Very tragic and my thoughts and prayers for the families.

Today I read how our Kalifornia Senator Diane Feinstein is calling for an "investigation into the deaths". I am glad we have her so she can tell all the involved law/fire agencies how to do their jobs! Because you know, without her calling for an investigation there would never be one, (yes its a snid comment)

How I hate this dipshit bitch. Putting her name and 'authority' into a tragedy to make herself look good. Disgusting woman who offers nothing to this tragedy but herself while numerous other agencies are coming to assist Santa Barbara and the families.

Worthless, grandstanding bitch.

This video is of a different, sister boat owned by the same operation named Vision. it is a slightly larger (10 feet or so) version of the Conception. The layouts for the salon, galley, shower rooms and bunk area are virtually identical.

You'll see the steep staircase - not a ladder - that is open up to the salon and galley area.

The boat does have an escape hatch (deck scuttle) that is normally closed. Best view of the hatch is at 0:36 to 0:40 where you'll see the red placard and step under that table. The placard reads EMERGENCY EXIT, KEEP CLEAR. It's a small hatch, but not unusual for a boat.

View of staircase down to the head and shower area starts at about 1:56, and the bunk area stairs are at 2:34.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_QDKsKYLivU

And here is a photo of the "escape" hatch below. Referred to in regulations as a "deck scuttle." Makes my spine shiver a bit. Note this photo might not show the full picture of that hatch access, but it does not look good to me. I would think there is a ladder between those single bunks (10U and 27U) that you access from behind where that photo was taken.

The red box indicates the approximate location of the hatch.




(Adjusted the image where the hatch is located (approximate).

This message has been edited. Last edited by: steve495,

One other note on this, for non-divers, you get a lot of "regulars" on dive boats, and often it becomes almost family. You can become really good friends with the capt and crew and dive with the same group for years, and some of the same people over and over. (I have friends I've known for years, only diving with them)

Which makes it all the more tragic, I am sure the Operator (and crew) lost some very close friends on this trip.

On this boat, it is very unlikely that they would have propane onboard. For insurance reasons, among others. They run the genset for cooking and refrigeration. My best guess is that something was left on in the galley, or possibly someone was smoking onboard.

Occasionally some overhead insulation drops down on an engine or genset, and eventually catches on fire. Some wiring conceivably could have caught fire, but if the boat was well maintained and wiring not modified, this would be unlikely.

quote:

Originally posted by steve495:

quote:

CG: Roger, are they locked inside the boat?

Vessel: (Unintelligible)

CG: Roger, can you get back on board and unlock the doors so they can get off?

The transcript you provided was only the Coast Guard side of the conversation, the transcript was pulled from Broadcastify and did not pick up the boat's transmissions.

That's one of the issues I have with the reporting of this event. Nobody seems to get anything correct. (No offense)

Very puzzling why the emergency operator asked if the caller can get back onboard and unlock the doors? The only locks on doors would be the bathrooms, just that question alone has spurred, impassioned but, idiotic assumptions by commenters on other locations. Everything aboard those boards is open passage.

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
Very puzzling why the emergency operator asked if the caller can get back onboard and unlock the doors? The only locks on doors would be the bathrooms, just that question alone has spurred, impassioned but, idiotic assumptions by commenters on other locations. Everything aboard those boards is open passage.

Yup, confusion due to communications hard to understand. The "locked" comments and the "there's no escape hatch" spoken over-and-over by the media is just normal bad journalism.

Wether the hatch was blocked is another story, but it was not locked. Certainly, they could not get out either egress which is frigging terrible.

The media claiming the Nitrox tanks are "dangerously explosive" is absurd.

quote:

Originally posted by c1steve:
On this boat, it is very unlikely that they would have propane onboard. For insurance reasons, among others. They run the genset for cooking and refrigeration. My best guess is that something was left on in the galley, or possibly someone was smoking onboard.

Occasionally some overhead insulation drops down on an engine or genset, and eventually catches on fire. Some wiring conceivably could have caught fire, but if the boat was well maintained and wiring not modified, this would be unlikely.

IF, this is a big if, what's in the video and what's on board Conception are the same, those stoves are electric, which as you mentioned, flammable gas is not an issue other than fuel for the engine.

Smoking is not allowed aboard those boats (doesn't mean somebody doesn't won't attempt spark one up). Given the amount of O2 tanks, could've been a rich mix, guys doing some work inside the deck house, odorless leak and somebody generates a spark....just all speculation.

The boat was built in 1981 and out of wood by a builder,whose 95% +/- of builds are much smaller boats, generally 28-35'. In 1981, the common material to build a boat like this out of, would have been aluminum, not wood. Aluminum is a lot more fire resistant than wood. Most builders stopped building commercial boats out of wood 15-20 years prior. Here is the build and list of builds by the builder:


www.seawayboats.net/timeline-of-boats-1.html

www.seawayboats.net/-conception-.html

The deck plan is on the last link (below) for accomodations and shows stairways etc.

https://www.truthaquatics.com/conception/



The hatch, while it is considered an "escape hatch" is not really an escape hatch because it exits also into the house (the interior of the boat on the main boat deck level, also in the galley area), not to the exterior deck, which is where it should exit. The sides and forward part of the house, appear to have all sealed windows and the only ingress and egress is at the back of the house onto the aft deck. So basically if the galley and house are engulfed in flames (which is what happened here), there is no way to escape. Modern USCG building requirements would have required sleeping quarters had a second way to escape that went to a weather deck or directly out of the hull side and into the water. The boat is 38 years old and it's highly likely it was an electrical fire that started it, given the age of the vessel and commercial use. The engines and generator are diesel (DD 8V92's) and diesel is much safer than gasoline and fumes don't explode like gasoline boats do. However, where and how they stored gasoline for the dinghy is a question mark. It is a very very unfortunate and sad situation.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: jimmy123x,

Here is a screen grab from the Vision's video above, showing where the hatch is as it relates to the outside deck.

