Have you ever looked at a headline, read it 10 times and still have no idea what the writer is trying to convey? Horrible sentence structure, improper use of homophones, dangling participles, etc., etc.

On the other hand do you despise when someone points out a mistake or assume that they should understand what's being written?

I've been thinking about it, mostly because I often read a headline that I just can't wrap my head around. Sometimes I realize that it's an ESL writer (if they use the phrase "this is how something looks like" is a clue). Sometimes it's just an incomprehensible wall of nonsense and I give up.

I am thinking there may be a reason that some can deal with it and others cannot. My personal issues with poor grammar could be because I don't hear the words that I read in my head. They are text, not sounds. When I see an incorrect homophone (where/wear, they're/there/their), I actually stop and think "what does this even mean?", and read it over trying to figure it out. I've gotten better because it's so prevalent but I still have trouble understanding a lot of what I read from people with actual jobs in journalism, text-speak, even here on the forum.

As I've said, I don't hear words when I read them, I see them. I've seen people read and their mouths will move with the words. Some whisper the text, some just mouth the words. That brings me to the poll. Hearing what you read, internally in your mind or whispering/mouthing the words, would explain to me why some have troubles, like me, and others just have no issue with it.

Also, please mention if bad grammar bothers you.

Question:
When you are reading do you hear words, either in your head or by saying the words?

Choices:
No. I don't hear written text, I see it.
Yes. I hear the words in my mind as I read.
Yes. I find myself whispering the words as I read.
Yes. I find myself mouthing the words silently as I read.

 

This message has been edited. Last edited by: mark123,

I hear the words…like I’m reading out loud in my head.

When you think about something in general , do you hear yourself talking? I do…

Like a conversation about whatever I’m thinking about.

I hear others do not talk in their heads but rather see things instead. I find this disturbing because I can’t fathom not talking in my head when thinking.

Truly odd…

quote:

Originally posted by Patriot:
… I hear others do not talk in their heads but rather see things instead. I find this disturbing because I can’t fathom not talking in my head when thinking.

Truly odd…

I can do it, it’s just a completely different process.

Does someone writing “wear” instead of “where” cause a pause or does it go unnoticed because you’re hearing it?

I had to reset the poll because I had to fix bad grammar in my post. Autocorrect was to blame.

Please vote again.

I hear it when reading.

I can be a grammar or perhaps more correctly a nomenclature nazi for official reports, papers, or when teaching classes. Otherwise, I let most things slide. I have oddly gotten into more than one argument about the use of commas.

Interesting. I sometimes have to actually pronounce homophones to figure something out.

I see the words and bad grammar or improper word usage does bother me.

Very often when people push back against objections to positions like mine they trot out the straw man of supposed overreaction to a mistake and/or the “You know what they mean” argument to justify their own ignorance of and acceptance of mistakes. That’s not to say that some people don’t overreact to trivial issues or that we shouldn’t focus on the meaning first.

But if I experience what I refer to as a “speed bump” when I’m reading something and then move on without writing a letter to the editor, that’s hardly overreacting. I’m also much less likely to even notice a grammatical or word usage mistake in conversation, not least because there are no things like homophone issues.

I talk to many people who haven’t received a thorough education in the English language. If someone for whom English is a second language can make himself understood, however inarticulately, I’m going to be reminded of how difficult learning foreign languages was for me, and feel admiration, not censure. Plus even most people who know the proper grammar and word usage tend to be less careful when talking, particularly in informal situations, and that’s okay, too.

Mistakes in formal writing that should have been subject to review and editing by someone who should know better, though, are a different matter and still annoy me. I look at failure to try to avoid such mistakes as both lacking respect for the reader who must try to understand what’s written, and as Arthur Schopenhauer put it, “He who writes carelessly confesses thereby at the very outset that he does not attach much importance to his own thoughts.”

