So, how many years, actual incarceration is just for killing four and injuring a dozen?

It depends, obviously, jones.

The first mistake is thinking a simple and singular answer even exists or can.

Context, Intent, other sentences for all other crimes in all jurisdictions, it all matters.

Until we reconcile the myriad of issues across the board we'll never even know.

As it stands, some days the Justice System is like a wise old timer, reasonable and logical, and other times barely better than an alcoholic parent beating the shit out of their teenager for dropping a $4 plate by mistake.

Our shit is so fucked up and inconsistent, and long had been.

This case is just one of zillions. Off the rails, this one, a true shark jumper.

You seem to have all the answers, that based upon the facts the jury screwed this up, so what’s fair?

A jury reviewed the actual evidence, and found this to be just. A penalty that he will serve 20 years in prison (hopefully) for killing 4 people negligently. Anyone who thinks for a minute that it actually means it’s actually 100 years incarceration is misinformed at best.

So, it’s your opinion they screwed up, based upon the evidence, so what’s fair?

We could throw darts at the speedometer on my truck. It goes from 0 to 120.

Don't be cheeky. And make no mistake, I have now and am capable of arriving at more answers than many, perhaps including you, but that's not the point, and you know it.

But we can just trade back or forehanded insults if you prefer. I'd rather not.

Real work needs to be done to sort out these issues, by teams of people carefully considering these exact things, more so than they've been to date. Obviously.

Nobody anywhere, neither you not I, can answer it here and now, off the cuff. Part of the problem is this exact sort of thing, off the cuff answers by biased folks.

Emotion, anger, rage, revenge, and all manner of other non-constructive elements are a big problem, and inconsistent sentencing guidelines are just one enormous issue.

(Nowhere in any of this do I advocate a lack of laws or consequences, obviously.)

That jury and any similar one are wholly ill equipped to handle this broad issue. We need reconciliation of sentences across all crimes in all jurisdictions.

Since the deaths and injuries all occurred from one incident, perhaps the sentences should run concurrently.

flashguy

I have a question for 46and2: You have stated that the sentence was not justified.

If you made a suggestion for a different sentence, I missed it.

My question: If one or more of the fatalities had been your spouse and / or children and the truck driver had been found guilty, what sentence would you like to see?

I've been the driver of a runaway truck. Cincinnati doesn't have mountains, but enough hills. I was maybe 25, long before CDL's. Driving
along, relaxed, ten seconds later, standing on the brake pedal, no brakes. Look ahead and traffic is slow at the bottom of the hill. In full adrenalin, boot on the shifter trying to slam it into lower gear, no good. Got on the right berm passing cars going 20, I was doing 80.
If someone would have pulled out in front of me, my only option would have been the guardrail.
I guess my point is, If you go from calm and cool to ten seconds later into full panic mode, would you know exactly what to do and how to react?
Parked the truck, hitched back to the shop, told the owner to start using professional mechanics or I'll quit.
Scared the shit out of me. Quit a few months later.

quote:

Originally posted by Schmelby:
I've been the driver of a runaway truck. Cincinnati doesn't have mountains, but enough hills. I was maybe 25, long before CDL's. Driving
along, relaxed, ten seconds later, standing on the brake pedal, no brakes. Look ahead and traffic is slow at the bottom of the hill. In full adrenalin, boot on the shifter trying to slam it into lower gear, no good. Got on the right berm passing cars going 20, I was doing 80.
If someone would have pulled out in front of me, my only option would have been the guardrail.
I guess my point is, If you go from calm and cool to ten seconds later into full panic mode, would you know exactly what to do and how to react?
Parked the truck, hitched back to the shop, told the owner to start using professional mechanics or I'll quit.
Scared the shit out of me. Quit a few months later.

The difference here was this was not a mechanical failure, he used bad driving techniques, was over confident in his abilities, and failed to use a runaway ramp. As far as I know it wasn't mechanical, it was predictable that he'd over work the brakes given the load and grade.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:
And make no mistake, I have now and am capable of arriving at more answers than many, perhaps including you, but that's not the point, and you know it.

What a strange thing to say. Just what exactly is your problem lately?

Get your comments in, guys. This thread will be locked before the end of today. I'm sick of seeing it pop up to the top of the Lounge.

What is everyone's mark on what a life is worth?