My reading indicates those hatches need only be 18 inches wide. Ugh.

quote:

Originally posted by steve495:
My reading indicates those hatches need only be 18 inches wide. Ugh.

Ugh indeed. That part of the safety code was probably written in the 1890s, when the average man was 5' 4" and 130 pounds soaking wet.

I'm built like a linebacker, with a 50 inch chest and larger shoulders. There's no chance in hell I'd fit through an 18 inch wide escape hatch.

I dove on the Conception about 13 years ago. I can't even imagine this happening.

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
Given the amount of O2 tanks, could've been a rich mix, guys doing some work inside the deck house, odorless leak and somebody generates a spark....just all speculation.

They don't have oxygen tanks - they have air tanks. They use compressors to fill them - they also have membrane systems to make Nitrox (enhanced air), but that only brings the oxygen levels up to 32-36% instead of regular air at 21%. It takes quite a bit of heat to build up pressure, and the tanks have a burst disk to vent if the pressure goes too much above service pressure, and before test pressure.

http://scubaexpert.blogspot.co...-disk-important.html

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:

Smoking is not allowed aboard those boats (doesn't mean somebody doesn't won't attempt spark one up). Given the amount of O2 tanks, could've been a rich mix, guys doing some work inside the deck house, odorless leak and somebody generates a spark....just all speculation.

Do you have a link or something substantial that they did indeed have more than medical bottles of O2 onboard?

Unless they were partial blending nitrox, which I don't believe they were, the only O2 they likely had where medical-style bottles for a medical emergency/decompression injury. If they where partial blending it certainly was not taking place in the galley area. Most liveaboard use membrane systems to make nitrox. From what I have heard this was a recreational trip. Maybe if someone had a rebreather but for a short trip they wouldn't have needed too much O2 and again it would have been on a different deck.

This transcript was in a local news story earlier today. I'm going to hazard a guess and say he was trying to convey the people were trapped and couldn't get out, not locked in

quote:

After the captain apparently reports a fire and provides a location, the dispatcher is heard saying, "And there's 33 people on board the vessel that's on fire, they can't get off? ... Roger, are they locked inside the boat? ... Roger, can you get back on board and unlock the boat, unlock the door so they can get off? ... Roger, you don't have any firefighting gear at all? No fire extinguishers or anything?"

Later in the conversation, the dispatcher asks, "Was that all the crew that jumped off? ... Roger, is the vessel fully engulfed right now ... Roger, and there's no escape hatch for any of the people on board?"

quote:

Originally posted by comet24:
Unless they were partial blending nitrox, which I don't believe they were, the only O2 they likely had where medical-style bottles for a medical emergency/decompression injury.

I've heard from good sources they were using a membrane system for Nitrox, no sticks.

I have been tech diving on one of these boats, and it was definitely bring your own trimix. If they wanted to boost the mix, they would add helium, not more oxygen. Helium does not burn.

Straight O2 is for decompression in the 40'-20' range.

There is zero chance I would make it out of there alive. I’d also probably have been up on the deck. Those bunks are too small for me too

So how thick would the hull of been? 2x6 thickness with fiberglass over the wood?

In a panic situation no way to punch a hole in it. I know water would pour in, but if you could of kicked a hole in it big enough to swim out?

I am guessing these guys had less than thirty seconds once they know what was going on.

Explosions could of killed them all prior to knowing what was going on. Just curious.

quote:

Originally posted by comet24:

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:

Smoking is not allowed aboard those boats (doesn't mean somebody doesn't won't attempt spark one up). Given the amount of O2 tanks, could've been a rich mix, guys doing some work inside the deck house, odorless leak and somebody generates a spark....just all speculation.

Do you have a link or something substantial that they did indeed have more than medical bottles of O2 onboard?

Unless they were partial blending nitrox, which I don't believe they were, the only O2 they likely had where medical-style bottles for a medical emergency/decompression injury. If they where partial blending it certainly was not taking place in the galley area. Most liveaboard use membrane systems to make nitrox. From what I have heard this was a recreational trip. Maybe if someone had a rebreather but for a short trip they wouldn't have needed too much O2 and again it would have been on a different deck.

The only thing we know for sure is the onboard K bottle, everything else is speculating.
The assumption I made (probably shouldn't have on a forum) was there was a lot of o2 bottles onboard; no idea if there was a lot or, just the one. This was based upon my own knowledge from past trips like this is usually full of experienced divers, with some holding instructor certs, which means they're carrying their o2 rescue kits with them. Rebreathers are becoming common, or, they're not unusual to see, they've got their bottles.
Fiddling around at 0330 with bottles and kit, probably not likely. Boat mechanical/electrical is more plausible.