In unrelated news, after retiring, he will move to Florida and run for Broward County Sheriff, were he is expected to win in a landslide.

Of course it’s a cultural thing, and cultures change. WWFHD?*

When I was young, teachers would talk about how animals (including humans) reacted to threats. Then it was “fight or flight,” but later it was recognized that there is a third F: freeze. That’s probably as common a reaction as flight, and certainly more common than fight.

Fighting is being socialized out of men in “civilized” cultures, and in my view it isn’t a widespread instinctive reaction even in this country. When I read just a few days ago that it was a mantra that went back decades before my exposure I was reminded of my basic training group’s being asked, “What’s the spirit of the bayonet?” No one even in my father’s generation in WWII really expected for the bayonet to be a meaningful weapon, much less did we Vietnam era soldiers, but the idea was the thing that had to be said and drilled into us: Close with the enemy and kill him.

Today I often feel as though I need to stress to my use of force students and those in active shooter response briefings the need for decisive violence of action when defending oneself. I have sometimes seen people in the latter groups seem to turn a little pale at the thought, but it’s not limited to those who have never been exposed to the idea. American law enforcement responses to Columbine and Parkland were merely the most notorious of the incidents when individual police officers and/or their supervisors froze due to poor training, flawed doctrine, or other reasons rather than charging to the sound of the guns.

And what about all the shooting ranges and even firearms competitions that prohibit the use of targets that look even a little like human beings? LTC Dave Grossman claimed that one of the reasons soldiers in Vietnam fired their rifles more than they did in World War II was because of the adoption of silhouette targets for training rather than traditional bull’s-eyes. So, if gun owners have to limit what shapes of cardboard they can engage, how likely will they be to get involved in defending someone else who’s being attacked?
(Added: As for this guy’s mention of protective equipment, some years ago in my town something similar occurred. A call went out about a man trying to commit suicide with the exhaust of his vehicle. The firefighters on scene wouldn’t enter the then-open garage until they had put on their SBA. The police officer’s response was to run in, grab the guy, and pull him outside. She was later criticized for risking herself to save someone who wanted to kill himself.)

The Wall Street Journal had an article just yesterday about how European attitudes toward terrorism are changing; hopefully some of those changes will trickle down to police in the UK, but such changes usually require the retirement of the old guards before they will ever be effective. I cannot imagine what this man will think of his lack of action in the incident in the coming years, but ultimately what he did/failed to do was not unexpected.

* What would Fairbairn have done?

"I think anyone who came up against that individual would have faced serious, serious injury, if not death."

There is only one catch a-hole; you signed up to do just that.

quote:

Originally posted by ulsterman:
Armed or unarmed, you see a brother in a fight you had better jump in to help or turn in your badge and resign.

I am NEVER 'unarmed.' I may not have a firearm, blade, OC, or what have you, but being 'armed' isn't a physical state; it's a state of mind.

Heck, people can do immense damage with their FISTS. To sit there and say "he wasn't armed" is no better than that coward in Florida who hid outside and "established a perimeter."

Did the car not have a tire iron?

If he doesn't now he will later wish he'd done differently.

He's an administrator. A politician. Worked in a few "Home Counties" forces before coming to the big show but his career has been a string of rocket rides to progressively higher administrative posts.

They exist in every agency on the planet. If they ever truly WERE "cops," they aren't any more.

And echo what Kevin said: If you leave me to fight alone, you need to be in a different ZIP code when I'm discharged from the hospital.

quote:

Originally posted by DennisM:
He's an administrator. A politician. Worked in a few "Home Counties" forces before coming to the big show but his career has been a string of rocket rides to progressively higher administrative posts.

They exist in every agency on the planet. If they ever truly WERE "cops," they aren't any more.

And echo what Kevin said: If you leave me to fight alone, you need to be in a different ZIP code when I'm discharged from the hospital.

Trust me when I say there are plenty of armed police command staff weenies and house cats (an probably a few patrol officers street detectives) here in the US that would do the exact same thing. I have seen plenty freeze like a deer in the headlights many times when they have made the mistake of leaving the office where the greatest danger they face is cold coffee, a nasty paper cut, a stapler that is running amok, or god forbid it, a printer toner cartridge "explosion".

There is a reason street cops have a CHAOS (Chief Has Arrived On Scene) Plan ready.

