If more urban areas such as Oakland, Berkeley, Richmond, etc are part of the scheduled blackouts, I would imagine an uptick in crime will result. I imagine LE will be swamped with all kinds of shit. No traffic lights, water systems compromised, alarm systems inactive, etc.

They kept repeating that Sonoma County would be the first to be cut off, yet I had power all night and am at work with full power. Some co-workers did lose power, though.

We woke up to heavy wet snow that has caused wide spread power outages in the area. Tree limbs and power lines down everywhere. We're fine for now and still have power. Nobody will be suing Avista Power over this I can guarantee.

Jim

Question I have:

1) Has the state and PGE exhausted all reasonable options in prevention? Detection? Extinguishing?

2) Are these policies to protect homes? Or is it really about mitigating liability? What happens if through all these actions, there is still a devastating fire? What then? What's their liability? What further actions would they take?

3) Are the power outage affecting areas where there has been historically no issues with what they say they're trying to prevent?

4) Is this really the long term plan? Is our infrastructure and support so weak that we need to turn off power like some third world country every time the wind blows?

5) Fires can / do happen naturally. These actions do nothing to prevent that and yet they have common implications. What should be done?

6) Millions of people affected by these kinds of things. I'm sure there are critical things that are health related, especially for the elderly. But also other things like small businesses, education, events like theater tickets. Lost food in commercial and private refrigerators. Who's paying for all this? What are really preventing? What's the real risk? What's different now than 10 years ago?

I have so many honest questions.

I thought all those Cali Homes were supposed to be off the grid and solar powered so it shouldn't matter.....

quote:

Originally posted by LS1 GTO:
Maybe people should have been more thoughtful about suing PG&E about fires.

As I recall, part of the law suits complained, and loudly, about how PG&E DIDN'T shut off power under these forecasted conditions.

Reaping what you sew.

+1

I guess everyone forgot about this. The State raked them over the coals and is trying to hold them accountable financially (extort) for the previous wild fires.

Well, it seems like they received your message loud and clear. Enjoy all your future planned blackouts

quote:

Originally posted by kkina:
Shutdowns are already happening, supposed to be more after midnight. So far safe. Think I'll go check my Surefires.

Supposedly this is due to imminent high winds. Dead calm right at the moment. Never heard of an outage like this before.

What are the hiding ?

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:
Question I have:

1) Has the state and PGE exhausted all reasonable options in prevention? Detection? Extinguishing?

The easy solution is to bury the power lines, however my understanding is that, it costs 10x what it would take to string them overhead.
The other issue is CA lawmakers have made liability so onerous that if there is a small risk of a fire, PG&E now is forced to shut off all its power in the area. California has created a situation where no amount of risk is manageable. Secondarily, 'concerned enviro citizens' have brought all sorts of halts and attention to NOT cutting trees where PG&E is TRYING to mitigate their risk:
Sierra Club thinking there going to be too much cutting

Cute affluent suburbia town, this happened right before the disastrous wine country fires.

PG&E is damned if they do, and damned if they don't

quote:

2) Are these policies to protect homes? Or is it really about mitigating liability? What happens if through all these actions, there is still a devastating fire? What then? What's their liability? What further actions would they take?

You need the forest/wildfire rider on your insurance policy....good lucky finding a carrier or, one that's reasonable. Pretty much everyone living between any trees in CA had their fire policies cut-off as insurance decided nope, not going there.

quote:

3) Are the power outage affecting areas where there has been historically no issues with what they say they're trying to prevent?

Its the new normal. Before last year we had 6-years of drought conditions, some years, there was hardly any snow or, rain, the small local ski areas didn't even open. The region normaly doesn't get a drop of rain for the 6-months of Summer & Fall, what's changed is the population has increased substantially over the last 30-years, particularly around various semi-rural communities. During this time, the bark beetle has devastated douglas fir and various other pine stands in the Sierras, resulting in a green landscape that is pockmarked with dead-brown trees. Basically standing bonfires.

quote:

4) Is this really the long term plan? Is our infrastructure and support so weak that we need to turn off power like some third world country every time the wind blows?

