I had a new water heater installed in my garage and the old water heater removed from inside the house. The new water heater is 5 feet from the main panel, line of sight while the old water heater was 60 feet away.


My plan is to pull the existing wire back across the attic and drop it down the garage wall in conduit to the heater's junction box.


What kind of conduit should I use? Flexible metallic or can I use flexible PVC? I don't own a tubing bender and would like the simplest method. According to each plumber I had bid, the inspectors here will fail it if the wire is not in conduit.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:
I had a new water heater installed in my garage and the old water heater removed from inside the house. The new water heater is 5 feet from the main panel, line of sight while the old water heater was 60 feet away.


My plan is to pull the existing wire back across the attic and drop it down the garage wall in conduit to the heater's junction box.


What kind of conduit should I use? Flexible metallic or can I use flexible PVC? I don't own a tubing bender and would like the simplest method. According to each plumber I had bid, the inspectors here will fail it if the wire is not in conduit.

If your code is like ours here in Central Florida, I'd recommend a different solution, which will also be easier and less expensive. Fish the existing wire down through the top plate and inside the wall behind the new water heater, then install a new in wall box behind the water heater and make the connection there. No need for conduit with that solution, and fishing the wire through that wall to the new box shouldn't be much of a challenge (I've done it dozens of times without much fuss).

The easiest way would be to get a 5+ ft. piece of Romex and run it from the box to the new heater. If it has to be in conduit (which seems odd), just buy some elbows. No bending required.

*I am not an electrician but recently wired a water heater into my own shop.*

ETA: It sounds like the plumbers you had bid are trying to milk you for extra parts and labor.

Well it must be a Florida thing, or it's located somewhere subject to physical damage. Definitely not required in DC, VA, or MD.

I'd do as bigdeal says. Run it through the wall. Set a 1900 box there. Use a blank plate with a knockout in the center and wire over from wall using liquid tight. I would not just run a non metallic cable from wall to heater though as it is still subject to physical damage.

Pre-made whip with liquid tight, connectors, and cable. You may need to remove one connector (take pic of how it assembles if you've never worked with it) and use a razor knife to shorten liquid tight, being careful not to damage cable within. The put back together connector and make splices at the junction box and HWH.

1900 Box

1900 box cover with KO

In addition to the above items you will need a 1/2" or 3/4" Romex connector to feed wire into back of the 1900 box, this will depend on age of wire, new stuff will fit in 1/2" connector, thicker/older may need 3/4".

Five or six wire nuts.

A ground screw to pigtail the wires to the box to ground it.

Two toggle bolts to attach box to drywall if it doesn't align with a stud.

Why the conduit? Is it a local code?

Here we would basically do as big deal suggested.

I can fish the wire through the wall, but that requires a box on the wall and conduit from the box to where the connections are made on the water heater itself. The pipes for the water heater are already exposed from the ceiling down, so one more thing on the surface of the wall isn't going to change much.


I could be misunderstanding and/or misremembering what the plumbers were saying. I'm sure they all said the connection had to be hardwired; meaning no plug like the old water heater had. I'm fairly sure at least one said it had to be in conduit.

Plumbers aren't trying to milk anything because they aren't electricians and aren't allowed to do anything with the wire. They all said I need and electrician and I need to pull a $100 permit.

We have another house in the same county and the wire is run from an FPL box on the wall through flexible PVC to the water heater. I believe it's a local thing.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:
...and conduit from the box to where the connections are made on the water heater itself.

Just use a piece of flex for that part.

This is what I did.

Would there be anything wrong with just running the same flex from the ceiling, down the wall, direct to the water heater and skipping the box? It's a couple extra feet of the flex and a couple straps to fasten it to the wall vs. a box, drilling through the top plate, and fishing the wire.

Skins may have a better answer, but I would think the box is preferable, if for no other reason than it's easier to connect the flex to vs. just the ceiling.

I had an easier go of it due to new construction, so it was kind of a no-brainer for me. With existing construction it would be a bit more difficult to cut out for and install a box but it shouldn't be too bad.

quote:

Originally posted by comet24:
Why the conduit? Is it a local code?

Here we would basically do as big deal suggested.

Here in FL it has to be in conduit if it's run outside of the wall, I know it is code. I don't know why it is code. Perhaps because it's mounted in a garage (rodents), most of our houses are CBS with block exterior walls, but some garage runs I've seen are exterior on the walls and inside metal conduit.

