I have a water leak, I just can't figure out where. I'm 99% sure it's outside. But I don't see any standing water, and because of a bad mole invasion the whole yard is soft.

The water meter is in the side yard to the right of the house, runs parallel the driveway and attached garage, then goes into the garage, and there is a hole "well" in the floor where there is a shutoff valve. Then it goes back underground to the left backside of the house where it comes in the house to another shutoff valve.

The meter shows water flow with everything turned off. It shows water flow with the shutoff valve in the house turned off, but with the shutoff valve in the garage turned off, the water meter shows no flow.

It's running at just under a gallon a minute, but I hear no water flowing. It's been raining so the ground is damp everywhere, I see nothing that looks "extra wet", no standing water outside normal puddles that are no where near where the water line runs.

So, does anyone know of any "tricks" to help track down a water leak?

You figure at almost a gallon a minute that you would see signs and hear it, but so far nothing.

ARman

So the line between the garage and the house is leaking. How long is that line?

The only and best way I've found a leak on a water line is to pressurize the system with air. It'll vent above the leak.

Doesn't take much air, hardest part is isolating your system and tying(?) into it to air it up.

quote:

Originally posted by tomgun:
So the line between the garage and the house is leaking. How long is that line?

That is my best guess. How long? A rough guess is about 15 yards.

Yeah, the shutoff valve in the garage, no water flow at the watermeter, in the back bathroom where it comes into the house yes, water flow at the watermeter.

I see no puddles, and hear no water. Yet I'm leaking just under one (1) gallon per minute.


ARman

Go find someone who knows how to use a divining(?) rod. ......................... drill sgt.

We had a leak in the line from the meter out front to the house.
You could see a lot of water coming up, I dug it up and replaced the whole line.
Do you have a crawlspace?
Maybe check for water under there if you do, it has to be going somewhere.

There is probably a business like this near you: https://www.leakdoctor.com

The meter will ONLY show usage downstream of the meter.
If your shut off in the garage is before the meter in the house it will not be a leak in the line from the garage to the house. It has to be leaking after the meter.
Always check toilets for leaky flappers first.
Shut off valve to toilet supply. see it meter runs then.
dye in back of toilet (tank) see if it leaks into bowl. Use food coloring .

Check all your valves and connections first. Then you can isolate it.

^^what they said, isolate each valve then check the meter, then move on to the next item, check the meter, etc....most likely it’s a bad valve in a toilet where you can’t see water running.

If it’s not the house, then isolate the sprinklers, just a grain of sand or trash under a sprinkler pop-up head will fail to seal the system, or a solenoid with trash in it....

quote:

Originally posted by ARman:

The meter shows water flow with everything turned off. It shows water flow with the shutoff valve in the house turned off, but with the shutoff valve in the garage turned off, the water meter shows no flow.


ARman

But he says with the house isolated and turned off it shows water flow, so it’s before the house

quote:

Originally posted by tomgun:

quote:

Originally posted by ARman:

The meter shows water flow with everything turned off. It shows water flow with the shutoff valve in the house turned off, but with the shutoff valve in the garage turned off, the water meter shows no flow.


ARman

But he says with the house isolated and turned off it shows water flow, so it’s before the house

From his description it sounds like the leak would be between the garage valve and the house valve, though that whole description is somewhat confusing, I've never seen a house with more than one mainline cutoff once inside the structure.

It does almost sound like coincidence perhaps driven by the suggestion above. Unless he's turned off the toilet valves there's no assurance they aren't running some of the time he's checking, other times they are.

quote:

Originally posted by Georgeair:
From his description it sounds like the leak would be between the garage valve and the house valve, though that whole description is somewhat confusing, I've never seen a house with more than one mainline cutoff once inside the structure.

That threw me as well. The initial shutoff in the attached garage should be the "whole house" shutoff. If it was a detached garage with a utility sink or a half bath, I could see it having a separate garage-only shutoff and then another whole house shutoff for the house, but that doesn't sound like it's the case here with the attached garage.

ARman - Are you sure the shutoff in the back corner bathroom of the house is a second "whole house" shutoff? Or is it just a shutoff for one or a handful of fixtures in that bathroom? (Or sometimes there are individual shutoffs inside for things like exterior spigots, if there's one located on the outside wall of that room.) If it's just a shutoff for that room, or for a nearby exterior spigot, then just because that back corner shutoff is off doesn't mean there isn't something still running elsewhere in another room of the house, because the rest of the house would still have water supply.

I'd verify that, and rule out simpler interior stuff like a running toilet or leaking water heater, before throwing money at hiring leak detecting services or digging up the underground supply line.

quote:

Originally posted by ARman:
I have a water leak, I just can't figure out where. ...

...

The meter shows water flow ... with the shutoff valve in the house turned off, but with the shutoff valve in the garage turned off, the water meter shows no flow.

It is clear the leak is between the valve in the garage and the valve in the house, unless ...

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
ARman - Are you sure the shutoff in the back corner bathroom of the house is a second "whole house" shutoff? Or is it just a shutoff for one or a handful of fixtures in that bathroom?

... something like that ^^^^^

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by ARman:
I have a water leak, I just can't figure out where. ...

...

The meter shows water flow ... with the shutoff valve in the house turned off, but with the shutoff valve in the garage turned off, the water meter shows no flow.

It is clear the leak is between the valve in the garage and the valve in the house, unless ...

quote:

Originally posted by RogueJSK:
ARman - Are you sure the shutoff in the back corner bathroom of the house is a second "whole house" shutoff? Or is it just a shutoff for one or a handful of fixtures in that bathroom?

... something like that ^^^^^

Yes, the valve in the house is (was) the main whole house cutoff.

The one in the garage, closer to the water meter was add 3 years ago when a frozen pipe in that location cracked when the plumber was trying to thaw it out. It was a "oops, sorry bonus", I had wanted to install one closer to the meter when I moved in.

From what I have been able to surmise so far is somewhere between the two cutoff valves there is a leak, but nothing is showing about ground.

There is a crawlspace, but where the bathroom is, it's only about 8" high. There is a "hill" that runs down the center and you can't see the ground there. So I can't see any pudding or standing water.

ARman

Find an underground utility service contractor. They can determine where the leak is between 2 points, minimizing the amount of excavation needed for the repair.

Get some dye and put it in your toilet tank. See if it migrates to the bowl. If no dye in the bowl, you at least eliminate one possible leak potential.

Also, you said it is leaking under 1 gpm. That would equal to roughly 1400 gallons per day. I think you would see a leak like that on the surface.