I would never have trusted my card accounts to an Android device, because I never trusted Android security any further than I could throw Google. But I trust iOS security and, knowing how Apple Pay works, I trust Apple Pay.

It has a terrific advantage: Because of the way it works it completely negates PoS terminal hijacking. So it's far more secure than a straight credit or debit card.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I would never have trusted my card accounts to an Android device, because I never trusted Android security any further than I could throw Google. But I trust iOS security and, knowing how Apple Pay works, I trust Apple Pay.

It has a terrific advantage: Because of the way it works it completely negates PoS terminal hijacking. So it's far more secure than a straight credit or debit card.

I can't speak to Apple but I can say I use Android Pay and it works well. I have to think the security in both are similar. Android Pay uses a Virtual Account number, issued by my bank, that acts as a blind with Android Pay so the purchaser never gets my actual card account information.

quote:

Originally posted by rocket72:
I can't speak to Apple but I can say I use Android Pay and it works well. I have to think the security in both are similar.

It wasn't Android Pay I didn't trust.

As long as your Android uses only Google ecosystem (Play store), it is quite safe from thieves. Of course Google has your data but after the 2006 Gmail hacking incident, Sergey Brin made it his personal mission so that Google would never suffer more widespread hack again (Brin's internal security motto for his people is "Never again").

We do read about security holes discovered by researchers, however these guys are WHITE HATS. They help in securing our digital lives by hacking into any system and informing the companies of the serious holes they found. Real incidents are those actualy hacking incidents where real data were stolen by thieves. Google Android (that use only Google Play) have a pretty safe record.

Look at President Trump's old Galaxy S4. I am sure all the snowflakes and their ilk as well as state agents were trying to infiltrate him, during the campaign and afterwards. AFAIK, he's was not successfully hacked and those tweets were his And his S4 was 4 years old.

quote:

Originally posted by saigonsmuggler:
As long as your Android uses only Google ecosystem (Play store), it is quite safe from thieves.

I used to think the same. Despite the fact I was not entirely comfortable with Android security, I rationalized we'd be safe as long as we stuck with the Play Store.

Yeah, right...

Judy Android Malware Infects Over 36.5 Million Google Play Store Users

Second such incident reported in the last month or so. There have been several other, lower-"level"/-"intensity" incidents along the same lines.

I did not abandon the Android ecosystem lightly. By the time all is said and done, we will have tossed about $400+ between resale losses on devices that are in perfectly fine condition, with at least a year or two life left in them, and paid apps. Never mind the cost of the replacement hardware in iThings .

quote:

Originally posted by arfmel:

quote:

Originally posted by cmparrish:
I use it any chance I get. I love you. Great form of payment. Like others have said, lots of places don't realize they even take it. Just look for that symbol and most likely they will accept Apple Pay. As of now, if I had to guess, it accounts for about 25% of my transactions.

I love you too, man.

Ha! I was laughing at the idiot that typed "I love you" then realized it was my damn post!!!

quote:

Originally posted by jbcummings:
I've got a couple of questions about this.

As I understand it, Apple has your CC info and is the one actually charging your card, thus the vendor doesn't get your info.

So you can probably look up what got spent where via Apple's records, but I assume your CC statements just show a bunch of unrelated 'iTunes' like transactions?

No, my transactions (to my debit card) show up in my bank statement as charges to the merchant. After all, the merchant is the one who receives the money, not iTunes.

quote:

Originally posted by jbcummings:If that is true, then is there a way to capture the detailed information about your transactions with a money management program like Quicken?

Ok so shoot me.. A third question is what is transaction resolution like? Gotta go through Apple? Do they guarantee the transactions like American Express or other CCs?

I keep finding more questions... Does Apple charge the vendor anything for the transaction? Most CC companies charge a transaction fee to the vendor for processing the transaction. Used to be the funds were held for a period of time in case there was a transaction dispute. Same with Apple?

If I go buy gas with my Chase card Chase will immediately enter a $1 transaction to my account until the transaction is completed by the vendor. On the other hand, if I do the same thing with my American Express, they put a $125 charge on the account until completion. What does Apple do?

