RE- profit margins of fentanyl versus weed.

I think that the missing piece of this argument is supply versus demand. When supply is everywhere, prices are lower. When supply is tight, prices go up (as do profit margins)

Weed is way more available then fentanyl, which drives the lower profit margin. Most all fentanyl users smoke weed. Not all weed users use fentanyl.

I don’t keep up with drug seizures that much. But, I do know that for a couple of years way back, weed and PCP was a thing.

So, in theory the addition of fentanyl wouldn’t be unheard of, but another mechanism to get fentanyl out there. And based upon experience, fentanyl dealers really don’t consider the health and well being of their clients.

quote:

Originally posted by mutedblade:


I lived in La Junta Colorado (SE CO) from 2007-13. The shit was getting too real for us so we packed up and left. Open gunfights along Highway 50 and surrounding areas between cartels was crazy. Friends were at a restaurant in Rocky Ford, CO that was a backdrop for a drive-by which was promptly covered up with no coverage by the media. It's insane to think that this shit is happening in our country. It would be one thing if it was a one off occurrence, but it happens daily and nobody in the government seems to care.

Good on you for getting out. It hasn't improved since you left.
My brother and I were talking about this shit last weekend and he said they are now setting up a roadblock on backroads when they see someone coming. They get the occupants out at gun point and rob them of everything and send them walking back. The police down there have found two vehicles looted and hidden in the hills with no trace of the owner anywhere so god only knows what went down there.
No media coverage on that either. Shit's bad.

^^^ Yup, was a time I enjoyed exploring the logging / fire-service roads with a 4WD.

Lots of fun, and some great places to stop, set up some tin cans and start plinking.

But I don't go out on those roads any more. A friend had a close call when he ran into the wrong people there. Luckily he was able to quickly turn around and get the heck out of Dodge.

quote:

Originally posted by dsiets:
Looking up a local store near me, a gram of flower is $6 or $25 for an 1/8 oz. W/ 16% tax, this is like $7 or $29 out the door.

That's pretty reasonable if it's quality. I used to pay $50 for an eighth from a buddy for indoor medical grade hydro stuff back in like, 2008. A hundred for a quarter, $300 for his oz, which was 34 grams and he'd deliver it, we'd smoke a few and he would leave the extra. Pricing stayed in that range in Washington for high quality stuff to maybe $35 on the cheaper end at the retail locations.

quote:

Originally posted by dsiets:
But I'm assuming $7 would last a good weekend. That doesn't seem that much (to me)unless you're a chronic smoker. Are most tokers smoking a gram/day normal? Sounds like = to a pack of cigs cost wise.

A gram of decent stuff will get you stoned. If you have any kind of tolerance, however, it's not going to last you long. I had a few bowls (pipes) that you could pack a ground half gram or so in. One hit was enough to be up where I wanted to be for an hour or so, then I'd finish it. Then probably the rest of it throughout the evening or the day, depending. Like Flash-LB says, most stoners love to wake and bake and keep smoking throughout the day. I never could afford to roll as hard as the most dedicated stoners. I'd say his neighbor goes through at least an eighth a day, probably more like a quarter. Maybe a QP a month. I had friends who easily smoked that much. They'd also make edibles. Had a friend that put a whole oz of this ridiculously potent stuff in about a 10x12" pan of brownies once. They made weed butter, weed oil, and threw the rest in with the mix. I had maybe a two inch square of that and then we walked a few blocks to a party. I was totally faced, and sat on the front porch for a few hours, looking at the stars and pondering the universe. A friend of ours disappeared, and it turns out he was following a cat that he was worried would get run over, and then was concerned it would fall out of the tree it climbed up to escape him. He spent several hours trying to talk it down. The people that made the brownies? You couldn't even tell they had most of the pan.

If the state could manage to lower their taxes on the legal stuff it would disincentivize the trafficking of the cheaper illegal weed.

But of course big daddy gov has to get his cut.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
If the state could manage to lower their taxes on the legal stuff it would disincentivize the trafficking of the cheaper illegal weed.

But of course big daddy gov has to get his cut.

Never happen. And if they did, the illegal market would just adjust their prices. As it is, they are already way below dispensary prices. States might ramp up enforcement, but the genie isn’t going back into the bottle.

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
If the state could manage to lower their taxes on the legal stuff it would disincentivize the trafficking of the cheaper illegal weed.

But of course big daddy gov has to get his cut.

Never happen. And if they did, the illegal market would just adjust their prices. As it is, they are already way below dispensary prices. States might ramp up enforcement, but the genie isn’t going back into the bottle.

Even if Illegal there are costs associated with production, processing, and transport. I'd bet every dollar I have a legitimate producer could do all of those things cheaper.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:
If the state could manage to lower their taxes on the legal stuff it would disincentivize the trafficking of the cheaper illegal weed.

But of course big daddy gov has to get his cut.

Never happen. And if they did, the illegal market would just adjust their prices. As it is, they are already way below dispensary prices. States might ramp up enforcement, but the genie isn’t going back into the bottle.

Even if Illegal there are costs associated with production, processing, and transport. I'd bet every dollar I have a legitimate producer could do all of those things cheaper.

