SIGforum
RIP Otto Warmbier
June 19, 2017, 05:44 PM
sig229-SASRIP Otto Warmbier
I read where the dad blamed the Obama administration, who knows, but it is sad to loose a son no matter what.
June 19, 2017, 06:00 PM
bigdealquote:
Originally posted by cjevans:
Condolences to the family.
Freaking sad news to learn.
NK - after the treatment given while in captivity, didn't want a foreigner to die on their soil.
^^^This. Now we all know why the NK's sent him back when they did.
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Guns are awesome because they shoot solid lead freedom. Every man should have several guns. And several dogs, because a man with a cat is a woman. Kurt Schlichter
June 19, 2017, 06:24 PM
ScreamingCockatooNK basically executed him.
It's time to cut all ties with that backwards nation.
He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster.
June 19, 2017, 06:31 PM
45 CalI do not think we have ties with them but a few dozen well places nukes would be in order in my opinion.
June 19, 2017, 06:39 PM
joel9507quote:
Originally posted by sdy:
When Otto returned to Cincinnati late on June 13th he was unable to speak, unable to see and unable to react to verbal commands. He looked very uncomfortable – almost anguished. Although we would never hear his voice again, within a day the countenance of his face changed – he was at peace. He was home and we believe he could sense that.
Sounds like it took a day for his body to figure out it wasn't still being tortured on a routine basis.
RIP Mr. Warmbier.
They clearly realize we (and the rest of the UN, technically) are under a state of war with them, with only the 'pause button' of an armistice in place.
At the 10,000 foot level, this is, essentially, an "Up Yours, Trump" - Trump tells Tillerson to secure Warmbier's release, they release a tortured corpse-to-be. I don't know any other way to take this than a direct insult and provocation.
If I were Mr. Discount Haircut, I would not be so quick to insult the US - the Wimp Triumvirate of Obama-Carter-Kerry is long gone and Trump-Mattis-Tillerson may not be so easy to intimidate.
June 19, 2017, 06:43 PM
RightwireGranted he broke the law in a foreign country, but that level of abuse in custody to the point of death seems a bit extreme for a crime that would be less than $100 anywhere else in the civilized world.
Pronoun: His Royal Highness and benevolent Majesty of all he surveys
343 - Never Forget
Its better to be Pavlov's dog than Schrodinger's cat
There are three types of mistakes; Those you learn from, those you suffer from, and those you don't survive. June 19, 2017, 07:05 PM
46and2RIP, kid.
May you be avenged 100 fold, one day.
June 19, 2017, 07:15 PM
ChicagoSigManA terrible loss.
Even sadder that there is really nothing that the USA can do about it. We have no ties with NK that we could cut. There are no sanctions we could impose that we haven't already that would matter at all. Military retaliation is off the table. There is just nothing we can do other than issue a strongly worded condemnation, which will mean zero to the Norks.
June 19, 2017, 07:33 PM
joel9507quote:
Originally posted by ChicagoSigMan:
A terrible loss.
Even sadder that there is really nothing that the USA can do about it. We have no ties with NK that we could cut. There are no sanctions we could impose that we haven't already that would matter at all. Military retaliation is off the table. There is just nothing we can do other than issue a strongly worded condemnation, which will mean zero to the Norks.
A bit of Asian history about ways insults can be made and answered, from
Wikipedia. quote:
Genghis then sent a 500-man caravan of Muslims to establish official trade ties with Khwarezmia. However Inalchuq, the governor of the Khwarezmian city of Otrar, had the members of the caravan that came from Mongolia arrested, claiming that the caravan was a conspiracy against Khwarezmia. It seems unlikely, however, that any members of the trade delegation were spies. Nor does it seem likely that Genghis was trying to initiate a conflict with the Khwarezmid Empire with the caravan, considering he was making steady progress against a faltering Jin empire in northern China at that very moment.[5]
Genghis Khan then sent a second group of three ambassadors (one Muslim and two Mongols) to meet the shah himself and demand the caravan at Otrar be set free and the governor be handed over for punishment. The shah had both of the Mongols shaved and had the Muslim beheaded before sending them back to Genghis Khan. Muhammad also ordered the personnel of the caravan to be executed. This was seen as a grave affront to the Khan himself, who considered ambassadors "as sacred and inviolable."[7]
This led Genghis Khan to attack the Khwarezmian Dynasty.
Everyone's heard of Ghengis Khan. Whatever, I wonder, happened to the Khwarezmian Dynasty?
