OK. It was just OC spray but who'd open that thread? The first two times were user classes. This time was for an NLETC instructor cert. We were experimenting to see if eye pro and a common mask would make any difference with Def Tech 1.3% MCC conical.



John of Active Self Protection was in attendance and interviewed me after.



Chuck Haggard of Agile Training and Consulting is probably the foremost expert in the country on defensive OC use. If you get a chance to take anything from him, do so. Also, I know I like Texmex too much.

Private video Warren. Can't see it.

quote:

Originally posted by ArtieS:
Private video Warren. Can't see it.

Sorry and thanks. The Internet is hard.

Looks like the mask and safety glasses worked

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:
Looks like the mask and safety glasses worked

With gel or gel-like cone, like this, yes. With Sabre Red stream and especially cone, the results are very different. I wanted to do this one because my dept. uses this brand in a .2% MCC instead of 1.3 like this was. I'm hoping my message that we need to change gets across to someone with this demo.

Wow! 6.5x stronger than your department uses and defeated by minimal PPE.

Why was he so close when he sprayed?

quote:

Originally posted by gpbst3:
Why was he so close when he sprayed?

To maximize the effect. That way there is no question as to proper deployment. It's a control factor for the experiment.

What type of pepper spray does the OP recommend?

quote:

Originally posted by Sacramento Johnson:
What type of pepper spray does the OP recommend?

Sabre Red. That shit is hot liquid hell.

Cone/mist/fog is the most effective for dogs and people. The downside is that it's easier to cross contaminate yourself and others. It's MUCH more effective on dogs and that's the main reason I carry it. You're much more likely to come across and aggressive/semi-aggressive dog and a like hooman.

I carry stream because it's less affected by wind and possible cross contamination but a little harder to hit what you're aiming at. Also, because I hand a lot of it out and it's a little more user friendly in the regard.

All OC is difficult to find now, but I just bought some for some Sabre Red for classes in pink/purple containers because the cool kids want tactical black.

How many times do I have to tell you dude...

No means NO!

We used to use deftech at the PD. When it worked it was good stuff. When it didn’t, you’d better have a plan B. The stuff we had was stream.

Before that we used capstun...in the fogger small can...it was like a small can of yard guard but with pepper spray!! Good stuff- never had to worry about application cause everyone got a dose...including you.

Used def tech in the CG too. We used the stream then..couldn’t tell you now what they use.

And in the time before time (when I first went in ) we used mace (I think it was actually CS) and when a can of that got bumped accidentally, it was horrible in the small confines of a boat cabin...

But we also used to bump our capstun while still in the belt holder as we were walking thru a particularly rowdy crowded bar When I was a cop....tended to clear out the bar post haste....

Can’t even begin to tell you how many times I’ve been sprayed...easily over 100 when I was in the CG, we used to spray each other when training a new guy or during certification...and probably a 100 times inadvertently as a cop, when myself or another officer sprayed someone..

Good times

quote:

No means NO!

Right?

quote:

But we also used to bump our capstun while still in the belt holder as we were walking thru a particularly rowdy crowded bar When I was a cop....tended to clear out the bar post haste....

That may or may not have happened in our station a few times.

quote:

Can’t even begin to tell you how many times I’ve been sprayed...easily over 100 when I was in the CG, we used to spray each other when training a new guy or during certification...and probably a 100 times inadvertently as a cop, when myself or another officer sprayed someone..

Good times

Confirming my belief that I was not tough enough to be in the military.

 
My wife had the pepper spray on herself when her department trained for carrying it.

You're a better man that I. OC exposure isn't the end of the world, but it really sucks, and I wouldn't necessarily volunteer for repeated sprays.

We use Fox, and issue stream or foam.

Foam's better for use in enclosed areas since less of it becomes aerosolized compared to the other delivery methods. The main argument against foam is that there's a theoretical possibility of the perp wiping it off and flinging it back if they're quick enough before it rapidly dissolves down to its liquid state, but I've never seen this or heard any first-hand accounts of it.

I hate OC with a passion. I'd rather get tased again. Besides, OC only works on cops! (and dogs) I remember a particular arrest where several of us were already hands on and one of the new guys had pulled out his OC. In no uncertain terms he was told he better not deploy OC with all of us so close.

quote:

Confirming my belief that I was not tough enough to be in the military.

There’s a fine line between “tough” and stupid..

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
You're a better man that I. OC exposure isn't the end of the world, but it really sucks, and I wouldn't necessarily volunteer for repeated sprays.

We use Fox, and issue stream or foam.

Foam's better for use in enclosed areas since less of it becomes aerosolized compared to the other delivery methods. The main argument against foam is that there's a theoretical possibility of the perp wiping it off and flinging it back if they're quick enough before it rapidly dissolves down to its liquid state, but I've never seen this or heard any first-hand accounts of it.

Yeah. The fling thing is a myth. Foam is a little less likely to get respiratory effects, as well. Each of them have their place.

ok we only have one more test for you ,
I gotta wonder about the effects if:

the recipient had just sprinted 40 - 50 yards ,
like a foot chase .

THEN got a face full.

thanks in advance