This happened a few years ago. I knew the guy who was shot and worked with him way back. Someone just recently brought this up to me again and thought I'd share with the forum. Very sad situation. Seems like he had a lot of issues that led up to this. It does seem to be a valid self defense shooting.

http://www.tbo.com/list/milita...over-death-20151202/


By Howard Altman | Times Staff Writer Howard Altman on Google+ Published: December 2, 2015Updated: December 3, 2015 at 06:59 AM
TAMPA — At the kitchen table of their brother’s South Tampa apartment, Nate and Hannah Fager smiled through pain as they shared their memories of him — Timothy Isaac Martin, a former Navy SEAL, military contractor, champion athlete, class clown and doting dad.

The siblings, along with their mother and other family members, came to Tampa when they heard the news that Martin was shot early Sunday morning at a South Tampa restaurant and bar, SoHo Backyard.

He died the next day at 37, his organs harvested so others might live.

“He was a good man,” said Hannah Fager, 33, sitting with her siblings among photos of Martin and his 4-year-old son Rocco. “He was a man of integrity.”

The Fager siblings, part of a blended bunch of 13 children, some adopted, recalled growing up so poor that they relied on donated food and Christmas gifts from strangers. They moved a lot before settling down in a small town in Wisconsin.

They recalled how Martin, a man of many passions, spent nearly four years studying to become a priest, only to join the Navy and become a SEAL. And how he left the SEALs in 2007, in part because he could not kill. And how Martin spent time overseas as a contractor, earning the kind of money he never knew growing up, and sharing as much as he could with those he loved.

They also remembered how Martin was proud, but not boastful, at serving as an advisor and making an appearance in the films, “Green Zone,” and “Zero Dark Thirty.”

But they also shared their frustration, eager to learn more about how and why their brother, unarmed, was shot by Jeffrey Glenn, the bar’s co-owner. Police say the two men were fighting when Glenn went to grab his gun.

“It all goes back that if you were afraid and were threatened by him, why did not you report it?” said Hannah Fager, a sales manager in Milwaukee. “Why not get a restraining order?”

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Shortly after 2:30 a.m. Sunday, police were called to the SoHo Backyard at 610 S. Armenia Ave. about a shooting.

Glenn made the call, police said.

The first officers on the scene found Martin on the ground inside the porch area at the entrance of the bar, according to a police affidavit for a search warrant.

There were two other people in the bar, one without a shirt, according to the affidavit.

“We were in a fight and I shot him,” said a man later identified as Jeffrey Glenn. “Don’t you see my shirt out front?”

Officers asked Glenn where the gun was, and he told them it was inside. Police walked into the front of the bar and saw a black semi-automatic hand gun on the bar just inside the front door.

A red shirt was found on the ground just outside the porch entrance and a fragment of matching red cloth was found in the parking lot.

Tampa Fire Rescue responded and transported Martin to Tampa General Hospital with a single gunshot wound to the head. He was in critical condition and was expected to die.

Police are investigating, said spokesman Steve Hegarty, trying to determine whether a crime was committed or whether the use of force was justified as self-defense or under Florida’s stand your ground law. The case will be turned over to the State Attorney’s Office.

Glenn has declined comment and could not be reached Wednesday.

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Kevin Lacz, who spent eight years as a SEAL, remembers Martin from the grueling training course they went through together in 2003, known as Basic Underwater Demolition/SEALS or BUD/S.

“He was literally like a freak of nature when it came to SEAL training,” said Lacz, who went on to serve on SEAL Team 3 with the late Chris Kyle, author of the best-seller “American Sniper.” “Tim was good at anything he does. Myself, and others were envious at his God-given ability to make BUD/S look easy.”

Lacz remembers Martin as “an honest person, a good Christian man who spent 3.5 years studying to be pastor, then wanted to join the Navy. He had a good moral compass on him, that directed him in other parts of life.”

The two lost touch then a few years back rekindled their friendship.

“I do not know what transpired or what led up to it or what kinds of things Tim was dealing with. The important thing for people to know is the integrity of the man.”

The greatest loss will be felt by Martin’s son, Lacz said.

“He is going to grow up without his daddy.”

❖ ❖ ❖

Shortly before the birth of Martin’s son, Scott Mann, a retired Army lieutenant colonel, recalls having a serious conversation with Martin in Afghanistan.