None of that means I’m perfect myself, but it does mean that I try to be.

quote:

Originally posted by Anubismp:
… I have oddly gotten into more than one argument about the use of commas.

The reply is usually “Microsoft Word said the comma goes there”.

If I am thinking to myself I hear words in my head.

If I am reading words I do not hear it, only see it.

Going back to the OP and the irritation of those who write but cannot do it well - I take it to mean several things.

First is a red flag indicating the breakdown of our society. A poorly written/expressed idea can be taken to mean several things, when it should clearly mean only ONE thing. Example? “Shall not be infringed…”
I too find it irritating because I value something that is well written. An example would be a snippet from Jethro Gibbs on NCIS - “If you’re not early, you’re late”. While not profound, it does express a personal value instilled while I was in the Navy. The idea needs no elaboration.
Second, if this gibberish is acceptable, where else are we going to find it? How about a thorough reading of some of these two or three thousand page bills that are being pushed into law? Vaguely written or poorly written can mean twisted interpretation. For the writers in this case I believe that to be the desired result.
Finally, if this pitiful stuff is not corrected, what we are seeing is not just ineptness on the part of a few, but a trend moving in the wrong direction. We will devolve into gibberish - each thinking they understand the other, walking away without any clarity at all.

I don't try to hear words when reading, as that slows the process way down.

That got trained out of us in "Rapid Reading Comprehension" class in High School. I don't know if those courses are even given any more - if not, that's a loss.

I actually have 3 modes of reading.

One is the "hearing" words. The other is reading "without hearing" the words, and the third is what I call, "deliberate walkthrough reading".

In the "hearing", I do use my "head voice" and read/hear with some light articulation as if I am beginning to actually speak the words, but do not follow through. Sort of a physical throat sensation. I also to this when I am playing musical instruments, or "singing along" in my head to some music.

(I first realized from the music and singing that I was doing this, and much later that I did the same thing when reading)

The second, is normal and how I typically read. When I do this, I am reading very fast, and the "internal vocalizing" slows me down. Never realized this until I was pondering the whole "hearing/not hearing" when I read.

So, if I am reading a good story, I tend to "hear" more, than if I am reading technical or for information material.

I do "hear" different voices when I read what people I know or have heard have written, and even more when it is "story type" reading.

The last one is the deliberate reading, and that one is very strong "internal/physical" and if I am finding the information laborious or difficult (especially grammar, or poorly written/use of wording), I will actually find myself reading bits or even quite a bit while mouthing or actually speaking, usually re-reading several times.

Use of incorrect words bother me more than a simple grammar error.


For example, using the word ideals in place of ideas.

"He has some really great ideals about how to solve that problem.", annoys the hell out of me, where; "I eat meat at lunch and drank a soda." not so much. I am linear in reading and comprehend it as it is spoken, in "normal" conversational reading, and take it literal as I read, then "looking at the context (and noticing the disparity after), but I have already "acknowledged the message", so I am able to process and proceed without issue as it is "in the past now".

But a technical article, "I used a wrench to fixed the machine." would bother me because I am reading the entire sentence and taking it in the context of entirety. In that sense, the information is a structure that I still "need" and it is a "broken tool" (technically) so even though it is the same error as the first, it is still an active continual tense issue for me, whereas the anecdote of the "meal" communicated and my brain "fixed the glitch" on the fly.

(FWIW, how and what people think, in the abstract, is very intriguing to me. Sort of understanding "machine logic of artificial intelligence", the "mechanics" of how people think, not so much what they think.

I realize this was much more than you asked, but unless I strike my thumb with a hammer, think and say; "Ow!" and move on, I tend to put a lot more thought into a thing, and that leads to many words.

Therefore, I will say "conditional "yes" to your poll, although I cannot answer it as is due to the "E. All of the above".



Oh, another thought. I believe my not being so much bothered by grammar issues in speaking/anecdotal material is from having travelled the world and communicating where English is not the primary language and "relaxing the filters", over time, so that even the abuse by "English speaking people", is "overlooked".

quote:

Originally posted by joel9507:

I don't try to hear words when reading, as that slows the process way down.

