Saudi national Naval Aviation student shooting incident at Pensacola NB -

December 07, 2019, 06:29 AM

Saudi students in the program are prohibited from possessing firearms by their own general orders.
Regarding US citizens Unless you are law enforcement on duty firearms and ammunition are prohibited on the Navy base. They are hard over on this. A few years back they even stopped the Sheriff from coming on another nearby base for a function because he was armed. I won't go on the base because I always have firearms and ammo in my vehicle. They do search vehicles at random and will prosecute. See how well these gun free zones work. Shades of Fort Hood, Washington Navy Yard, Tn Naval Reserve Center.....

December 07, 2019, 07:54 AM

Kraquin

quote:
Originally posted by PowerSurge:
First the 911 hijackers and now this?! Every one of them should be sent the fuck home but it’ll never happen.

Agreed. On a similar note, I work at a very large DoD facility and there are many naturalized citizens from various countries working on various projects, some requiring security clearances. It's bad enough when a U.S. born citizen engages in espionage so I have never agreed with taking the risk to let naturalized citizens even have access to DoD facilities.

December 07, 2019, 08:10 AM

PowerSurge

quote:
Originally posted by FishOn:
Some more background from Zero Hedge

https://www.zerohedge.com/poli...-were-filming-attack

“The FBI is leading the investigation....”

Why do I not feel reassured by that fact?

December 07, 2019, 08:35 AM

chbibc

Other Saudi nationals have now been detained for questioning, including three seen filming the attack.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/1...wRVe19NXqoylMpRsnMmQ

December 07, 2019, 08:50 AM

kimber1911

quote:
Originally posted by chbibc:
Other Saudi nationals have now been detained for questioning, including three seen filming the attack.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/1...wRVe19NXqoylMpRsnMmQ

Unauthorized weapons are not allowed on the base, Captain Kinsella said, adding, “You ~~can’t~~ not supposed to bring a weapon on base unless you’re part of the security forces because there are signs posted .”

Fixed it for you there Captain.
We need a few good reporters to ask why?
Simple question, you would think should be taught in journalism school.
Why, can’t someone bring a weapon on base?
Oh, a sign.
How effective has this sign been?
This tactic has left the law abiding defense twice this week on Navy bases.

“We’re in a situation where we have put together, and you guys did it for our administration…President Obama’s administration before this. We have put together, I think, the most extensive and inclusive voter fraud organization in the history of American politics,”
Pres. Select, Joe Biden

“Let’s go, Brandon” Kelli Stavast, 2 Oct. 2021

December 07, 2019, 09:09 AM

Balzé Halzé

quote:
Originally posted by chbibc:
Other Saudi nationals have now been detained for questioning, including three seen filming the attack.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/1...wRVe19NXqoylMpRsnMmQ

Those other six if they knew about the plans for the attack, particularly those who were filming it, should be tried and ultimately executed by the feds.

December 07, 2019, 09:31 AM

oddball

quote:
Originally posted by erj_pilot:
I personally do NOT think for one minute the Saudis “...love the American people”. Sorry. Just don’t buy it. I think they’re just good at “playing nice”.

December 07, 2019, 10:05 AM

92fstech

quote:
Originally posted by chbibc:
Other Saudi nationals have now been detained for questioning, including three seen filming the attack.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/1...wRVe19NXqoylMpRsnMmQ

WTF? You're telling me that instead of doing something to stop their murderous asshole buddy, the other Saudis whipped out their cell-phones and started the recording the attack like a bunch of teenage girls?

I've never been in the military, but as a cop, if something like this went down and I was "seen filming it" instead of doing something to stop it or otherwise protect innocent life, I could count on being out of a job the next day, and they'd probably do everything within their power to find something to charge me with criminally as well. I would expect that expectation for a military officer would be similar. And you'd also expect that a foreign military officer (we're not talking about some conscript enlisted guy here) on assignment overseas would have been briefed on and have some understanding of the diplomatic implications of his behavior and those of his fellow officers while on that assignment.

Only two conclusions can reasonably be draw from that behavior: that this was a premeditated, organized attack, and those other individuals were not only in on the planning of it, but also were recording it for propaganda purposes. Or these guys are just assholes and grossly unfit to be military officers.

Try them, and if they're found to be involved, line them up in front of a wall and send their corpses back to Saudi Arabia in a bag.

December 07, 2019, 10:13 AM

corsair

The trajectory of the US-Saudi relationship may have run its course. While strategically, a good relationship, the reality at the operational level is one of unimpressive results. Keeping their oil flowing supports the Asian & European economies and prevents disastrous second and third order effects, nevertheless, the US can't be the guardians for everyone while pushing aside bad Saudi acting. From its pathetic war effort in Yemen, the killing of journalist Khashogi, its bickering with Qatar, the recent espionage arrests of 3 nationals and now this. Saudi isn't a good ally, their nationals all seem to be charged with religious-political extremism, their political decision making and its implantation is bad. It's time to cut these clowns off.

