Good morning SF brain trust. The recent storm and current cold spell has me investigating getting a portable generator as a home back up solution.

The last time I did this in 1997 I had my electrician wire up a 6 circuit manual transfer switch and just used my 6500 watt construction generator and everything worked fine.

Now with everything having electronic components I was wondering if, while waiting to get on my electricians schedule, I try and plug in my fridge directly from the generator could be an issue because the generator has a floating neutral. In reading about this I saw that this would temporarily solve this issue…
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FC..._fed_asin_title&th=1

Am I correct in thinking this will work in the interim?

Also, I was talking to one of my sons who lives in VA where the temps have been much colder and his Generac generator states that it has a “Neutral bonded to the frame”. What exactly does that mean as far as him being able to directly plug appliances into his generator?

Any help would be appreciated.
Thanks.

Here's the 'short' of it (pardon the pun)

The VAST Majority of portable generators have a bonded neutral, meaning the neutral is bonded to the ground of the generator frame. If you are plugging an appliance, or anything else directly into a portable generator, you want a bonded neutral.

If you are connecting a portable generator to the electrical system of your home, you will VERY likely want/need a floating neutral. In this case it 'can' depend on which electrical panel you are connecting to/through and how/where it is grounded. This is especially important when there are sub-panels to the main service panel, and if you're using a transfer switch that switches the neutral. Ultimately you want ONE Ground for the system, (NOT multiple grounds with different potentials!), and it should be the ground for your panel.

Regarding the linked product on Amazon, if your portable generator has a floating neutral, that product will work in the interim if you intend to plug an appliance, or anything else DIRECTLY into it.

Neutral bonding is what you need when running extension cords. Most gensets ship this way from manufacturers. Grabbing an unbonded appliance may result in a fatality.

The unbonded neutral is needed when you are connecting a genset to your whole house through a transfer switch (unless it also switches your neutral) or power inlet box with interlock device.

Generally the cheapest and easiest way to get power back to the house is a power inlet box/interlock. Most generators are fairly easy to unbond, especially the newer ones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gchq6G5Wc8M Interesting video on this topic .

quote:

Originally posted by selogic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gchq6G5Wc8M Interesting video on this topic .

That was the video that brought me down this rabbit hole. He does a great job explaining the various setups. Unfortunately my multimeter is in VA and I’m in NC so I’ll have to wait to find out definitely…

PS. I’m wondering if he’s related to PHPaul??

quote:

Originally posted by smlsig:
Now with everything having electronic components I was wondering if, while waiting to get on my electricians schedule, I try and plug in my fridge directly from the generator could be an issue because the generator has a floating neutral. In reading about this I saw that this would temporarily solve this issue…
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0FC..._fed_asin_title&th=1

Am I correct in thinking this will work in the interim?

Yes, that will solve the problem and it won't hurt the generator if it already has a bonded neutral (which yours apparently does not have). The danger would be using it when connected to a bonded home wiring system. I love laminated instructions for these situations. That way if I forget the details or someone else decides to use the generator, there laminated card helps prevent problems.

The issue is going to be how exactly the power inlet is wired to your breaker box. If the house wiring ground bond is intact, you want your generator to be UNbonded. If somehow that ground bond is disconnected when the generator is selected, you'd want a bonded generator.

Using a knowledgeable electrician to wire that power inlet might be a good idea, and ask questions about the bonding to be sure you understand how he wires your system.

Ok, I am learning something new. I watched the linked video, and it did a great job. However, it brought up a question. Exactly how big of a deal is it to use a floating neutral power source with corded devices, e.g., a power saw, drill, etc.?

The reason I ask is that I was completely un-aware of the bonded/non-bonded neutral issue before now. Yet, I have a Bluetti power pack and a Honda EU3000is, both apparently with floating neutrals. I have used corded tools many, many times with no issue. There also isn't any significant warning in the user manuals about it, either. The Honda does say to be sure to use a floating neutral when plugging into a transfer switch or RV, but nothing about when using it stand alone. In today's litigious society, it is hard for me to imagine a manufacturer selling devices with 3-prong outlets clearly intended to have some current drawing appliance plugged into it, without some significant warnings about running it with the floating neutral.

Was I just extremely lucky?

Dr.Dan I believe that the reason that you didn’t have any problems (and I didn’t either when using tools at the jobsite) is at least in part due to the fact that these tools don’t require a pure sine wave and there are minimal, if any electronics involved unlike say a newer fridge or tv.

But I’m learning about this too so I could be way off.

quote:

Originally posted by DrDan:
Exactly how big of a deal is it to use a floating neutral power source with corded devices, e.g., a power saw, drill, etc.?

The bonding of neutral to ground is to prevent electrocution. If the casing of the tool or appliance is metal, it will be connected to ground. Assuming the neutral is bonded to ground, only the hot wire is a danger. If it shorts to ground it will pop the breaker. But if the ground is floating, it means it isn't connected to anything. If the hot wire touches the casing, the casing becomes energized and you can be electrocuted if you touch the casing and something else that is grounded.

My metal cased circular saw has a 3 prong plug, but the plastic cased drill only has 2 prongs. That's because the drill is double insulated, meaning it is essentially impossible for anything I touch to be energized.

Power tools have no electronic circuitry other than a switch and a motor. They don't care if the ground is floating to operate (but it could zap the user).

Apparently it is common for furnace computer boards to test for a floating or bonded ground before running. So it won't run if your generator isn't bonded.