quote:

Seriously, who does that?

I do, for one. I do not trust e-file, too many things to go wrong, plus why should I freely give my financial information to a tax prep. software company, and whoever compromises their system? I do stand in line to get a hand stamp cancellation, at least once in the past few years the clerk didn't understand my request, and had to call their supervisor.

Last couple of years, the wife has actually mailed the returns, she drives right by a regional hub PO on her way to and from work. She does not bother to get a hand stamp, just sticks the envelope in the drop off box.

My biggest issue with the IRS is that, if they know how much I owe, then why do I have to fill out return? Yes, I know it is to get my sworn statement so they can threaten jail if they find something wrong, but really?

Imagine how much easier it would be if they just sent a bill!

quote:

My biggest issue with the IRS is that, if they know how much I owe, then why do I have to fill out return?

I don't believe they do. For example, they don't know the amount of a stock basis prior to 2011. If you sell your home, they don't know the basis or the improvements you've put into the house. I'm sure there are many more examples.

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
This is only an issue if you are simply dropping your tax forms in the mail. Seriously, who does that?

A lot more people may be doing it in the future because the IRS has eliminated their free direct online filing program, that was previously used by millions of taxpayers.

I still mail checks. I bought a bunch of forever stamps 5 years ago and a bunch of checks. So I will use them up.

Electric company wants to charge me $1.25 to do an online payment? Bam, check and stamp go into an envelope.

I mail checks for my quarterly estimated tax payments. Maybe I should switch to electronic bank transfer.

quote:

Originally posted by architect:

quote:

Seriously, who does that?

I do, for one. I do not trust e-file, too many things to go wrong, plus why should I freely give my financial information to a tax prep. software company, and whoever compromises their system?

If you don't use tax prep. software, how do you do your taxes?
I can remember going to the library to get all of the forms... and doing it by hand.
But I stopped doing that a long time ago.
Besides, my schedule D was like 10 pages...

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
You missed one criteria.Older people who are still working are required to use the technology whether they like it or not.

That varies greatly from industry to industry.

There are undoubtedly a great number of older folks who had to continue to adapt to using modern technology due to their work requirements.

But others didn't.

I personally know or have professionaly dealt with quite a few 60/70/80 year olds who never learned to use computers, or their computer knowledge was so limited that they just preferred to do things manually. This means they either worked in an industry where it wasn't needed, or else their jobs provided crutches for them while they were working.

For example, a number of the older (now retired) cops I know or knew of never or rarely used computers in their job. Even once computers became prevalent in law enforcement, their agencies provided workarounds for them. Things like providing clerks to transcribe their handwritten reports into computerized form (or allowing them to record audio reports that were then transcribed), allowing them to continue to write paper citations even once electronic citations had rolled out, dispatch running all of their vehicle/ID checks for them rather than using a laptop to run them themselves, having to ask others for help when they needed to run something down in an electronic database, important emails being read/shown to them by a supervisor or printed out for them and taped to their lockers since they never checked their own department emails (or never had one), supervisors having to enter their electronic time cards for them, etc.

Once some of the mandatory training became computerized, a training instructor (sometimes me) was tasked with sitting with them through it, to show them how to use the mouse to click on the buttons to advance the training, and how to answer the computerized tests.

They worked in an industry that became increasingly computer-reliant, but yet were allowed to limp along without having to use them until they retired.

While most of the guys like that have retired over the past couple decades, there's one remaining guy I personally know who is still in this boat, but he'll be retiring within a year. Still working as a cop in 2026. Still can't use a computer.

Or for another example, the contracted head of maintenance where I work now doesn't use computers. Once all of his weekly/monthly reports and parts/materials ordering became computerized, his company hired someone specifically to do all of that for him. Because while he doesn't know how to use a computer, he's been around so long that he knows the maintenance and repair of a 1970s-era building and its ancient boilers and chillers backwards and forward.

He's still working. But still doesn't know how to use a computer.

Similar stories for a number of other older workers I know or know of who don't use computers, or use them very little.

So still being in the workforce isn't a guarantee that someone will be tech-savvy.

I might imagine some older folks simply gathering up all their paperwork and heading to an H&R Block office.

I gather up all of my paperwork and head to my CPA like I have done for many decades. Then I hand carry everything to the post office and get it mailed. Old way.....yep, but it still works for me.

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
The need to write/send a check is NOT a prerequisite/all defining circumstance to mailing a tax return. You 'can' pay electronically and still be required to mail documents when filing a return, or filing an extension. In certain circumstances, such as when filing an Amended Return/1040X, you are required to file by mail. Late returns (regardless of whether payment is due or will result in a refund) after a certain time, also must be filed by mail. All of these situations/examples 'can' require a postmark by a certain deadline to avoid penalties.

It's not always the pejorative "old folks" group, some people just don't want anyone to have electronic bank access to their accounts, period. Could be they were hacked at some point and money stolen, or a family member friend, or maybe they just prefer hard paper documents and checks.

Doesn't make them any more wrong, than they probably think about someone who's open to full bank account electronic access, government or otherwise.

Age has nothing to do with it, nor does intelligence, ability, tech savvy nothing...

quote:

Originally posted by braillediver:
Looks like a cluster fuck for Mail In Ballots.

No those have magical powers. Heck, some of those got post marked before they were even officially sent out.

I’m certainly in the older person camp. But one of my chief recreations is writing computer programs.

When I buy a Kindle book I sometimes see “Updating your Kindle experience” before the book is downloaded. In January one of those updates installed a bug on my Kindle.