Not if the price of marijuana in wv is any indicator; medical weed averages about $50 per 1/8th. A full illicit oz here (as per conversations I have had) is $150-160. That’s a huge difference to make up.

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:

Not if the price of marijuana in wv is any indicator; medical weed averages about $50 per 1/8th. A full illicit oz here (as per conversations I have had) is $150-160. That’s a huge difference to make up.

(Legal As of I think 2019)
Here in Michigan, a legal recreational OZ. is $160. Those w/ medical cards get a discount of some sort I think. So I'm still not seeing how the black market is making that much money.

For reference, this is legal store flower 15 min. from me.
https://www.medscafe.com/menu/...ll/categories/flower
I would assume any stoner would be all over this variety and service of testing for mold and such. 16% tax. Is WV much more than that?
I guess I just don't see the black market windfall of income.

Of course, residents can have up to 12(?) plants of their own. So then those aren't buying into the black market either.

So far in WV, it’s medical only, but we all know what a joke that is. Anyone can get a medical card if they claim some kind of chronic pain or other medical condition. Perhaps because the recreational angle hasn’t been passed yet, the industry isn’t entrenched enough to lower prices. For that I don’t have an answer. I only know what I’m told by people I know that buy it. For what it’s worth, these folks are not the type to care about being being in a system that might affect something like firearms ownership. They claim it’s easier and cheaper…at least for now.

When I search the price for legal marijuana in Oregon for instance, a state with a fairly long time with recreational weed, the price is still a good bit higher for high quality product. Looking at Michigan, the cost is being reported to be far lower due to a glut in marijuana supplies and something else- tiers of quality. Instead of every type being “top shelf”, there are lower thresholds in terms of thc potency. The articles I looked describe an analogy similar to what you’d see at a liquor store; very high thc, medium quality, and the cheap stuff. The articles also allude to the fact that illicit sales are still present but that they may not be able to compete with dropping prices- also that if they can be edged out, legal prices will likely rise again. I personally see illicit sales going away for good. If the legal price rises after illicit sales decrease, the black market weed will come back when consumers are faced with higher costs again.

Overall, it is interesting to watch but the end result concerns me- the occasionally smoking professional type, akin to a glass of wine at the end of the day (versus the heavy 12 pack of beer type smoker) will be the minority. Soma for the masses, as another put it.

quote:

Originally posted by FenderBender:

quote:

Originally posted by gearhounds:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by FenderBender:
If the state could manage to lower their taxes on the legal stuff it would disincentivize the trafficking of the cheaper illegal weed.

But of course big daddy gov has to get his cut.

Even if Illegal there are costs associated with production, processing, and transport. I'd bet every dollar I have a legitimate producer could do all of those things cheaper.

But how will we treat the addicts? Remember the war cry legalize it, tax it, and treat the addicts?

Was I lied to about the real use of the tax money?

"Addicts"? Weed??

While it may not be as seriously physically addictive as opiates or alcohol, marijuana is absolutely addictive in the same way that gambling, pornography, video games, and any number of other pleasurable escapes from reality can be. And there's increasing research support for some users developing actual neurological dependence on marijuana, with chronic (heh) users experiencing withdrawal symptoms as a result of their brain's reduction in production of and sensitivity to its own natural endocannabinoid neurotransmitter chemicals.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
"Addicts"? Weed??

Lol I know, I know.....

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
"Addicts"? Weed??

Bob Sagat/ "Weed? I used to suck dick for crack!"
In all seriousness though, yes, it's a behavioral issue as posted above like porn or gambling addiction is.
I have a few friends and family members that have succomed to the devils lettuce and they become human zombies. No ambition, lazy, compliant and content. They become dependent on it to relax or fall asleep and none of them to a person will have a conversation about the detriments of it, only how medicinal and beneficial they want to believe it is.

Leftists ruin everything, even the goose that laid the golden egg.

quote:

And there's increasing research support for some users developing actual neurological dependence on marijuana, with chronic (heh) users experiencing withdrawal symptoms as a result of their brain's reduction in production of and sensitivity to its own natural endocannabinoid neurotransmitter chemicals.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
You are correct. This literature has been around a long while. The THC content is higher and it absolutely affects the brains of teens in a significant way. Withdrawal can be quite protracted. Psychosis in the form of auditory and visual hallucinations is certainly possible. Overdoses which are not fatal produce elevated heart rate and blood pressure. These symptoms are more often seen in the ER.

Not to mention long term physical effects like cannabinoid hyperemesis syndrome.

^^^^^^^^^^^^
Yep. That is relatively new to ERs

Yeah, good luck with that, guys. If you want to start a crusade, ban alcohol, because it is FAR more damaging to the individual, the family unit and society in general.

Oh, wait, they tried that already. There's a clue for ya.

Cannabis grows on five (or six) of the seven continents and requires no post-harvesting processing other than drying. It has medicinal properties, but the synthetic form of it they give to chemo patients is nowhere near as effective as the real thing. You don't have to smoke it. You can bake it into foods, or you can inhale it in steam (vaping).

Naturally, anything can be abused, and if cannabis never existed, those abusers would be finding some other way to fuck up.

There are too many busybodies in this country.