Thanks everyone so it is just not Florida.

my wife is starting her 33rd year of teaching high school science. She usually spends about $500 a year on classroom supplies since she has to buy what she needs for labs. Some of it goes for students who can't afford food when they go on field trips.

As far as time worked, her school starts at 7:20 and she is at school by 6:45 AM and home at 4 PM. Then she grades papers, writes lesson plans and answers students and parents emails and texts. Weekends usually are reserved for grading labs and projects. When school is in we go out to dinner about once a month because she has so much school work to do.

Also she has enough continuing education hours that are required to complete another degree. These are in addition to everything else. Right now during her so called vacation she is at school writing curricullum. We figure she works the equivalent of 14 months.

My sister just retired after teaching 3rd grade in Florida for 35 years. She spent a lot more on basic supplies such as pencils and paper than my wife.

Shoevb has it accurately stated in my experience.
The wife of a close friend teaches in a local public school and this describes her life about 99%. She also teaches summer school, which adds a few more weeks of kids over the summer. Not sure if that is remedial schooling or not.
Additionally, in PA public schools there is a requirement for the teachers to have their own “continuing education”. This equates to additional college credits every few years or the option of losing your teaching certification. So beyond teaching, doing school work at home (unseen by all but the spouses), dealing with hostile parents, spoiled children, administrations that want everyone to pass, “required” curriculum (ie the pc indoctrination part) and taking and passing classes themselves, the teacher has a pretty full plate.
Add to that the idea that some students for various reasons are “underprivileged” (due to skin color?) and the teacher should therefore be a little easy on their grading.
Now, have I experienced all of this? While I have not taught summer school, I am a retired teacher and at one time or another, yes I have.
My continuing education classes? The option is to direct them toward a degree or just collect credits. In my experience the teacher gets to choose which path to take. I now have three degrees.

I suspect it's like many other occupations.
There are some who really put their heart and soul into being a great teacher and just have something special that makes them great at their job.
There are a lot of others that are just average, whatever that is, and it's just a job.
Think back to your school years, how many do you remember as being special and that you can remember something they taught to you that has been of great value later in life?
I had a few and I am thankful for them, but a number that were there mostly putting in their time and didn't help provide much motivation.

My wife and I were both school teachers for about 10 years before I moved on to teach university (finished my PhD) and she decided to homeschool the girls.

I taught High School Social Sciences and intro to Computer Programming. I did all my grading on my planning period, and some at night. Yes, I worked a few weeks in the summer working up my curriculum for the coming year but it was a good life. I also coached baseball. Damn I miss coaching baseball.

I would not wish what my wife went through on anyone. She taught elementary, most of the time she did not get a planning period, or had to watch another class. She graded into the evening every night and most weekends.

Regarding supplies, I decorated my classroom with history stuff, and one wall was usually mountain bike posters. (I hate motivational posters). I spent $0 on it, and just managed the 'homeroom' supplies. I also had a $400 budget that I usually spent on maps and other cool things we used every year.

There are a lot of kids out there who school is there safe space, the only place they get food, etc. They have no money for supplies etc. Just visit a school system in Appalachia and you will see real poverty.

My point is, yes some teachers are overworked, and under funded. others not so much so.

quote:

Originally posted by Jelly:
When I was in school in the 60s and 70s only thing we needed was a Pee chee with some notebook paper and some pencils with eraser and crayons only in 1st - 3rd.

About 10 years ago a local news station got a call from a local sanitation engineer at the end of a school year. He showed them dumpsters full of new and some used little donated school supplies. Apparently he saw it many times at the end of each school year

Yep, I don’t recall a thing we had to bring except pencils/pens etc. All else was supplied, if I remember correctly. I went to school in PA 60-70s, average classroom size about 25 kids, graduating class had about 350.

I always shake my head at this "teacher has to buy students their school supplies" As a retired LEO, I never had to buy my pistol, ballistic vest, patrol car, etc. Yes I know many agencies are different. As a Teacher, which I respect, you become a teacher and go teach. Same with me. I am an LEO and I went and did the job. YES, I wanted extra stuff, new boots, different holster, different gun, etc., but I had to buy it. I didn't ask friends for money or complain I couldn't do my job.

If the school cant supply the kids with what they need in the classroom, then I kind of have to take a hard line and say "tough" Maybe they can cut administrator salaries OR have less administrators and use the money for what it was intended for, the kids. How many of your schools have multiple Principals and Vice Principals? Shouldn't one of each be enough?

Sorry just my 2-cents.

quote:

Originally posted by 220-9er:
I suspect it's like many other occupations.
There are some who really put their heart and soul into being a great teacher and just have something special that makes them great at their job.
There are a lot of others that are just average, whatever that is, and it's just a job.
Think back to your school years, how many do you remember as being special and that you can remember something they taught to you that has been of great value later in life?
I had a few and I am thankful for them, but a number that were there mostly putting in their time and didn't help provide much motivation.

I had 3 who were memorable, the rest were somewhere between adequate and lousy.

A 7th Grade Science teacher called Mrs. Knight. She got me out of my boredom and made me a performer and after I did that, got me into Advanced Classes where I belonged and where I actually learned something.

A 9th Grade Algebra teacher called Mr. Beecher. He spent the first 2 weeks of class teaching us how to do math in our heads. It was probably the single most valuable skill I ever learned in school.

A 12th Grade English teacher named Dr. Pietan. He understood that I'd already read every book we were supposed to read that year and gave me something else to do. Having a mother who's an English teacher gives you a certain edge.

In my own classroom experience much of what becomes “classroom supplies” is administration dependent. I’ve worked under admin that had no idea what a budget was so naturally these folks engaged in cost shifting to the point of requiring copier paper, dry erase markers, and etc. be added to the list of school supplies. My last principal knew how to budget so the supply list was short and easy for parents/guardians to cover.

One trick that I learned was at the end of the school year to collect school supplies that students just left behind. Many of these items were unused.

Silent

In Florida there are "X" amount of dollars allocated per student in the district. In my county it is about $9,000 per student. Here it is about $8,000 from the state and $1,000 from the federal government. Most of our tax dollars go for capital improvement and salaries. Some tax dollars are earmarked for capital expenditures, and some are earmarked for operational costs. Expendables are low on the priority list, and there usually is not enough to purchase expendables for every student. Some believe if your kid is going to consume it, parents should provide it. Kids are asked to bring notebooks, pens and pencils, reams of copier paper, etc. There are a number of charitable organizations that raise money and supplies to offset those costs, especially for the disadvantaged, and I have not seen anything on the list they are asked to bring that is cost prohibitive. They had a way of discreetly getting supplies to disadvantaged families without embarrassing them. Even so, when my daughter was a HS teacher, she always dipped into her pocket for some supplies that were not available otherwise. As she said, some of these kids can't even afford the clothes they are wearing, let alone extras.

We Americans pay the most in the world per student for education, yet our students place close to 30th in the world.

That’s before the two-year Covid gap that no one’s making up all that money. Hundreds of billions went to the teachers union.

I had a lot of old timers... just putting in time. Taught off years old lesson plans and could grade the tests in seconds while watching TV because they used years old test as well that they knew from memory.

They never came in early or stayed late, rather I had a couple that came in late and left early to make up for it

As for 9 months pay... EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. knew ahead of time it was a part time job they had chosen as a career way before hand. Many actually love that aspect of the job.

My brother is a retired life long teacher who worked to pay his own way through college. He had all the degrees required to earn the max possible pay rate for a Tn public school teacher and retired with full pay and medical. I never heard him complain about the job... EVER.

The system is corrupt and a lot of parents simply don't give a damn.

How "disadvantaged" do you have to be to not be able to afford your kids' Elmer's glue? They can damn sure afford their pack-a-day habit and their tattoos, though, so at least they've got their priorities straight.

Is teaching itself tough? Probably but I'm willing to bet what's tougher is dealing with shit head parents who raise shit kids who yell at you, curse at you and sometimes physically assault you. I'm not a teacher and never could do it because the minute that little shit curses at me, I'm gonna choke slam him.

I bet the administrators are making money. That's probably why you see a decent number of PhDs in education offered online. Gotta hustle that quick buck you know.

My sister is a teacher, she taught summer school this past summer and said she started with 2 kids and it went down to 1 kid. Said it was so boring. Only money she spends out of pocket is designing her classroom the way she wants it.

When I was a kid, we just brought our own supplies and a box of tissue to share as classroom use. Our supply list was pretty small as well.

My wife is a teacher for 26 years and I work in her high school district as a substitute for the last 6. We have to be in school at 7:15 and get out at 2:15. I have never seen my wife leave school before 5:00pm, and in her early years it was not uncommon for her to stay until 8:00pm. Summer she writes curriculum and makes up tests for students that believe they can skip Algebra I and go straight to Algebra II. She does get paid for that.

The only money my wife puts out is to decorate her classroom, mainly math posters and some decorations. Students need to have their own note books and pencils. The district supplies everything else. Calculators are also needed and the lower income students are given them by the district for the year. Lower income students are also feed breakfast and lunch even in the summer months.
This fall all students in our district (county vocational high schools -7) will get chrome books.
Out of the 7 vocational schools, 3 are full time academies that the students test to get in. The other 4 are share time meaning you will have two 3 hour classes for things like auto shop, electric, and traditional trades. The schools we work in are all day students, the Law Enforcement Academy the students wear uniforms like cadets. Again, if they can't afford uniforms, the district buys them for them.

While we make a living, South Jersey pay is very low compared to North Jersey pay. It is like we live in two different states.

My perspective based on schools I see, and from talking to friends and family who have been teachers: the school system is overfunded. Teachers (the good ones) are underpaid relative to the value they provide to society; the bad ones are dead weight.

There is no reason for a teacher to have to spend out of pocket. The system is corrupt in not providing sufficient budget / petty cash system. It's like a poorly run charity where a majority of available funds don't flow through to the objective but gets funneled to various overhead. The pensions seem exceptional though.

quote:

Originally posted by SIGnified:
We Americans pay the most in the world per student for education, yet our students place close to 30th in the world.

That’s before the two-year Covid gap that no one’s making up all that money. Hundreds of billions went to the teachers union.

I blame a lot of issues on the teachers union. Politically, they are extremely powerful in our state government.

To answer a point made by urban warrior -

Sometimes one principal or vice principal is not enough.

I worked in a city district here in PA some years ago. Middle school shop teacher. 2,000 kids in that building. The administration essentially split it into two schools in one building. Still, one principal and vice principal for 1,000 students was stretching it a bit.

Granted, from the outside school districts seem to be top heavy with administration.

The teachers at my sons' elementary school absolutely bought supplies for students, as well as students bringing in their own supplies. Not hundreds a month, more like $200 for the school year. This is because some students had parents who were: 1) poor, 2) shitty, or 3) just dense as donuts. The teachers didn't want to put the burden of bad parenting/bad circumstances on the kids, so they bought stuff to cover the cost of that. My wife and I helped in each of the classes for that. Both kids in middle school now and, for whatever reason, most of this has stopped.

I know that the PTS helps some teachers with this, or at least our PTA did since my wife and I were on it for almost all of the eight years our sons were at the elementary school. However, that isn't always the case. And I know that our PTA was excellent, but that is NOT the case in every elementary school in the Tacoma School District.

My daughter recently graduated from college with honors, Summa Cum Laude.
This week she will be starting to teach middle school math and science.

She has purchased many school supplies along with setting up her classroom which included purchasing paint along with other items. (Although, pretty sure my wife paid for the paint.)

She painted the room real nice along with replacing the small American flag posted in front of the class by the white board with an appropriate one, the size of which was displayed in school when I was a kid.

She is a conservative who will be teaching the three R’s, reading righting, & rythmatic.