quote:

Originally posted by old rugged cross:
And I am on record saying the F150 isn't much of a real truck.

None of these are horrible rigs for what they are. I am just not a fan for my use.

If you are in flat, interstate county and do not need a regular hauler or tower any of these rigs will do fine. But the offering's of 1/2 ton pickup's and suv's these days are just fancy grocery/kid haulers. Not serious HD rigs like days gone by.

In pickups you still have the option of a 3/4 or one ton. In an Suv about the only thing left is the Sequoia that is a HD rig, imho

The Sequoia be it a great rig but is only capable of towing 7200 pounds.

The Expedition is capable of 2000 more pounds and has the 10 Speed transmission. Plus if you get the Max (extended length) you are gaining stability with the extra length.

Not really sure what you are basing things off of.

2017 Expedition Limited EL 4x4 owner here. The 3.5L Ecoboost is much more capable than the 5.0L Coyote, due to the very wide torque band the turbos provide. I've got 55k miles on mine, change the oil every 5k with full synthetic. Had a bearing in the front diff start making noise around 24k miles, replaced under warranty. No other issues. The new generation has an updated engine, to solve carbon deposit issues on the valves as I understand it, and the new 10 speed transmission. Can't say I've towed anything heavy, only an occasional ~4,000# utility trailer. The factory brake controller system worked great for that, no problems with power either.
My dad and I have made trips from NC to SD for the past 2 years for pheasant hunting with our gear and dog in it, and it was extremely comfortable. Compared to his 2015 Silverado with the 5.3L V8, the Expedition is much more powerful, rarely needing to downshift. I've been very happy with mine, and plan to keep it a very long time.

Hook 7000 lbs to a sequoia and Expedition and head up a mountain pass in NW part of the country and see what happens. I would take the Sequoia all day long. Hook 9000lbs to an expedition and try it. That is laughable.

Threaddrift

Isn't the Sequoia pretty much an SUV-ified Tundra?

Laughing a bit at the F150 not being a 'real' truck. Not everyone needs an HD with a Duramax/PowerStroke/Cummins for their daily driver.
Pretty sure the majority of 1/2 tons trucks today are far more capable (and comfortable) than the 1/2 ton trucks from 10-20 years ago.
I can't imagine my dad's 98 GMC Sierra (350cid, IIRC) being able to do half of what my F150 with its baby 2.7l V6 could do.

quote:

Pretty sure the majority of 1/2 tons trucks today are far more capable (and comfortable) than the 1/2 ton trucks from 10-20 years ago.

I'll up you on that. My neighbors 2015 F-150 will out tow my 2002 F-250. My max is 12K with the 5.4gas while his ecoboost will tow 12.9K.

Yeah, I'm laughing too that an F-150 isn't a "real" truck.

Just came back from a 15K mile trip to Alaska and back and noticed a lot of the Expedition Max’s towing campers etc. seemed like it had plenty of power and looked stable.

quote:

And I am on record saying the F150 isn't much of a real truck.

None of these are horrible rigs for what they are. I am just not a fan for my use.

If you are in flat, interstate county and do not need a regular hauler or tower any of these rigs will do fine. But the offering's of 1/2 ton pickup's and suv's these days are just fancy grocery/kid haulers. Not serious HD rigs like days gone by.

In pickups you still have the option of a 3/4 or one ton. In an Suv about the only thing left is the Sequoia that is a HD rig, imho

Have you ever towed anything with one?

The Sequoia? It's a cheapened up Land Cruiser for the American market. I'll agree that current rigs are bloated and too expensive, but their capability for towing has been much enhanced over previous models.

I currently own a 2001 Dodge Ram 2500 with the Cummins IBT. An engine that needs no introduction. The truck will pull anything, but it's loud, hunts for gears, wanders, jars the teeth out of your head, and basically struggles in the mountains. The truck is immaculate and well maintained. Not some worn out beater. I have also leased a new F150 since 2006. I will say hands down, without any hesitation that an F150 with the 3.5 Ecoboost and the tow package is the greatest tow vehicle I have ever used. The 3.5 makes something around 470 ft/lbs of torque at 2500 rpm.

I have towed vehicles through the mountains on interstate 77 with both, I have towed camper trailers from Phoenix to Flagstaff with both. I would take the F150 every day all day over that Dodge. In fact, the last time I was hauling a Toyota Rav 4 from Savannah to Pittsburgh on a car hauler I was doing 80mph up a grade on I77 while turning 2200 RPM. I don't care who you are, that's fantastic.

Yea ajf, I have. my brother has one. nice rig, for what it is. I will take my Tundra 5.7 with six speed tranny all day long over his eco for towing. Hands down.

I am on my 2nd F150 with a 3.5 ecoboost. I have not had any issues and will seek it out in the future. A buddy of mine has a 6.2 liter v8 Denali and it has to get the rpms way up pulling anything on hills, while my ecoboost barely downshifts pulling the same boat. Twin turbos torque is hard to match for a gas engine.