Everyone agrees he was at fault but no one agrees on what his sentence should be.

How do we judge that? We don't.

It is up to our courts to determine it.

If you don't agree to the sentence, then fight to change it. Isn't that how mandatory minimums came into existence?

The driver had multiple chances to make different decisions but he choose to ignore those chances. The outcome of his decisions were the basis of his sentence.

46and2's megalomania is getting worse...

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

My question: If one or more of the fatalities had been your spouse and / or children and the truck driver had been found guilty, what sentence would you like to see?

This is not a fair question.

These decisions should not be made by emotionally - compromised people directly affected by the crime. If you want that, then you have described a lynch mob.

These decisions should be made by objective people who are not close associates of or emotionally connected to the victims or accused.

Suppose I hit and killed a pedestrian with my truck, completely by accident. I would not want my sentence determined by the friends and family of the deceased.

quote:

Originally posted by flashguy:
Since the deaths and injuries all occurred from one incident, perhaps the sentences should run concurrently.

flashguy

Yes. Perhaps.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

My question: If one or more of the fatalities had been your spouse and / or children and the truck driver had been found guilty, what sentence would you like to see?

Not a valid question. Why? There's a reason why we would never put family members on a jury. Ask me for instance if I would sacrifice the freedoms of every single person on this planet for the life of my daughter's in the context of covid. In a nanosecond I would. To the extreme, would I trade my daughter's life for a hundred others? A thousand? A billion? I would sacrifice them all to protect the life of my daughter.

Your question is invalid.

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
46and2's megalomania is getting worse...

Except in this case I agree with him.

46and2, I'm reading your statement to be a literal belief that the 110 year sentence is 5x too much. So then do you believe that a sentence 1/5 that amount (or 22 years) is appropriate, given that he will serve 20% of the time as a non violent offender? That would be around 4 1/2 years, if my public school math holds up.

I'm not much into worrying about what the number of years is that an offender is sentenced to, so much as how many of them they actually serve relative to the crime. I don't necessarily think that a sub-five year stint is sufficient (in my book) for hitting and killing four people with an 18 wheeler. Maybe I'm not seeing something you are seeing?

quote:

Originally posted by slabsides45:
Maybe I'm not seeing something you are seeing?

Nope, you have pretty much what even the FBI calls a “clue”.

quote:

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
46and2's megalomania is getting worse...

Except in this case I agree with him.

I wasn’t referring to his assertion the sentence was excessive but instead referring to what Para quoted.

quote:

Originally posted by Hound Dog:

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

My question: If one or more of the fatalities had been your spouse and / or children and the truck driver had been found guilty, what sentence would you like to see?

This is not a fair question.

These decisions should not be made by emotionally - compromised people directly affected by the crime. If you want that, then you have described a lynch mob.

These decisions should be made by objective people who are not close associates of or emotionally connected to the victims or accused.

Suppose I hit and killed a pedestrian with my truck, completely by accident. I would not want my sentence determined by the friends and family of the deceased.

Then why do they let family and friends make impact statements prior to sentencing?

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:

quote:

Originally posted by Rightwire:

quote:

Originally posted by coloradohunter44:
If truckers want to boycott the state, great. The traffic here sucks anyway. We won't miss them.

Considering the volume of products that flow in, and out of the ports in California, that would be a really bad idea. There are enough supply chain problems in this country right now.

But, the economy will find a way around it. Being held hostage by anyone wishing not to be held to a standard never works out.

The truck driving profession is one that I’ve watched go down hill in my life time. In my youth I watched my uncle, and other professional drivers, conduct themselves in a certain manner.

Since then the “professional” aspect seems to have disappeared from the profession. This is from side of the road interactions and listening to my uncle and others complain about how far the professional driver has been replaced with a less professional, less well trained staff. The good news is that the truly professional guys can work forever because of their work ethic.

There certainly are professionals still out there, but far and wide the days of old are gone.

It’s interesting to see the direct inverse proportion of professional drivers to the amount of regulation the industry has received.

quote:

Originally posted by ulsterman:

Then why do they let family and friends make impact statements prior to sentencing?

Good point. I suppose there is room for SOME emotion, in regards to sentencing.

Still, the final decisions are made by (ideally, at least) objective people, not directly connected to the accused or victim. . .