That got trained out of us in "Rapid Reading Comprehension" class in High School. I don't know if those courses are even given any more - if not, that's a loss.

Evelyn Wood moves her lips while reading.

Timely post, Mr. V-Tail!!

I am a slow reader. I believe the reason why is that I pronounce the words in my head with great articulation, thus slowing me down. I also take the time to imagine different voices when reading a novel, for instance, rather than "hear" the story in my own voice.

And just for fun (pardon the language)...

I hear in my head what I’m reading. But somehow I do differentiate things like their and they’re as I read and even though it sounds correct I my head it gives me pause as I’m reading.

Regarding headlines, news headlines are most confusing to me. They try to fit too much in the headline and it just makes no sense. I have less issues on forum topics.

Grammar drives me nuts. Recently I see people writing “now days” instead of “nowadays”. Actually saw it in a Fox News headline.

I actually took a speed reading course in HS. It has proved to be the most beneficial class I ever took. Problem: The topic has to interest me before I can fully use what I learned.

Let me get this straight.

There are members here who have voice(s) in their heads?

Do the voices ever get in an argument with themselves? I means besides the occasional voice that steps up before you hit <enter> and says "Para said 'Do Not Post that Shit.' so DON"T POST THAT SHIT!!" That is the voice of self-preservation, often called "the voice of your guardian angel."

I'm talking a knockdown, dragged out, no holds barred mental fistfight. One voice says "Do A," another says "Don't do A," and the third says "I'm with you fellas."

Voices like this???





Thank the gods... I'm not the only one.

I only have one voice in my head. It’s my voice. I never argue with it as I know I am always right.

I answered "I don't hear," but that's not entirely accurate. I think I do "hear" what I read, but my brain interprets what I read, not what I "hear," if that makes any sense.

E.g.: If somebody writes "queue" when they really mean "cue," as occurred recently, I "hear" the same things, but my brain interprets the word I see.

I can usually interpret what they mean w/o pause. Sometimes, though, I may have to re-read a sentence several times, and think about it, to figure it out.

Poor grammar and incorrect usage are like fingernails on a blackboard, to me, but I'm increasingly just letting them go. They're a reflection on the writer or speaker. Not my problem unless I choose to make it my problem.

If it's written, badly enough, I just stop reading and move on.

I do technical writing fairly well. I try to write well and edit when I find a mistake in rereading something I wrote.

But my days of writing college papers after having earned two masters is behind me and I don't have to write software specifications in a way that a programmer in India won't misunderstand or claim he fulfilled the specs as written. So I can slip once in a while with run on sentences or subject/verb singular/plural alignment. So I'm not hard on others. If I can understand the gist, I'll go with it. If there's ambiguity, I'll clarify.

In the context of the communications most of us are doing, it's not like we're always in the equivalent of doing High Tea. The people who tend to try to be a grammar Nazi with me usually are underpowered and they trip soon enough.

quote:

Originally posted by ensigmatic:
I answered "I don't hear," but that's not entirely accurate. I think I do "hear" what I read, but my brain interprets what I read, not what I "hear," if that makes any sense.

E.g.: If somebody writes "queue" when they really mean "cue," as occurred recently, I "hear" the same things, but my brain interprets the word I see.

I can usually interpret what they mean w/o pause. Sometimes, though, I may have to re-read a sentence several times, and think about it, to figure it out.

I do hear if I'm reading casually,like here on the forum, so I'd here the difference between "queue" and "cue" differently. I have often wondered if this is because English is my second language or if it might even be due to not learning phonics, but learning to read by "recognition."

Bad grammar slows down my comprehension,because it doesn't "sound right" and I have to stop to confirm the meaning intended.

When I was in school, I did learn to read without hearing the words just to keep up with the amount of reading required.