There's an area in my house where the light gets turned on and left on for long periods when not needed.

I want to replace the standard light switch with a motion activated switch. Reading the specs for these, it is not clear to me whether these are compatible with magnetic ballast fluorescent fixtures. The location has a two-tube T12 fixture, 48" lamps.

If it makes any difference, the switch will be programmed for "vacancy mode" -- that's manual on, with auto off after a timed interval with no motion detected.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail

If it makes any difference, the switch will be programmed for "vacancy mode" -- that's manual on, with auto off after a timed interval with no motion detected.

Can't help with the ballast question, but with the timing issue I can offer the following:

Not sure what the range is on the typical motion sensor switch. We have them in our pantry and walk in closet. No issue in the pantry as it's typcally in and out. In the closet however, it frequently 'times out' and leaves us in the dark. We have to wave our hands around to turn the lights back on. I guess the small movements of rearranging shelves isn't enough motion and they time out. Something to keep in mind. We have considered extending the time they stay on, but then the 85% percent of the time we won't need them to stay on would be a waste.

First I can't resist saying it's time for new bulbs. Secondly, I did have a motion switch on a fixture with 2 T12's at work and it worked fine. I eventually changed the bulbs out to ballast bypass LED's and it still works fine. Just a standard Leviton motion switch from Depot.

Any modern occupancy switches will be fine for ballast controlled fixtures.

Why in the world would you use that setup thoug. What you are looking for is a countdown timer. Press on and it counts down from 5min to hour or two.

If you want something that utilizes an occ sensor, then do like I do for my laundry room. Auto on when I enter five minutes countdown to off.

Walk in with laundry basket in hand the light turns on, bring fresh laundry basket upstairs, lights turn off after 5 minutes.

I'd highly recommend replacing the t12 with led fixture, or if there's a ceiling repair needed and you don't want to do that replace the lamps with 120v direct wire LEDs. This will get rid of annoying buzzing sound, make you occ sensor happier, and save electricity.

quote:

Originally posted by Skins2881:

If you want something that utilizes an occ sensor, then do like I do for my laundry room. Auto on when I enter five minutes countdown to off.

Walk in with laundry basket in hand the light turns on, bring fresh laundry basket upstairs, lights turn off after 5 minutes.

I'd highly recommend replacing the t12 with led fixture, or if there's a ceiling repair needed and you don't want to do that replace the lamps with 120v direct wire LEDs. This will get rid of annoying buzzing sound, make you occ sensor happier, and save electricity.

Do not want auto on. This is for a vanity area, between our bedroom and the bathroom. Definitely do not want the light to turn automatically on every time somebody passes through the area, especially if one of us (wife or me) gets up to pee in the middle of the night. Don't want that light to come on and wake the other person.

The switch is currently manual on, manual off. Not a burden to turn it on manually, but one member of the household turns it on when using the area, then walks away without turning it off, so what I want is auto-off when no motion is detected for a timed period. The motion activated switches that I have looked at can be set to auto-on & auto-off, or manual on and auto-off (which is what I want).

As far as replacing the T12 fluorescents with LED tubes, yes, that's a good idea and I have considered it. Simple to do, and ten years ago I could have done it easily. Now, at 87 with really bad balance, I am not going to get up on a ladder or step stool to do this, and at this point it's not worth paying an electrician to come in and do it.

You will never receive a payback on the LED conversion, or the switch if you're paying for the electrician, but if you're paying him for the switch the same standard 1hr charge should cover switch replacement and light replacement/retrofit. The benefit is light quality and sound, not completely payback period.

That being said keeping the existing light as is, my recommendation stays the same, you need a countdown switch.

Something like this is a better fit for your need. Typically the big button is setable for favorite countdown (5 or 10 typical). The you use other buttons control extended or reduced countdown.

quote:

Originally posted by Skins2881:

You will never receive a payback on the LED conversion, or the switch if you're paying for the electrician, but if you're paying him for the switch the same standard 1hr charge should cover switch replacement and light replacement/retrofit.