Ok, I'll quit, for now.

I'm not sure I can answer all of your questions, but this has been my experience: Every transaction is between you and the merchant. Apple only acts the part of the middleman. If they get a rake-off on the transaction, the merchant pays it, just like they pay a percentage of the transaction to the credit card companies -- it's a cost of doing business.

If I have a problem with a transaction (I haven't), I'd take it up with the credit card company or the merchant -- just as if I had used the card directly. Apple doesn't tell me if my card has expired, a transaction is declined, or whatever. Apple Pay is just an intermediary.

My understanding is that Apple Pay is offered as a "plus" to Apple users. There is no charge to me for using this service, and if Apple is making anything from it, it's coming from the credit card companies (there are some cards that cannot be set up with Apple Pay).

Helps?

quote:

Originally posted by fpuhan:

quote:

Originally posted by jbcummings:
I've got a couple of questions about this.

As I understand it, Apple has your CC info and is the one actually charging your card, thus the vendor doesn't get your info.

So you can probably look up what got spent where via Apple's records, but I assume your CC statements just show a bunch of unrelated 'iTunes' like transactions?

No, my transactions (to my debit card) show up in my bank statement as charges to the merchant. After all, the merchant is the one who receives the money, not iTunes.

quote:

Originally posted by jbcummings:If that is true, then is there a way to capture the detailed information about your transactions with a money management program like Quicken?

Ok so shoot me.. A third question is what is transaction resolution like? Gotta go through Apple? Do they guarantee the transactions like American Express or other CCs?

I keep finding more questions... Does Apple charge the vendor anything for the transaction? Most CC companies charge a transaction fee to the vendor for processing the transaction. Used to be the funds were held for a period of time in case there was a transaction dispute. Same with Apple?

If I go buy gas with my Chase card Chase will immediately enter a $1 transaction to my account until the transaction is completed by the vendor. On the other hand, if I do the same thing with my American Express, they put a $125 charge on the account until completion. What does Apple do?

Ok, I'll quit, for now.

I'm not sure I can answer all of your questions, but this has been my experience: Every transaction is between you and the merchant. Apple only acts the part of the middleman. If they get a rake-off on the transaction, the merchant pays it, just like they pay a percentage of the transaction to the credit card companies -- it's a cost of doing business.

If I have a problem with a transaction (I haven't), I'd take it up with the credit card company or the merchant -- just as if I had used the card directly. , a transaction is declined, or whatever. Apple Pay is just an intermediary.

My understanding is that Apple Pay is offered as a "plus" to Apple users. There is no charge to me for using this service, and if Apple is making anything from it, it's coming from the credit card companies (there are some cards that cannot be set up with Apple Pay).

Helps?

Apple doesn't tell me if my card has expired This brings up another question, I make some payments online w/my debit card and if I am updated or my card expires it tells me and I have to update it. Does the same thing happen with the card/cards you have listed on Apple pay?

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
Yeah, right...

Judy Android Malware Infects Over 36.5 Million Google Play Store Users

I read about this on various Android sites and it is a low-level threat (generating clicks). Android and iOS have strict permission flags that each app has to ask and explicitly given permission to access each area of the phone.

Instances of malware on non-jailbroken iOS devices also existed and discovered in the App Store:

https://www.theregister.co.uk/...eceiver_ios_malware/

Also we had the infamous celeb nude photos from their iPhones. Yes it was phishing and it can happen to anyone but at least on Android, if anyone sign onto a new device (be it PC or tablet or phone) Google would immediately alert me on all my devices (notification panels, SMS, Hangout, email) to the new sign-in and I can quickly disable that new device permanently, stopping the illegal access dead in its track.

Thanks guys. I suppose I need to look up how AP actually works. If they're a middleman in this and not some sort of broker or whatever, I don't get what the vendor or CC companies get out of it. More research is required on my part.

Here is a pretty good overview of Apple iOS security in general, including Apple Pay (Apple Pay starts on pg.34).

https://www.apple.com/business...S_Security_Guide.pdf

Love Apple Pay and use it everywhere it's accepted.

Faster, easier, neither the vendor nor their CC processor ever sees actual card data.