June 19, 2017, 07:34 PM
jbcummingsLot's wrong here.
The kid should not have been there in the first place. I don't care if it's legal, it will never be a 'safe' place for an American.
Not smart, if you're already there, to give the NORKs any reason to single you out.
Punishment for what would be hardly a crime anywhere else in the world shouldn't have been a 15 year at hard labor sentence and certainly he shouldn't have been tortured (but apparently was).
The father says that the last administration didn't want the family making any 'noise' that the NORKs might think was offensive and basically wanted them to STFU while the government's 'top men' negotiated for their son's release. Sound familiar? Of course that administration did what it was used to doing. Nothing unless there was a photo-op in it for the putter-in-chief.
Frankly, I'd be for shoving a nuke up Redman's butt and send him off to have dinner with his short oddly coiffured buddy.
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Do not meddle in the affairs of wizards, for thou art crunchy and taste good with catsup.
June 19, 2017, 08:14 PM
HarleysbluffThat poor bastard - what did they do to him ...
MDS
June 20, 2017, 05:57 AM
BMRVery, very sad story. I'm glad, though, the family didn't leave him to linger in a vegetative state, like Terri Schiavo had been in a decade ago.
June 20, 2017, 06:03 AM
dwright1951Talk about a tough sentence for trying to steal a poster-DEATH!
June 20, 2017, 06:59 AM
UppsterI think the regime sent him back knowing Otto was dying. They did not want him to die in their hands.
God,Guns,Cars,& 1Wife, I would say I have it all.
June 20, 2017, 09:42 AM
rburgSounds to me like a win-win for the commies. They get a gold star for "releasing" him and their superior medicine kept him alive for over a year, where America's couldn't keep him alive for a week.
On the other hand, I discovered a new label for Nancy Pelosi. Unconscious wakefullness.
And some simple rules. Don't travel to enemy territory.
Unhappy ammo seeker
June 20, 2017, 09:57 AM
jhe888quote:
Originally posted by sig229-SAS:
I read where the dad blamed the Obama administration, who knows, but it is sad to loose a son no matter what.
He blamed Obama for not pressing the Norks hard enough for his return.
I am sorry for the kid. Going on that tour was ill-advised, but that is no excuse. They either harmed him intentionally or by being grossly negligent. I don't know what you do about it, but I hope there is something.
The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything. June 20, 2017, 09:58 AM
jhe888quote:
Originally posted by Uppster:
I think the regime sent him back knowing Otto was dying. They did not want him to die in their hands.
Undoubtedly, but who do they think they are fooling? No one on the outside, but maybe the papers in N. Korea are full of stories about what a humanitarian Li'l Kim is for releasing the depraved Western Imperialist.
The fish is mute, expressionless. The fish doesn't think because the fish knows everything. June 20, 2017, 11:10 AM
Sig2340quote:
Originally posted by joel9507:
Whatever, I wonder, happened to the Khwarezmian Dynasty?
I believe that Merv was one of its cities.
Tolui, Genghis' son, had his ambassadors killed by the Mervians. The Persian historian Juvayni, writing a generation after the destruction of Merv, wrote Tolui ordered:
quote:
...that, apart from four hundred artisans. .., the whole population, including the women and children, should be killed, and no one, whether woman or man, be spared. To each [Mongol soldier] was allotted the execution of three or four hundred Persians. So many had been killed by nightfall that the mountains became hillocks, and the plain was soaked with the blood of the mighty.
Some historians believe that over one million people died in the aftermath of the city's capture, including hundreds of thousands of refugees from elsewhere, making it one of the most bloody captures of a city in world history.
So, the take home lesson is don't kill emissaries.
Nice is overrated
"It's every freedom-loving individual's duty to lie to the government."
Airsoftguy, June 29, 2018
June 20, 2017, 11:13 AM
justjoeHeartbreaking.
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"You get much farther with a kind word and a gun than with a kind word alone."
June 20, 2017, 02:59 PM
nhtagmemberits sad all the way around, however lots at fault
a tour to North Korea? whomever thought that up is out of touch with reality
my nephew went to China for 3 weeks back in May. Took him and his friends 10 months to get their visas and itinerary approved
they had an absolute blast, they had a wonderful tour guide (minder) that took them to every place on their pre-planned trip - no deviations
the local police and soldiers were more than happy to take pictures of them with their own cameras so that they could be in the photos
only two rules - don't photograph police or military, and don't wander off on your own
they had such a good time they want to go back - and they probably will
[B] Against ALL enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC