I brought a handgun to South Carolina to gift to my daughter. We went to Palmetto State Armory to do a private party transfer. The guy at the counter said it isn’t necessary and that i can just hand it to her and it’s hers. I disagreed so he called the manager over who told me the same thing. I explained that I’m from PA and that I thought they were missing an important step. They disagreed and said they couldn’t help me.

The ATF is pretty clear that this is not appropriate and that a 4473 is in order.

Am i wrong?

Maybe he didn't realize you were a PA resident?

FROM CLAUDE: A 4473 is required. When the father lives in Pennsylvania and the daughter lives in South Carolina, a direct handoff is not allowed. Federal law bars the direct transfer. A person who isn’t a licensed dealer generally can’t transfer a firearm to an unlicensed resident of another state. Being father and daughter doesn’t create an exception. The ATF guidance covers gifts and says an out-of-state handgun transfer must go through a licensed dealer in the recipient’s state.

Sources:
- [NSSF: Rules for firearm gifts](https://www.nssf.org/?p=11465)
- [Accurateshooter: Rules of Firearms Gift Transfers (ATF guidance)](https://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/?p=62590)
- [LegalClarity: Transferring a gun to a family member in another state](https://legalclarity.org/how-to-transfer-a-gun-to-a-family-member-in-georgia/)
- [US LawShield: Gifting firearms across state lines](https://www.uslawshield.com/?p=24228)

I’m concerned with 18 U.S. Code § 922(a)(5) makes it illegal for any person (other than a licensed importer, manufacturer, or dealer) to transfer, sell, trade, give, transport, or deliver any firearm to any person who the transferor knows or has reasonable cause to believe does not live in the state where the transferor resides.

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Maybe he didn't realize you were a PA resident?

FROM CLAUDE: A 4473 is required. When the father lives in Pennsylvania and the daughter lives in South Carolina, a direct handoff is not allowed. Federal law bars the direct transfer. A person who isn’t a licensed dealer generally can’t transfer a firearm to an unlicensed resident of another state. Being father and daughter doesn’t create an exception. The ATF guidance covers gifts and says an out-of-state handgun transfer must go through a licensed dealer in the recipient’s state.

Sources:
- [NSSF: Rules for firearm gifts](https://www.nssf.org/?p=11465)
- [Accurateshooter: Rules of Firearms Gift Transfers (ATF guidance)](https://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/?p=62590)
- [LegalClarity: Transferring a gun to a family member in another state](https://legalclarity.org/how-to-transfer-a-gun-to-a-family-member-in-georgia/)
- [US LawShield: Gifting firearms across state lines](https://www.uslawshield.com/?p=24228)

Yes, that’s what I understand as well. I did make it clear that I’m from PA and she lives in SC.

Unless something has changed in the last 5 years, Mark123 you are correct while PSA and Claude are wrong.

Well Claude was wrong until r0gue changed his post.

It would be easier for me to just buy her a handgun while I’m here and let her do the 4473.
This has unfortunately soured me toward PSA.

How long has she lived in SC? could you say she was given the gun while she was in PA? If not just I guess take it back to PA and ship it to her!!!

Do you have a second home in South Carolina? The fedral law is that the parties have to merely reside in the same state and not residents of the same state.

quote:

Originally posted by Ronin101:
How long has she lived in SC? could you say she was given the gun while she was in PA? If not just I guess take it back to PA and ship it to her!!!

She moved to SC before i purchased the gun.

I want to say she’s been here for almost 10 years.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189:
Do you have a second home in South Carolina? …

I don’t.

I guess you should just bite the bullet and ship it!! Another stupid gun law!!

Perhaps find a different FFL.

quote:

Originally posted by jer830:
Perhaps find a different FFL.

This. Could probably do the FFL shopping over the phone. If you call up and they’re as clueless as the folks you dealt with at PSA, move on to the next. I’d wager you won’t make too many calls before you find an FFL who understands the law.

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:

quote:

Originally posted by jer830:
Perhaps find a different FFL.

This. Could probably do the FFL shopping over the phone. If you call up and they’re as clueless as the folks you dealt with at PSA, move on to the next. I’d wager you won’t make too many calls before you find an FFL who understands the law.

I'm pretty sure it has to be shipped to them.. But let us know if you get it transferred in person!

They could have just done a private party transfer, why they would question you I do not understand. They do the transfer, take your money, and go on with life.

Don’t expect gun store employees to know the law. I have been a home based FFL for 16 years and do not claim to know it all. I have run across some FFL’s doing such stupid stuff that it left me amazed they were in business.

Mark,

I recently ran into a similar issue trying to transfer a pistol to a friend in Florida. I had taken it with me there and he wanted to purchase it from me. I had asked my FFL in Pittsburgh before I left if I can do that and he incorrectly told me I could. I knew there would need to be a transfer in Florida but the FFL there basically told me the same thing as yours in SC, that they don't do transfers for a private transaction and I could just hand it to him and be done. I knew that was wrong. The only federally legal way to do this specific transfer is as if you are selling the pistol to someone you don't even know; have a PA FFL ship to a SC FFL where she can pick it up, go through the 4473 transfer and it will belegal.

Here is a link to the ATF’s guidance on private party sales: Private party sales

https://www.atf.gov/media/25271/download

Had a gun shop argue the same thing when I gave my brother (in another state) a pistol.

The fella swore up and down we did not need a transfer.
I finally just said would you take my $30 already and just do the transfer and they did.

quote:

Originally posted by Ronin101:
I'm pretty sure it has to be shipped to them.. But let us know if you get it transferred in person!

I don’t believe so, having done multiple private party transactions (including one swap). Granted, this was in Commiefornia, so it may have added wrinkles, but I doubt it took any away.

My experiences in CA: Buyer and seller had to both show up with ID. Buyer had to also have a current firearm safety certificate and proof of insurance or a paperwork reduction card (CCW). Seller hands over firearm and fills out some information. Buyer hands over required paperwork and fills out 4473 and DROS (CA DOJ additional paperwork, Dealer’s Record Of Sale). Somebody pays the transfer fee. Gun goes into “jail” for 10 day wait. Buyer returns at least 10 days, but not more than 30 days later to pickup.

I don’t understand why there would be any requirement to ship the gun in, but it is possible that some FFL have such a policy. I suppose they could also have a policy of not doing private party transfers. “We’re happy to sell you a gun, but we don’t do PPTs. Not enough money in them to justify the aggravation.”

quote:

Originally posted by r0gue:
Maybe he didn't realize you were a PA resident?

Yep. That’s the only reason I can think of. Otherwise, PSA is 100% wrong.

quote:

Originally posted by Ronin101:

I'm pretty sure it has to be shipped to them.. But let us know if you get it transferred in person!

Nope. You can hand the firearm to an FFL.