I thought it might be fixed fairly soon, but it wasn’t. So a few days ago I wrote a snobol4 program to deal with it. It worked perfectly. Then I wrote a bash script that serves as a preprocessor for my program.

I’m currently writing another bash script that will serve as a postprocessor.

Those will continue to work whether or not the Kindle bug is fixed.

quote:

Similar stories for a number of other older workers I know or know of who don't use computers, or use them very little.

So still being in the workforce isn't a guarantee that someone will be tech-savvy.

^^^^^^^^^^^
I think you are missing the point here and are guilty of ageism. Not wanting to learn technology has to do with rigid personality traits and an unwilingness to learn new things. You might be interested to know that I work with quite a few 20 somethings who are comoputer illiterate.

quote:

... that I work with quite a few 20 somethings who are comoputer illiterate.

Last "check I wrote" was in the late 90s, and in dog years, I'm dead.

I recently stopped using my Credit Union "Bill Pay by Check", where I submit the batch, and they send paper checks, as it was costing me $5 a month for the "convenience", and I have various "direct pay" options I use with Credit Card, that I have good control over, and are protected/insured by the Credit Union.

SO, I would say my "reluctance" to move to "electronic/automated", was based some on "architect's" premise (being I know the processes and the risks of such payment systems) and my information being in yet another database, as well as I want to know when I need to or am spending a penny nickel, as well as ZMSMICHAEL's mention of "reluctance".

But, I do keep a manual ledger (spreadsheet) and track everything that I have and it goes back to 2008. (I retired the previous one back to 92 and prior was hand written ledger).

"Old people" thing is about as accurate a statement as "Black People can't get an ID", such a thing is a stereotype and may have a have a little basis in truth, but it is a stretch to think that all old people are two steps away from the Le Brea Tar Pits...

Besides. AI is gonna fix everything.

Interesting topic. I'm in the old guy group (79 in a few months) and pretty much agree with ROGUE on this one. This has been my experience with computers. Bear in mind...your mileage may vary.

I was born and raised in Washington state, lived there for 50 years. I spent 30 years working in the Title Insurance field in downtown Seattle. In the late 70's the company I worked for decided it would be a good idea to "computerize" all the property records of King County. The big boss hired 4 or 5 people to handle this transition and asked me to help them when I could. Yup, it was DOS based with the 5 inch floppies.

In the mid 80's Bill Gates and Paul Allen changed the universe with Windows. I bought my first home computer somewhere in the early 90's and never looked back. Everyone I knew had a computer by the late 90's, and I mean everyone.

The wife and I semi-retired and moved back here to the midwest around 2000. I married into a big family and not a single one of them had a computer, let alone know how to use one. I could only guess that this was a regional thing. Not a one of the older members of this group ever had a computer. They pretty much are all dead now, but their kids were completely different. They all had cell phones and most had a computer at home.

I have two granddaughters. One 5 and the other is 13. They both are very competent with cell phones when they can get their hands on one. When my 13 year old was around 8 she taught herself how to use her grandmothers computer and now at 13 she is a computer guru.

Where am I going with all of this? Not sure, but I'm thinking those living in or near large metropolitan areas were much more computer savvy versus those living elsewhere. Today? Maybe it's just the opposite.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
I think you are missing the point here and are guilty of ageism.

And I think you are missing my point, and are guilty of assuming I'm speaking in all-encompasing generalizations, or harboring some malice towards older people.

I'm not saying all 60+ people write and mail checks (or can't use computers as the thread has derailed into).

Instead, as I've already stayed previously, my point is the vast majority of those who write and mail checks (and can't use computers) are older (60+).

Which unfortunately adds to them being some of the primary targets/victims of things like financial fraud, something I deal with regularly.

It's not an "I hate old people" thing. It's an "I see this happening to them all the time" thing.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:

one criteria

"One criteria?" Nope. "Criteria" is plural. The singular is "criterion."

I have an "account" with EFTPS, which is being phased out this year. I've used it to make quarterly and final tax year payments for several years. To set this up I had to have a Login.gov account.
A few month ago I set up an ID.me account with the Feds, and my social security and IRS account are now linked to it. I can make quarterly payments and view tax return data for many prior years, as well as payments made in prior years. Yeah, I had to input my Chase Bank account information...but really....the government has all this anyway. I'm not crazy about them having access, but it's not new. The convenience factor is off the charts for me as I have a very wealthy cousin who I am POA and trustee for, and she inherited from her direct family and has multiple entities that have to make payments. Our little town's post office gets backed up at times and I have no interest in standing in line there to get postmarks or registered/return receipts. I'm a boomer, but I still like this online system.

One of my firm's owners can talk to you about mailing checks. Many have mentioned her over the years the increased risk of that over e-payments of any type, he got to experience it last tax season. I'm with the monkey - I just don't use physical checks unless absolutely necessary.

Check stolen once the packet was already in the postal system, looks like it was in our regional hub. Doofus tried to cash that, got nabbed.

Of course that account information had also already been sold/posted and he started having forged/replicated check attempts bouncing up all over, outside of the state. Correct routing and account number with random check numbers to avoid duplicate flags. Fortunately he had immediately frozen/replaced the account beforehand and wasn't impacted, but for those that think this sort of impact is super-duper spy-novel stuff, it happens.

There are many ways to deal with the postmark if you're so inclined.
Hand cancelling, pay the tiny fee for "proof of mailing form', etc.
I'm in the 70+ category and I haven't physically visited my local bank branch in close to a decade, not even the drive through or ATM.
This is like hearing the people complain that providing an ID to vote is such a big problem.
You can make it a problem if you feel "offended" our you can accept that time moves on and a tiny change that most consider to be for the better.