My understanding is the utility companies can surgically isolate certain areas that are at risk, or, just wipe-out whole areas, eliminating any risk. See above about burying power lines. Not a electrician, my understanding that de-energizing an area has to be done in a methodical and progressive way least you blow the circuitry. Electricians can give better perspective.

quote:

5) Fires can / do happen naturally. These actions do nothing to prevent that and yet they have common implications. What should be done?

Move, break-up PG&E into manageable areas, bury power lines, restrict residential development in rural areas, higher penalties for homeowners who don't manage defensible space on their property in rural areas, require state forest service to manage underbrush and mountain misery growth.

Last one out of California, turn off the lights.
Wait.... Never mind!

I was fine. No power outage.

This was going to be a good test of my solar power and my power wall backup battery. I did not need it so far.

For those of you not familiar with the California hills etc. This is the exact type of weather (wind) that drives these devastating fires over the years. It hasn't rained here yet and the fuel of the grass on all the hills is dry as hell and perfect for major fires.

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
The easy solution is to bury the power lines, however my understanding is that, it costs 10x what it would take to string them overhead.

It's practical to bury residential and business neighbourhood distribution lines, as they run a mere 13.8KV. But the kind of lines that triggered that big fire run up to 400KV. I don't know as it would be practical to bury such lines.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
The easy solution is to bury the power lines, however my understanding is that, it costs 10x what it would take to string them overhead.

It's practical to bury residential and business neighbourhood distribution lines, as they run a mere 13.8KV. But the kind of lines that triggered that big fire run up to 400KV. I don't know as it would be practical to bury such lines.

Not an electrician so, my knowledge is based upon whatever pros I talk to. All I know is those lines need to go fairly deep, into a special conduit and everything maped out, least you have an issue like the gas-line puncture problem in San Bruno back in 2010...ironically done by PG&E.

A good friend lives right in the middle of this, far away from most. He's close to or in the mountains at elevation. He started dropping curse words when I asked about this. And he rarely cusses. He just installed solar because he hates this company so much. He stated to me that they used to go around and trim all the trees around the power lines as they would cause fires and such during high winds. He said they quit doing that in his area 6-7 years ago. So with high winds coming, instead of tree trimming, and spending the money to do it properly the assholes are just turning power off. What a shit hole POS company.

quote:

So with high winds coming, instead of tree trimming, and spending the money to do it properly the assholes are just turning power off. What a shit hole POS company.

Are they not doing it to save money, or because some eco green climate nazi sierra group is threatening them....

What could possibly go wrong...?

Phase 2 happening between 12n and 1pm (starting 40 minutes from now).

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
The easy solution is to bury the power lines, however my understanding is that, it costs 10x what it would take to string them overhead.

It's practical to bury residential and business neighbourhood distribution lines, as they run a mere 13.8KV. But the kind of lines that triggered that big fire run up to 400KV. I don't know as it would be practical to bury such lines.

Possible in theory , but expensive beyond comprehension .

quote:

Originally posted by HRK:
I thought all those Cali Homes were supposed to be off the grid and solar powered so it shouldn't matter.....

From the sound of things, some now are haha!

Spoke with a buddy who has a customer in NorCal, said it's a joke, there's no wind near his house, not even a breeze...

I can't blame the power company for taking precautions, who wants to be sued out of business.

quote:

Originally posted by Prefontaine:
A good friend lives right in the middle of this, far away from most. He's close to or in the mountains at elevation. He started dropping curse words when I asked about this. And he rarely cusses. He just installed solar because he hates this company so much. He stated to me that they used to go around and trim all the trees around the power lines as they would cause fires and such during high winds. He said they quit doing that in his area 6-7 years ago. So with high winds coming, instead of tree trimming, and spending the money to do it properly the assholes are just turning power off. What a shit hole POS company.

My parents live at the snowline level in the Sierras, PG&E hired contractors to set-up appointments and work to trim back those affected vegetation. Very little communication, no rhyme or, reason to why certain properties had work done or, didn't. It's a poop show.