I love it when people lease cars for 1 year. It then lets me buy a basically new certified pre-owned lease turn-in with ~10k miles on it for way less money than it would have been brand new... Thanks for taking that depreciation hit for me!

quote:

Originally posted by captain127:
You never have to drop 1500 bucks on new tires, etc.

On a 1 or 2 year lease, sure. But that's not guaranteed on a 3 year/36k mile lease like you're discussing in your post.

I've only ever had one set of OEM factory tires make it to 36k miles. (The factory Michelin LTX M/S tires on my Honda Ridgeline, which were high quality tires and went to almost 50k.)

The OEM tires on everything else I've owned seemed to be lower tier tires that typically last just 25k-30k miles. For example, I just replaced the factory tires on my Mazda CX-5 at only 2.5 years old/28k miles since they were nearing 3/32 tread depth with winter approaching. Same story with my immediate prior car, a Subaru Forester, whose factory tires wore out at 2.5 years old/30k miles.

In that case, you'd be looking at having to foot the bill to put new tires on a car that will be someone else's in less than a year.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: RogueJSK,

I think it makes sense but there's a very narrow set of conditions where it makes sense:

-someone like V-Tail who doesn't drive much and where most of his driving is very local.
-someone like my wife who only drives local to drop off/pick up the kid to/from school, run errands, etc.
-if the employer is paying for it, that always makes financial sense.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:

quote:

Originally posted by captain127:

My lease including maintenance was 149 a month. Drive a new car for 3 bucks a day

The maff is not working for me.

Oops $5 a day. That is what it was.

I should stress the importance of doing the math of how much driving you will do. My round trip for work was 30 miles round trip a day and the vehicles would stay parked on the weekends usually. When I turned in the Honda's they had about 35700 to 35850 miles on them. Overage was I think 10 or 15 cents per mile after the 36000. A woman I worked with ended up with an extra 8k owed because of mileage, she ended up buying the car.

Leasing would make sense if you have a high amount of disposable income and you want to change to a new car relatively frequently. Steve Jobs did that, changing cars every 6 months so he did not even have to register for a plate.

It also makes sense if you can expense the lease to a business.

But, otherwise, if you're looking at dollars, it's a better deal to buy a one to two year old car that's high end. High end because chances are, the person didn't drive it rough and they took the hit on the depreciation already. Then just drive it until repair costs becomes consistently 20% of the value of the car.

I've always shoot for 300,000 miles, never gotten close but just under 250,000 before I gave it away. We either have donated our old cars or given it to someone.

quote:

Originally posted by 229DAK:

quote:

Bottom line, now that vehicles are essentially TV sets on wheels, I think it makes more sense to treat them as consumables rather than investments.

I have never treated a car as an investment.

AI agree. An investment hopefully either earns you money or appreciate in value. I don't think we're talking about the equivalent of a corvette and stuffing it in a garage. A car is just the cost of doing business or living expense.

quote:

Originally posted by 229DAK:

quote:

Bottom line, now that vehicles are essentially TV sets on wheels, I think it makes more sense to treat them as consumables rather than investments.

I have never treated a car as an investment.

Agreed. A car has never been an investment.

I have generally thought leases were not good options for most people. Prefontaine said what I would have said.

quote:

Originally posted by hpopa89:
Plus, getting into a new vehicle every few years is pretty sweet.

Which comes at the hefty cost of always having a car payment, which isn't sweet.

But yes, if you're the type of person whose top priority is wanting a brand new one every 2-3 years anyway, then leasing can sometimes be the less bad option for achieving that, compared to buying new every 2-3 years and trading it back in.

But there's a lot of miles and years between when a reasonably priced car is paid off and when its repair bills would eventually start overtaking its remaining value. And you never get the benefit of that by leasing.

As others have said, the financially responsible thing to do is to buy a lightly used car, pay it off ASAP, and then drive it for another 100k+, with no car payment but potentially the occasional smaller repair bill.

I tend to buy lightly used cars with ~10k miles, then drive them until 100k-150k, and trade them in towards the next lightly used car while they still have decent trade-in value and before any major issues start to crop up.

Best of all, all those years of not having a car payment mean that I can put some of those monthly funds towards saving up a hefty down payment on my next car (as well as covering the occasional any minor repair issue that may pop up along the way), meaning I rarely have to finance much on each car.

A new car every couple years may seem pretty sweet, but I guarantee it's not as sweet as not having debt.

Generally no. But, If you can write off everything and/or you need a nicer newer car to impress clients etc. realtor or other sales.