December 07, 2019, 10:14 AM

6guns

quote:
that this was a premeditated, organized attack, and those other individuals were not only in on the planning of it, but also were recording it for propaganda purposes.

That was my first thought.

December 07, 2019, 10:25 AM

Tinyman

[QUOTE]Originally posted by HCM:

And he chose to go to another "gun free zone", which is what all US Military bases are, unless you are at the range or a cop.

Haven't figured this out yet. I live 1 1/2 hours from the closest military base (Maxwell AFB) and since I can't have a pistol IN MY CAR on base (yes, permit in my billfold), I am unarmed for the 3+ hours to-and-from.

Maybe if there were licensed carry folks in HI & FL the damage could have been less.

Tinyman

December 07, 2019, 10:25 AM

sigfreund

Although we’re drifting into speculation without conclusive evidence, which is why parabellum banned these threads in the first place, I agree that the filming suggests it wasn’t a “lone wolf” incident. On the other hand, how does an incident like this benefit the Saudi government? As pointed out, the government has suffered a number of black eyes that affected its relations with the US, so why would they sponsor a pinprick attack that would only make their relationship worse?

December 07, 2019, 10:27 AM

mcrimm

If these foreign nationals want to learn about our technology, have them watch a YouTube video. We didn't invent or perfect our high tech ships, planes, electronics, etc for your benefit or on your dime. Go home - Today on your dime.

December 07, 2019, 10:36 AM

Bigboreshooter

quote:
Originally posted by PowerSurge:
quote:
Originally posted by FishOn:
Some more background from Zero Hedge

https://www.zerohedge.com/poli...-were-filming-attack

“The FBI is leading the investigation....”

Why do I not feel reassured by that fact?

Under swamp-dweller Wray's direction, they will likely "publish whatever narrative they feel will be the most "negative" towards Trump and will most likely help the Dems.

December 07, 2019, 10:37 AM

92fstech

quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
Although we’re drifting into speculation without conclusive evidence, which is why parabellum banned these threads in the first place, I agree that the filming suggests it wasn’t a “lone wolf” incident. On the other hand, how does an incident like this benefit the Saudi government? As pointed out, the government has suffered a number of black eyes that affected its relations with the US, so why would they sponsor a pinprick attack that would only make their relationship worse?

You're correct in that it's probably speculation at this point, and maybe it's jumping the gun a bit, as we all know the news media isn't great at details, especially early on following an event like this. But to answer your question, I'm not suggesting that the Saudi government had anything to do with it. Sure it's possible, but it's also possible that you've got a small group of assholes who got radicalized and decided to pull this off on behalf of some whackjob group or another. Without more information, it's way to early to draw that conclusion.

My commentary wasn't attempting to point fingers at the source, just highlight the outrageous behavior of these guys filming their cohort shooting up a US Navy base.

December 07, 2019, 10:38 AM

V-Tail

quote:
Originally posted by mcrimm:

If these foreign nationals want to learn about our technology, have them watch a YouTube video.

I believe that the shooter was here for pilot training. Not going to learn that from watching a video (I am a Flight Instructor).

On the other hand, why are we selling our military aircraft to these people?

Why are we training their pilots?

December 07, 2019, 10:42 AM

sigfreund

Sorry, 92fstech, I wasn’t directing my comment at you. Others both here and elsewhere on the Internet who made the accusation much more directly were the ones I was asking that (rhetorical) question of. And rhetorical only because I hardly expect an answer; not that I wouldn’t like one.

December 07, 2019, 10:54 AM

corsair

quote:
Originally posted by V-Tail:
On the other hand, why are we selling our military aircraft to these people?

Why are we training their pilots?

Soft power political tool. Buy our hardware, let us set up a base/port, have liaison teams in your military, we'll train your 'best personal'.

Foreign officers who spend time in America understand our country better and usually form positive impressions about it and the US military they work with while they are here. This can pay dividends as they rise in the ranks and become senior officers. In addition, through training the US makes allies more capable of defending their countries or working in conjunction with U.S. forces, both of which can save American lives and aid U.S. interests. This has worked with our European and Asian allies, given that there's established exchange programs and basing with many of those countries. With the ME 'allies' it's a spotty record, particularly given the 'quality' of their students.

December 07, 2019, 11:07 AM

flashguy

quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
Although we’re drifting into speculation without conclusive evidence, which is why parabellum banned these threads in the first place, I agree that the filming suggests it wasn’t a “lone wolf” incident. On the other hand, how does an incident like this benefit the Saudi government? As pointed out, the government has suffered a number of black eyes that affected its relations with the US, so why would they sponsor a pinprick attack that would only make their relationship worse?

I don't necessarily think that the Saudi government sponsored the attack, just that they sent over someone who would do so (for a different purpose). Wahhabi Islam is a very radical form and the one most prevalent in Saudi Arabia. It is not surprising that any of the followers might commit terrorism.

flashguy