Yeah, I've already gone through that thought process, but I don't need to pay anybody to replace the switch, that doesn't require me to risk a fall from a ladder or step stool. I just don't feel that working on an overhead light fixture is worth the risk for me, and I don't want to pay somebody to come in and do it at this time.

On a separate note, I've been looking at my driving pattern, and I'm starting to think about an EV or PHEV. If I do either of those, it will require a visit from an electrician for a 240V charging outlet and that would be the time to change T12 fixture(s) to LED without incurring an additional trip charge.

Yep do it while they are there for a project and they will likely do it for free if you give them Pepsi and pizza at lunch.

EV charger is new technology, but the wiring for it is nothing new (especially at home) where no charging pedestal is needed.

If you have garage AND panel in garage it should be ~$3-400 for installation if you provide charger, cord, and outlet. If it's across the house or you need driveway pedestal cost can skyrocket.

V-Tail, the Lutron brand motion sensors are listed on their package to work with all lamp types. Not remembering the current requirements for 4 ft fixtures I would use the 5 amp one rather than the 2 amp one. hope this helps.

quote:

Originally posted by sig operator:
V-Tail, the Lutron brand motion sensors are listed on their package to work with all lamp types. Not remembering the current requirements for 4 ft fixtures I would use the 5 amp one rather than the 2 amp one. hope this helps.

Two T12 lamps @ 40 watts each should draw less than one amp, ¿si?

Run one in the pantry it has flouresent bulb, and another in the laundry room, both set to auto on/off. Bulb type shouldn't be an issue.

Also installed timer switches on the bathroom exhaust fans, we'd turn them on to remove the humidity from a shower and forget to turn them off, it is a super quiet fan, hard to hear even when you are in the bathroom, it could end up running all night or even for a day or two.

Now you have to select a time 5,10,15,30 or on and it will time out and turn off.

It sounds like you want a countdown switch, not a motion-activated switch.

I have used them in commercial buildings if you do not want the light to go on when anyone passes the switch.

You can get a twist on or push button.

I would install this

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00L...ZT1zcF9ocXBfc2hhcmVk

or this one

https://www.amazon.com/Leviton...2028898&sr=8-15&th=1

If you can use a screw drive and can turn the power off, it takes about 10 minutes to swap switches

quote:

Originally posted by sig2392:
It sounds like you want a countdown switch, not a motion-activated switch.

I could be wrong here, but I'm thinking Mr. V-Tail wants something different from a countdown switch.
Picture this: I walk in to the room and turn on the light. That activates a five-minute timer. I'm not finished what I'm doing when the timer expires, and suddenly I'm in the dark and have to activate the manual switch again. That's what we'll get with a standard countdown timer. (Been there, done that... on crutches. No bueno.)

As a guy who tinkers with industrial controls a little, I'm seeing Mr. V-Tail's situation somewhat differently.
I'm envisioning a setup where a manual switch activates a timer and a motion sensor -- If there is motion detected when the timer expires, then the timer restarts. In this case, I walk into the room and turn on the switch (I'd build this with a momentary pushbutton). For as long as I'm moving around in there, the timer keeps resetting. Once I've left, the timer expires again but without the motion sensor seeing activity, and the light goes off.

Does a company like Lutron offer a setup like that? I don't know.

Maybe I'm just too nerdy...

This may work as you described but I have not used one

https://www.amazon.com/Leviton...Y6LG?ref_=ast_sto_dp

quote:

Originally posted by sig2392:
This may work as you described but I have not used one

https://www.amazon.com/Leviton...Y6LG?ref_=ast_sto_dp

That is EXACTLY the type of operation that I am looking for.

Motion activated switches generally have an "occupancy mode" -- the light turns on when motion is detected in the area. When motion is no longer detected, there is a timed interval, after which the light turns off. The delay time for "off" is usually programmable in the range of one minute to thirty minutes.

The second mode of operation for these switches is "vacancy mode." The light does not turn on automatically, it is manual on only, and the "off" operation is exactly the same as the previously described "occupancy mode."

The switch in the Amazon link operates this way. That is the operation that I want, Manual On and Auto Off (vacancy mode).

My only question is whether these switches are compatible with the older type magnetic ballast for T12 lamps.

Yes that will work with magnetic ballasts.