Mann, who helped created the Village Stability Operations program designed to build up the Afghan Local Police and teach them how to protect their villages, had been working with Martin for a few years and was concerned about how much time he was spending away from his family. Martin was working as a contractor for U.S. Special Operations Command’s lessons learned program.

“He was one of better lessons learned collectors,” Mann said. “He got out there, had great relations with the teams. He really had a good sense of what was going on with the VSO and I put a lot of stock in him.”

Mann said the two became close.

“I was more like a surrogate dad. He was a tormented guy. He stayed over there way too long.”

On his Linkedin page, Martin said that he had been overseas 44 out of 55 months between December 2007 and May 2012.

“I can remember having a conversation with him, while he was still married, and his son was about to be born. When he told me how long he had been in country, my jaw dropped. I just remember saying, you’ve got to go home. You have to get your life going. Get back to the family, back to your son.’”

Martin tried, Mann said.

“But it all fell apart. The marriage fell apart. He fell off the grid and I am kicking myself. This should not happen.”

It is a story too common among people who served overseas, Mann said.

“This is a real problem simmering in our warrior class right now that no one is tending to. Tim is a casualty of war and no one is going to convince me otherwise.”

❖ ❖ ❖

Nate and Hannah Fager say they are not bitter.

“We are a Christian family and we are not holding a grudge,” Nate Fager said. “We are forgiving. We just want justice.”

As wonderful and loving as their brother was, the siblings say, since he returned from Afghanistan several years ago, things changed for Martin.

Nate asked him if he had post traumatic stress disorder.

“He said ‘everyone over there has PTSD, we’re all stressed.”

Said Hannah, “Every day their lives are on the line.”

There were other problems. Martin struggled financially after leaving the world of military contracting. His marriage to Brenda Martin ended in divorce in 2012 and the two were still battling in court, according to records. Martin had a court appearance coming in January.

There was also a temporary domestic-violence injunction issued against Martin last year at the request of his ex-wife, lasting about a month.

He was forced to turn in his Sig Sauer 1911 and P229 handguns and a Panther Arms AR-15 rifle. The injunction was eventually dropped and the guns were returned.

For the past few months, Martin worked as co-studio manager at Yogani yoga studio in South Tampa, seeking to heal himself, and help veterans, said Annie Okerlin, the studio owner.

Both Mann and the siblings say they want to gather memories from those who knew Martin so gthey can give young Rocco something to remember about his father other than his death.

Mann plans a short video and will mention Martin in his new book, “Mission America.”

“Rocco needs to know that his dad’s passion for life, and experience in life and enjoyment of life was something he wanted to pass on to his son,” Nate Fager said. “He took his son kayaking and boating and wanted him to experience as much life as he did, in the full way he experienced it.”

So far, Rocco has not been told about his father’s death, Martin’s siblings said.

He is with his mother.

“I can’t imagine how difficult it is to tell your 4-year-old son,” Hannah Fager said.

❖ ❖ ❖

To help Rocco remember his father, Hannah Fager had a casting made of Martin’s right hand, as well as a thumb print.

She also had an impression made of his closed fist, which she will keep for her self.

“To remind me of how he was the protector.”

A public viewing is scheduled 5 p.m. to 8 p.m. Friday at MacDonald Funeral Home, 10520 N. Florida Ave., Tampa. Another public visitation is 10 a.m. Saturday at the Northdale Lutheran Church, 15709 Mapledale Blvd., Tampa. A memorial service will be held there at 11 a.m., followed by a lunch.

There are plans to spread Martin’s ashes at sea next Veteran’s Day weekend during the annual gathering of Navy SEALs, Frogmen and Underwater Demolition Team members in Fort Pierce, birthplace of the SEALs’s forerunners and home of the SEALS museum, said Dan O’Shea, a former Navy SEAL commander who has been helping the family.

The Special Operations community has been a steady presence for the family, with SEALs, Army Rangers and others coming into Tampa as news spread about the shooting.

“We have been overwhelmed by the response from the special operations community,” Nate Fager said.

Added Hannah Fager, “One guy is flying 27 hours to get here for the service.”

haltman@tampatrib.com

(813) 259-7629

@haltman

Maybe it's me but that article was tough to follow.

quote:

Originally posted by Dead_Eye:
Maybe it's me but that article was tough to follow.