Or. Like in case of my wife’s single best friend. Wants a new car every few years due to low maintenance requirements and reliability, doesn’t mind the payments. Likes the implied status of a car that is generally more expensive (BMW/Mercedes/Lexus) than she would be able to buy. Will stay under the mileage limits and is garage kept while at home. She knows it’s a bum deal financially but doesn’t care.

Or your employer requires it and you are getting a healthy car allowance as part of your compensation package.

There are likely other scenarios I’m missing.

Leases make sense in a particular situation, as others have stated.

In some business situations, a lease makes a lot of sense.

As to a vehicle NOT being an investment, to play the contrarian, there are cases where this isn't true. ElToro points out the sales situation. Great point. The other scenarios might include the trades.

Some trades require a certain vehicle of particular capability. A pickup with 4-wheel drive and clearance and the ability to haul tools or other components. A mobile diesel mechanic is a common thing where I live, they drive highly customized medium and heavy duty trucks, often with generators, air compressors, cranes, and TONS of tools. Some employees on the oil fields or other non-typical sites (forestry and logging also come to mind) are required to get themselves to the job site.

In my business, I also need specialized vehicles to access the site for the contracted service. These include airplanes, snow machines, SXS's/Wheelers, SUAS/Drones, 4x4 trucks, etc. Each has its own cost/benefit equation.

In these cases, leasing might make sense to get started if it is an option. Financing a vehicle that other people don't see the benefit of, such as a "gas-guzzling" large truck or SUV, that is required for work should be seen as any other tool.

Mike Rowe brought this subject to light in recent years. Society, in general, seems to deem it unfair for young people to be saddled with debt for student loans but this same crowd doesn't bat an eye at the young mechanic with a 10 to 20-year high-interest loan for tools and a pickup so they can work in their trade.

I consider expensive purchases of tools (vehicles can be tools) that facilitate income generation to be investments.

quote:

Originally posted by AKSuperDually:

As to a vehicle NOT being an investment, to play the contrarian, there are cases where this isn't true. ElToro points out the sales situation. Great point. The other scenarios might include the trades.

I agree with you. This is why I said prior, that it’s not black and white but grey.
Not everyone buys a vehicle for cookie cutter commuting and such, only. Performance cars, are an investment. 4X4’s and off-road machinery I would say the same. Any of these, may be well modded where the owner doesn’t stop with the purchase, they outfit it with suspension, brake upgrades, more power, etc. It’s less expensive today than it will be in just a few years. My performance car I bought in ‘23, same trim today is $3k-4k more expensive in MY2025. That’s 2 model years and the price has increased that much. If you bought something, as I did, and plan on keeping it 15-20 years, or to death, I would say yeah that’s in investment. Especially like my example as it will be used at the track and you have to factor in consumables such as tires, brake pads/rotors, and gas into the equation. None of this is ever as simple as people make it out to be. That’s because different strokes for different folks. Some will use their machinery for mountain roads, twisty roads, or go off-road, or go to the track. Even my 11 year old daily driver was an investment, that’s paid off well seeing as it’s rock solid 11 years later. The money that POS has saved me has been substantial. I power it off the sun and its kept mundane mileage off the odometers of other vehicles I own so they will all last much longer compared to daily driving them.

Leasing makes sense if you don't put a ton of miles on and want to avoid huge repair bills later.

quote:

Originally posted by rcpylon:
Leasing makes sense if you don't put a ton of miles on and want to avoid huge repair bills later.

Nope. Sorry. That actually doesn't make (financial) sense.

If you don't put a ton of miles on your car, then you're a decade or more away from having "huge repair bills" on a quality car from a reliable manufacturer.

Cars don't just blow up at 50k miles. (Well, Kias and Hyundais aside... ) 100k-150k+ problem-free miles is the norm for many of the cars out there, with only basic scheduled maintenance needed.

And besides, imagine how much money you could have saved up to cover any eventual repair bills since you didn't have a car payment at all for most of those years... Tens of thousands of dollars!

Go see Cal.

Total thread drift… Cal Worthington was a great west coast institution of used car dealers and his campy late night commercials were legendary. He was also a WWII bomber pilot with 29 missions completed.

Leasing has never been a good idea. Its long term renting a car where you eat all of the depreciation. Its literally the most expensive way to "purchase" a vehicle.

quote:

Originally posted by AKSuperDually:
As to a vehicle NOT being an investment, to play the contrarian, there are cases where this isn't true.

I'll join the contrarian-ness.
My car's not the sort of an investment that's going to gain value (like a '63 Vette, for instance), but it's required for getting my tail to work every day. From that view, it's an investment in my own continued income.