Electricians are going to do it one way, the right way. It's not an effort to run your bill up, it's so that the job is done right, so that it meets all codes and should last the life of the house (the flexible conduit probably wouldn't meet the latter).

I would just run brand new wire for the 5' run. You may want to keep the old wire where it is and terminate it on both ends if you could ever for see putting any appliance where the water heater used to reside (ie wall heater, refrigerator, air handler, etc.) in the future. If you do pull it, attach a pull cord (1/8" rope) and pull it with it and leave it on both ends in case you want to pull wire back through.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:
Skins may have a better answer, but I would think the box is preferable, if for no other reason than it's easier to connect the flex to vs. just the ceiling.

I had an easier go of it due to new construction, so it was kind of a no-brainer for me. With existing construction it would be a bit more difficult to cut out for and install a box but it shouldn't be too bad.

Skins approach is the solution. Wire a box into the wall and use a steel whip to connect to it like in your pick. That will also make service or replacement that much easier and keep you in compliance should you ever seek to sell the house.

As to pulling a permit, that's what's recommended, but for something this simple, I'd save the money and do the work myself. I'm not opposed to hiring an electrician for complicated stuff, but this should be a really simple fix. And cutting in a box is really simple. Pick an appropriate spot, turn the box over and trace it on the wall, then use a drywall punch saw to carefully cut it out.

quote:

Originally posted by jimmy123x:
Electricians are going to do it one way, the right way.

I think there's a better way to put that. Electricians are going to it....according to code. Since code varies by state and sometimes even between municipalities, there isn't necessarily a right or wrong way, but rather, what is required by code. Licensed electricians don't want the hassle or liabilities of not adhering to code should someone call their work into question.

When I had the spray foam insulation done in my house, they did the bottom of the trusses on top of the drywall ceiling in the garage so the whole attic space is insulated. The top plate for the wall is covered with 3" of 2-part polyurethane insulation which complicates even finding the top plate.

I haven't yet read why running flex from the attic, down the wall, and over the top of the WH wouldn't be acceptable. Besides the panel, only one set of connections at the WH would be made. Why add a box and another set of connections?

I don't know your code. If you post it (its probably a reference anyway) we can comment on solutions. But there is not a chance that I would spend a minute pulling the existing wire back. It's pointless since you are 5 ft. from the box. tape the ends and be happy if you need it in the future.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:
When I had the spray foam insulation done in my house, they did the bottom of the trusses on top of the drywall ceiling in the garage so the whole attic space is insulated. The top plate for the wall is covered with 3" of 2-part polyurethane insulation which complicates even finding the top plate.

I haven't yet read why running flex from the attic, down the wall, and over the top of the WH wouldn't be acceptable. Besides the panel, only one set of connections at the WH would be made. Why add a box and another set of connections?

That's a pain in the ass, I had a customer recently who did this, plus 16" of blown in shredded newspaper insulation. Doubled the time it took because all my reference points were hidden. It can be overcame by using visual clues from below. Either way it's such a pain in the butt for an exterior wall since you have limited space between trusses and roof. Better to just cut a hole below on the wall and drill up then just patch.

As for why to not come from ceiling. A reason he may fail it would be that conduits and cables require supports at certain intervals. This requires a 2x4 being attached to the trusses above and strapping conduit to that. Often not enforced for HWHs.

May be best to hire electrician or contact the authority having jurisdiction and ask them their exact requirements.

It's an interior wall between the garage and house. My plan was to screw straps around the flex to a stud in in the drywall.

The existing wire is lying across the trusses in the attic, won't take any effort to pull and other than turning the breaker off, I won't have to mess with the panel which is on an exterior wall.

The permit is $100 and I doubt I'd get an electrician out for less than another $100. $200 for 30 minutes of work.

trapper189, in some locations only a licensed electrician can pull a permit. As suggested talk to the local inspector as to what is possible for a home owner, and follow their instructions.

I would hire an electrician. If the house catches fire, the insurance company can use it as a way out of paying. If you go to resell the house later and it's not to code, it will come up on the buyers inspection and have to be fixed so that the bank can close on it so you might be paying for it twice anyways.

Thanks for the advice guys. I have a plan now.

If the wire is run properly and not exposed, nothing should catch fire. It is not that hard to do and I have done a few. If you plan to run from your main breaker panel, make sure the main power is off. Shark Bite fittings are super easy to use and make the job much easier,unless you are good at soldering. Do you need/have an expansion tank on your original?