I gave up half way through.

So the former seal, who left the service because he decided he was not capable of killing someone, attacked someone in a bar...and got himself shot?

Is that what happened? I may be confused...

This is confusing, but especially for a couple of things.

I understand the whole “Once a Marine, always a Marine” view toward former members of the armed forces; more than once I’ve used the “I will always be a soldier” line myself. I believe, however, that there are limits to who deserve such honors. I’ve never heard the “always a Marine” description applied to the likes of the men who killed JFK or mass murdered random victims from atop the Texas Tower, or that the man who killed the five Dallas police officers recently was still a soldier. The guy in this story didn’t do anything close to those horrific crimes, but he first became a SEAL and then decided he couldn’t kill anyone—? And then he gets into bar fights? Okay, I’ve known other conscientious objectors who came to that realization after joining the military services, but once someone says, “I don’t want to be a SEAL because I’m opposed to what they do,” I believe we should honor his request and not consider him to be one anymore.

It also wasn’t clear to me from the article that it was a righteous self-defense killing. Did I miss something that said it was more than a fight between two men that resulted in the shooting?

"Why not get a restraining order?"

"Why didn't he just shoot him in the leg? He din't have to kill him!""

"He ain't had to shoot nobody. My SEAL dindunuffin wrong!"

All the same shit to me. Blame the victim.

Better article with actual information here:

http://www.tampabay.com/news/p...als-shooting/2283742

quote:

TAMPA —A former Navy SEAL who was fatally shot in November at a South Tampa restaurant last November had a history of erratic and threatening behavior toward others, according to records released this week from the State Attorney's Office.

Prosecutors determined manager Jeffrey Glenn acted in self-defense under Florida's "stand your ground" law when he shot and killed Timothy Martin, 37, at the SoHo Backyard, according to a June 24 letter from the office to Tampa police Chief Eric Ward.

The fatal argument between Martin and Glenn was about Glenn's relationship with a restaurant bartender who was Martin's former girlfriend, according to the three-page letter.

Thanks for posting the more clear article. Only after I read it again, did I realize it's a bit long and a bit unclear.

Sad story all the way around.

I wish 'the system' could have done more for him.

I am thinking we should look at how long individual SF guys are deployed ... but a lot of his deployment time was as a contractor it sounds like so it was on him.

I feel for his family.

-----------------------------------

quote:

Originally posted by a1abdj:

quote:

TAMPA —A former Navy SEAL who was fatally shot in November at a South Tampa restaurant last November had a history of erratic and threatening behavior toward others, according to records released this week from the State Attorney's Office.

Prosecutors determined manager Jeffrey Glenn acted in self-defense under Florida's "stand your ground" law when he shot and killed Timothy Martin, 37, at the SoHo Backyard, according to a June 24 letter from the office to Tampa police Chief Eric Ward.

The fatal argument between Martin and Glenn was about Glenn's relationship with a restaurant bartender who was Martin's former girlfriend, according to the three-page letter.

Pity, but from the sound of it, justified.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:
This is confusing, but especially for a couple of things.

I understand the whole “Once a Marine, always a Marine” view toward former members of the armed forces; more than once I’ve used the “I will always be a soldier” line myself. I believe, however, that there are limits to who deserve such honors. I’ve never heard the “always a Marine” description applied to the likes of the men who killed JFK or mass murdered random victims from atop the Texas Tower, or that the man who killed the five Dallas police officers recently was still a soldier. The guy in this story didn’t do anything close to those horrific crimes, but he first became a SEAL and then decided he couldn’t kill anyone—? And then he gets into bar fights? Okay, I’ve known other conscientious objectors who came to that realization after joining the military services, but once someone says, “I don’t want to be a SEAL because I’m opposed to what they do,” I believe we should honor his request and not consider him to be one anymore.

It also wasn’t clear to me from the article that it was a righteous self-defense killing. Did I miss something that said it was more than a fight between two men that resulted in the shooting?

100% agree with you. SEALs are popular now and so I think people love to romanticize them no matter what while forgetting that SEALs (an all members of the military) are still just people and are not perfect. This article was heavy on romanticizing the man and light on facts.