The linked live streamable video has been taken down.

video has been removed.Any place else to see it,
Thanks, Jack

quote:

A witness told CBS 11 News the gunman walked up to a server during communion with a shotgun and then opened fire. According to the witness, another church member — identified as a former FBI agent and part of the church’s security — shot the suspect.

Link

They took the video down in the OP’s link and I was unable to find it on the internet. It’s too bad folks won’t allow that to be seen. I want to learn as much as I can from what happened, but nope.

Glad to hear good people put a stop to it before it got worse!

Way to close to home. Probably 10 minutes up the road from me. Looks like he targeted the security team. Shows how fast it can happen. My brother in law is on the security team at his church and goes through training often.

Dang, a headline that tells the straight story:

Armed worshippers quickly kill gunman after fatal shooting at Fort Worth-area church

Church members acted quickly to take down a gunman who opened fire Sunday at West Freeway Church of Christ in White Settlement, authorities said.

The gunman fatally shot a person and critically wounded another before several members of the congregation returned fire during a service at the church at 1900 S. Las Vegas Trail, White Settlement Police Chief JP Bevering said. The gunman died at the scene, Bevering said.

The shooting appeared to happen during communion, according to a livestream video of the service obtained by the Star-Telegram...

Complete article:

https://www.star-telegram.com/...rticle238807963.html

New link, video window below paragraph

http://breaking911.com/breakin...fatalities-reported/

I am assuming that the person in hysterics was the daughter of one of the parishioners shot. It sure sounds like she was screaming "daddy no".

As was my hunch by my comment in a previous post. He (gunman) was not a regular and the security team had concerns. In hindsight should of questioned him more and suggested his coat be removed or other measures to insure he was not a threat. Failing to do so was a huge mistake and caused serious injury and loss of life unfortunately.
It was a terrible outcome, but could of been much worse.

Ty for the links. That was one heck of a shot by the good guy. What I learned is to take a threat seriously! I don’t understand why the first guy went for his gun so slowly/calmly.

You can see a guy crouch down by the good guy who eventually shot him. He knew something was up. Even the good guy who shot him responded slowly.

Obviously they didn’t/couldn’t believe what their eyes were telling them. Surreal. I’m not saying I would have gone all quick draw ninja. I’m saying what I learned is that they appeared to be a little shell shocked and didn’t believe what they were seeing.

Take cover/concealment and draw. Don’t stand and draw slowly while processing...if I can recall that in the moment.

Not casting stones because our church doesn't have a formal security team/plan yet.

However, this illustrates that the best place for security personnel is not in the sanctuary, but ideally scanning the parking lot or failing that outside in the Narthex, intercept the sketchy ones early, greet the late-comers.

I co-taught an ALICE course https://www.alicetraining.com/ to a church in November who had their security on point. They would lock both exterior and sanctuary doors after service starts with a security team person stationed just inside the exterior door to greet or intercept as needed. Transparent to 99% of the members.

This response was as good as it gets with the gunman already inside, they will get a shot or 2 off before you can react.

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
That's about as fast as one can react if giving others the benefit of the doubt that they mean no harm until they show their weapon. Indeed carrying chambered and frankly, without a safety to fiddle with is about the best one can do there. I think being trained and drilled would have probably prevented the few seconds of doubt between the perp and his first victim who looked like he was drawing but not decisively. It was hard to watch. Those poor innocent people.

I've been shooting and carrying 1911 style single actions most of my life and with a little practice the safety is disengaged before the barrel clears the holster. As I'm drawing, my thumb is sweeping the safety in a millisecond. Trust me, a safety isn't a problem with some practice.

Jim

It looked to me like the gunman got up to move. Possibly to the front of the congregation. A member. Second victim shot questioned him about moving. He stepped back and opened fire on the member attempting to draw his weapon and then shot the member who initially questioned him. Then the security team member shot him. Looked like maybe a head shot.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s5NzuGSkL2E

Some initial analysis

The "bad guy" has already made his decision(s) and is acting on them before anyone else saw him that day. (it is always this, every time)

The guy that stopped him DRT, is to be commended. He did well, and I will not second guess his timing.

He was "behind the power curve" when he assessed and saw what was unfolding at the speed it was unfolding.

This is a prime example of how and why training and getting your head around the knowing that there are bad people in this world hellbent on whatever it takes to get what they want, and being able to flip the switch in your brain and do what must be done, then flip the switch back off, with no remorse for what happens in the middle. (yes, you most certainly can do that and still hold a kitten in your lap the rest of your life.)

As for the actions of other's less decisive or slow to react correctly for the situation? I cannot answer for them, and am sorry they did not react better. Sad for them, their family and friends.

Always understand, in any situation, any of us are going to be making a second move in the event we find ourselves in.

The man that ended that, reacted remarkably, and made a many lifesaving shot from a pretty good distance.

quote:

Originally posted by Jimbo54:

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
That's about as fast as one can react if giving others the benefit of the doubt that they mean no harm until they show their weapon. Indeed carrying chambered and frankly, without a safety to fiddle with is about the best one can do there. I think being trained and drilled would have probably prevented the few seconds of doubt between the perp and his first victim who looked like he was drawing but not decisively. It was hard to watch. Those poor innocent people.

I've been shooting and carrying 1911 style single actions most of my life and with a little practice the safety is disengaged before the barrel clears the holster. As I'm drawing, my thumb is sweeping the safety in a millisecond. Trust me, a safety isn't a problem with some practice.

Jim

Right. I've been shooting since 1971. I thought I had trained working around the safety over the years. Not saying you would do this but the third time I stumbled on the safety during an intense training session and I was done with it. I switched to a non safety mechanism. No telling what will happen if suddenly confronted. I just want to keep it simple.

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:

quote:

Originally posted by Jimbo54:

quote:

Originally posted by darthfuster:
That's about as fast as one can react if giving others the benefit of the doubt that they mean no harm until they show their weapon. Indeed carrying chambered and frankly, without a safety to fiddle with is about the best one can do there. I think being trained and drilled would have probably prevented the few seconds of doubt between the perp and his first victim who looked like he was drawing but not decisively. It was hard to watch. Those poor innocent people.

I've been shooting and carrying 1911 style single actions most of my life and with a little practice the safety is disengaged before the barrel clears the holster. As I'm drawing, my thumb is sweeping the safety in a millisecond. Trust me, a safety isn't a problem with some practice.

Jim

Right. I've been shooting since 1971. I thought I had trained working around the safety over the years. Not saying you would do this but the third time I stumbled on the safety during an intense training session and I was done with it. I switched to a non safety mechanism. No telling what will happen if suddenly confronted. I just want to keep it simple.

I've got you beat. I started shooting 1911s regularly in '67'.

I'm not trying to reintroduce the old safety vs no safety battle. I'm a "what floats your boat" kind of a guy.

Jim

Very well put Simonkey!

This church is about 30mins from me.

Really feel for everyone involved in this. Life will never be the same.

5.3 seconds from bad guy first shot to bad guy going down.

This has 12 minute 'security specialist' moving thru the incident:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?...2E&feature=emb_title