they run after they get going). Ages ago, I had a 440 with a Hollie 750 double-pumper. It ran like a scolded dog, but would not start unless the [manual] choke was just right.

When it is stone cold in this scenario you describe; get under the hood and hit the throttle once (Like the first pump with the gas pedal) Do you see/hear the classic fog/sound/jet of fuel going into the throat?

Do you still have just the mechanical fuel pump? How old is it? Maybe its drain back properties are not working and fuel is leaking down from the carb/bowl. You could try an electric fuel pump to prime things.

^^^. Automatic chokes on both. Unfortunately. And they run like a top once started. No issues there.

Yep, both mechanical fuel pumps. I did read of one guy on a Ford forum this evening who put an electric pump in between the tank and the mechanical one to prime as you say and it solved his (same) problem. Seems like a lot to go through for a minor inconvenience.

You'd think that whatever the additive was that they used to put in would still be available somewhere.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:
^^^. Automatic chokes on both. Unfortunately. And they run like a top once started. No issues there.

Yep, both mechanical fuel pumps. I did read of one guy on a Ford forum this evening who put an electric pump in between the tank and the mechanical one to prime as you say and it solved his (same) problem. Seems like a lot to go through for a minor inconvenience.

You'd think that whatever the additive was that they used to put in would still be available somewhere.

I worked on those for a living when they were only a couple years old. back East in the rust belt, most were gone after 5 or 6 years.
They used the trucks back then, pretty much every day. If anything with a carb and mechanical pump sat for more than a couple of weeks you would have to crank it for some time. There were no additives, I mentioned the carbon issue because it added to the problem, if you have any blue smoke on startup, oil runs down the valve guides, which also added to the problem.
I got rid of mine because the more it sat, the more issues it started having, they bring very good money right now.

After 50+ years of "classic" vehicles, I went with fuel injection and have almost no issues.

Gas is shit, and unpredictable.

Yes, the upfront cost is spendy, but the elimination of many problems of jumping in a vehicle, turning the key and getting some asphalt therapy is worth the money spent.

Life it too short to fight, and push against all we used to take for granted, decaying before our eyes.

It's like trying to grab a handful of water only to open an empty hand...


Unless you are "daily driving", you will have problems trying to run old iron if is sits around for weeks or months.

quote:

Originally posted by rizzle:
...back East in the rust belt, most were gone after 5 or 6 years.

Ain't that the truth.

I bought a Chicago truck (another '77) from my uncle in '85. I couldn't wash it as the dirt and mud was the only thing holding it together. . Great truck though. Put a lot of miles on that thing.

quote:

Originally posted by sigmonkey:
Life it too short to fight, and push against all we used to take for granted, decaying before our eyes.

True. They're fun though. I enjoy working on them and opening the hood, looking down, and being able to see the ground. Anything more complicated than changing the oil on my Powerstroke and it goes into the shop. Most things on these old ones I can fix in my own shop. And, I feel like a kid again hopping in, putting the top down, and going for a cruise.

Gustofpher: I have a 79 Chevy C10. It has a 454 in it along with High performance Edelbrock Manifold and Carburetor. Very similar to your set up. It also has a mechanical fuel pump but I have a manual choke.

And yeah, I have to pump the crap out of it as well, It's just the nature of the beast. I have yet to find any additives that actually help. I do run 89 octane only in it.

What I do is pump the pedal maybe 10-12 times with a full choke hit it and release and then just let her set for a minute. Hit it again with half choke or no choke and see what happens. She will usually kick over.

I'm with sigmonkey, all my classics are fuel injected now. Edlebroc, Holley and A few others make direct replacements that bolt on just like the carb. You will have to add high pressure fuel pumps. But you know the rule. Buy once and cry once. It's worth it.

Tommy

No additive will stop fundamental fuel evaporation. Fuel additives are very low treat rate, and are most often combinations of solvents and detergents. Basic convenience store gas is typically at the lowest additive concentration, the registered minimum that meets EPA requirements. This is often less than 75 pounds of additive per one thousand barrels of gasoline, or about 200 ppm.

Off the shelf additives are majority simple solvents with some small amount of detergents.