But doesn't he look smashingly great?
The Brits sure have a thing for snazzy uniforms.
The 'redcoats' made good targets for our ragtag bunch of American patriots...

[/QUOTE]

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
It's like that line in Open Range: "You may not know this, but there are things that will gnaw at a man worse than dyin'."

Won't bother this guy at all.
You see the smile on his face in that picture? That's a genuine, honest "Yeaaaaay, I did it!" smile.

Most men, yeah, you're exactly right. It would gnaw at them to the point where suck-starting a Sig would be a good idea. This guy, not at all.

he and that deputy from Broward County should hang out

----------------------------------

quote:

Originally posted by tacfoley:

quote:

Originally posted by muzzleloader:
I think running over the POS repeatedly with my car would be the correct thing to do. Take a lesson from the terrorists.

Yup, he had a two-ton weapon right there. He is a disgrace to his uniform, and for sure will never be allowed to forget this.

Coward.

He's probably never sat in the front seat.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
It's like that line in Open Range: "You may not know this, but there are things that will gnaw at a man worse than dyin'."

Now, that was a good movie.

Kevin, my highest respect and thanks for you and every other officer that protects this Country 24-7 and makes it a safer place. That goes to our military also.

Participation medal?

quote:

Originally posted by chellim1:
But doesn't he look smashingly great?
The Brits sure have a thing for snazzy uniforms.
The 'redcoats' made good targets for our ragtag bunch of American patriots...

[/QUOTE]

quote:

I was reminded of my basic training group’s being asked, “What’s the spirit of the bayonet?”

I received my basic/advanced infantry training in 1953, at that time bayonet training was being reemphasized due to experience in Korea where the bayonet was used. (There was also great emphasis placed on firing your M1, many had been found bayoneted in their foxholes by the Chinese with unfired weapons).

As a result I learned that a lot of life's problems can be solved with a vertical butt stroke.

He needs every Police Constable in the country to send him a White Feather, each.

At least he didn't roll down his window and shout rude things. He could have been charged with a hate crime if he did.

quote:

Originally posted by Hound Dog:

quote:

Originally posted by ulsterman:
Armed or unarmed, you see a brother in a fight you had better jump in to help or turn in your badge and resign.

I am NEVER 'unarmed.' I may not have a firearm, blade, OC, or what have you, but being 'armed' isn't a physical state; it's a state of mind.

Heck, people can do immense damage with their FISTS. To sit there and say "he wasn't armed" is no better than that coward in Florida who hid outside and "established a perimeter."

Just go with the gist of the post.

quote:

Originally posted by oldRoger:
[D]ue to experience in Korea where the bayonet was used.

As I recall there was one documented “bayonet charge” in Korea by American forces. I won’t offer my opinion of why that company commander ordered it or whether any enemy soldiers were actually stuck with those heavy spears, but although I understood perfectly well why use of the bayonet was taught during my training in 1965, I would challenge anyone to point to other documented incidents.

My father spent 20 years in the Army starting before Pearl Harbor and came back from the European Theater with four awards of the Purple Heart plus a couple of arrowheads on his campaign ribbons indicating his participation in amphibious landings. His comment about the weapon before I enlisted was, “The only time a bayonet on a rifle is of any use is if you’re out of ammo and the other guy is out of ammo.” And that was from someone who competed in formal marksmanship competitions and preferred the M1903 Springfield over the Garand—so he definitely wasn’t someone who was impressed with firing lots of bullets as fast as possible.

All that being said, if US troops were bayoneted in their foxholes without firing their own weapons it says far more about the training and readiness of those killed than about the value of putting a knife on the end of a rifle loaded with lots and lots of cartridges.

Apology for the thread drift.

quote:

Originally posted by Balzé Halzé:
Yes. The very definition of a coward.

Bravery may get you killed, but at least you don't have to live with yourself being a no good coward.

being a no-good coward does not even begin to bother these assholes. Sit and watch an unarmed cop get stabbed to death? Really?

Time somebody pulled the cork and let that island sink into the north sea.

I don't understand how this guy can live with himself, worse, not realize that all see him as a coward. Why give anyone support or succor by giving him a metal or clear him at an inquest? What good does it do? How does it help except for appease and make it easier the next time? What happened to honor and a bit of courage?