Towing Capacity Pickups USA

2020 Ram 3500 Heavy Duty | up to 35,100 pounds
2020 GMC Sierra/Chevrolet Silverado 3500HD | up to 35,500 pounds
2020 Ford F-450 Super Duty | up to 37,000 pounds
2020 Chevrolet Silverado/GMC Sierra 2500HD | up to 18,500
2020 Ford F-250 Super Duty | up to 20,000 pounds
2020 Ram 1500 | up to 12,750 pounds
2020 Ford F-150 | up to 13,200 pounds
2020 Chevrolet Silverado/GMC Sierra 1500 | up to 12,100 pounds
2020 Toyota Tundra - 8,800 and 10,200 pounds

Toyota Official Specs Page

We have a 2018 Max Platinum. It is fantastic. The engine is awesome! Have not done any towing.

I’d be happy to answer any questions.

I've got the 3.5 Ecoboost in my 2019 F-150 and love it. My only complaint is you can have Eco or Boost, not both. Drive like grandma and it will get decent mileage, have fun with it and the mileage takes a big hit. Cruising at 65mph and lower 20+mpg, cruising at 75mph or higher, less than 17mpg.

The 10 speed transmission is great with its multiple drive modes; Sport encouraged juvenile behavior, Snow/Wet does make a big difference in winter driving.

In 2013 I sought out a 5.0 thinking simpler motor less things to go wrong. I did do an intake and exhaust on it and I really do miss the sounds that truck made. When I traded it in, I made the mistake of test driving a 3.5 Ecoboost, the low end torque is addicting. Much more responsive than the 5.0. The 5.0 really has to rev high to make power, the Ecoboost doesn't.

I've got a 2014 F-150 SuperCrew with the Ecoboost. No engine problems, accelerates like an old school V8 and I still get 18+ mpg, even with the way I drive it. I test drove all the pickups at the time, wasn't impressed with most of them, the Toyota seemed like it lacked low end, but that was 7 model years ago.

I have a 2018 F-150 Raptor, twin turbo 3.5, 10 speed. I haven’t had any issues with it yet, but only 12k miles on it. It gets about 25 mpg for interstate travel when doing the speed limit...and is so very fast when you want it.

Towing uphill in high elevations is going to starve a naturally aspirated engine long before it would on anything turbo charged. So saying the eco boost is going to be outperformed in that situation by a NA engine with similar HP & torque ratings is simply wrong.

I can’t imagine why one would think the sequoia is heavier duty than an expedition. It’s nice it has a v8 but the tow rating is way less. And everything else about is way less except that it has certainly has the normal Toyota edge in reliability. I’m in full agreement these are light duty vehicles and that’s why I drive HD trucks. But when I shopped for these for my wife the best of the bunch is the expedition.

Thanks again for the feedback guys. I've got a 2017 Tundra crewmax 4x4 for the primary towing duty. The boat and trailer ready to go fishing weigh in around 7000 lbs and all my towing is in Florida. I know the sequoia is the same motor and drivetrain but it doesn't have leaf springs in the rear like the tundra does and can't handle as much weight / squats more than the Tundra. The 5.7L is thirsty, but is also bulletproof.

The wife just really like the expedition max for the looks and roominess. I just want to make sure it's reliable and will decently hold it's value. I paid $37k for my Tundra in 2017 and can get $34-35k in trade (50k miles and 3.5 years later). I tried to convince my wife to drive a Tundra crewmax for the mommy mobile but she isn't warming up to that idea.

My current truck is a 2012 F150 and will be hitting 180K miles by the end of then month. My wife has a 2017 Expedition that will probably hit 100K miles in the next month or two. They both have the 3.5 ecoboost and have been reliable. I think the base curb weight of her expedition is actually higher than my truck but both move around pretty easily with the 3.5. I usually average 15-17mpg and she gets 19-20 mpg on average.

quote:

Originally posted by Rev. A. J. Forsyth:

The Sequoia? It's a cheapened up Land Cruiser for the American market.

Not just no, but fuck no.

Never. Ever. Compare a Sequoia to a Land Cruiser.

A Land Cruiser is Toyota's flagship vehicle. It is engineered from the ground up on its own chassis, designed for an ultra-long lifecycle and durability above all else. It is not a Sequoia. It is not a 4 runner.

A Sequoia is gussied up Tundra. A 4 Runner a gussied up Tacoma. Those are American market trucks, built to US standards and needs. As nice as those vehicles are, they are not Land Cruisers nor derived from one.

(The Land Cruiser Prado, which exists in other parts of the world, shares the same platform as a 4runner and Lexus GX470. The Land Cruiser Prado is only related to the Land Cruiser in name.)

I have a 2018 Expedition limited 2wd, that I took delivery of new in June 2018. I'm very happy with it. The ecoboost has plenty of power and 10 speed auto is seemless. I get 17 mpg heavy city traffic and 21-22 mpg on the highway at 80 mph. I really like it and it's my 5th new Expedition. Sadly I only have 17k miles on it, it's my daily driver, but I'm out of town a lot. I have had to have all of the shocks replaced under warranty recently as they were leaking, other than that it has been trouble free. It's much better than my previous 2008.....I like the aluminum body......and interior......The fold flat second and third row seats are great if going to Home Depot.

If I were to go smaller it would be the new Explorer without a doubt.