What's not to like?

I use it EVERY time I can.

My wife and I wanted to use Apple Pay, but our credit union doesn't offer that option for some reason. If and/or when it does, we will jump on the bandwagon.

quote:

Originally posted by saigonsmuggler:
Instances of malware on non-jailbroken iOS devices also existed and discovered in the App Store:

One. As compared to how many, and how many times, on Google's Play Store? Furthermore the "iOS exploit" requires cooperation from an iTunes MS-Windows client. Lastly: There wasn't actually any known instances of the short-lived malware in question actually being installed anywhere.

Nonetheless: Point taken. Somebody finally found a way to sneak malware into non-jailbroken iOS devices. Let's see how long it takes Apple to correct the problem.

quote:

Originally posted by saigonsmuggler:
... at least on Android, if anyone sign onto a new device (be it PC or tablet or phone) Google would immediately alert me ...

I get the same notifications when a new device accesses my iCloud account.

I've many more reasons to distrust Android security, and anything involving Samsung, in particular, but, I think I'm going to leave this sub-discussion at that.

quote:

Originally posted by ftttu:
My wife and I wanted to use Apple Pay, but our credit union doesn't offer that option for some reason. If and/or when it does, we will jump on the bandwagon.

I ran into the same thing with our CU credit card. I'm going to make my displeasure known to them.

I wonder if the Costco Visa card works with Apple Pay? (Looking...) Hmmm... Looks like they do. Maybe finally a reason to get a Costco Visa card?

ensigmatic, it is more than one time. We can go back in recent history of iOS and find many such instances of iOS being compromised in various manners such as the recent SMS hole that allowed remote reboot of any iPhone, the Dubai hack, Find and Call hack, WireLurker, Masque, YiSpecter, Safari JavaScript scareware, Inception, Dropout Jeep, etc.

Of course we are only talking about non-jailbroken iOS devices and non-rooted, Google Play only Androids.

The Celebrity nude photos hack/phish was the most egregious of all as this was a case where real private data was exposed worldwide and posted onto 4chan and other sites. Apparently at that time, iCloud did not have stringent lockout after certain number of attempts was made and did not alert/allow users to disable a new device that was logged on with stolen credentials. whatever the case, it was the most egregious and serious of all successful hacks IMHO.

I cannot actually recall a widespread instance where real private data were exposed from standard Google Play only, non-rooted Androids. I could be wrong but I cannot remember. I usually hear of Chinese Androids got hacked and exposed but that's because Google Play is not available there and they use all kinds of Chinese app stores over there.

Of course the strongest anecdotal evidence we have is President Trump's old Samsung S4 phone. Standard, non-rooted Android with most certainly high number of attempts to hack it as well as his Twitter account. It survived blameless.

Signed up for Apple Pay last night, use it today at Rubio's.
Incredibly fast and easy!
Thanks again, SigForum!

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I wonder if the Costco Visa card works with Apple Pay? (Looking...) Hmmm... Looks like they do.

CostCo VISA is issued by Citibank. Citi has many different VISA cards, some of which do work with Apple Pay. When I asked Citi, maybe a year or so ago, the CostCo card did not work with Apple Pay, at least not the CostCo business VISA, which is the one that I use.

I like Apple Pay -- if you find out that the CostCo VISA does work with Apple Pay, please post back in this thread; I'll pursue it further.

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:
I like Apple Pay -- if you find out that the CostCo VISA does work with Apple Pay, please post back in this thread; I'll pursue it further.

I won't be finding out. 16% APR?!?! Screw that for a game of soldiers!

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:

quote:

Originally posted by V-Tail:
I like Apple Pay -- if you find out that the CostCo VISA does work with Apple Pay, please post back in this thread; I'll pursue it further.

I won't be finding out. 16% APR?!?! Screw that for a game of soldiers!

If you pay your credit card bill in full each month, this card is a good deal. You pay no interest, but you reap cash back:

• 4% for gas purchases
  
  
• 3% for restaurants
  
  
• 2% for Costco purchases
  
  
• 1% for everything else

If you pay in full each month, you get a minimum 25 day float on what you spend with the card.