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Remembering the early 1970s. Were the public schools experimenting on the students? Login/Join 
W07VH5
Picture of mark123
posted
On another forum someone asked what it was like in the 70s as they correctly assumed the pictures and stories are not indicative of reality. I mentioned that I thought my teachers ran psychological experiments on the children in elementary school. I’ll just quote my posts here and ask if anyone else remembers anything like this.
quote:
I’m pretty sure the public school teachers were running psychological experiments on the students back then. They made some of us hate and/or fear authority and others depend on authority without separating us into different classrooms.

I saw some get coddled and helped while others were not just ignored, they were yelled at for asking for help or an explanation.

In my first grade class (1974), Mrs. Tinstman made us count "one, two, one, two ..." until everyone in class was either assigned a one or a two.

The ones were to come to her with even the slightest question, even if the lessons were completely understood. She'd have the ones stand closely next to her while she touched them with her shoulder while pointing to the explanation on her worksheet. It was intimate and motherly.

The twos were to figure everything out on their own. If we didn't understand something, we were to work it out. We weren't to approach her desk and when she did explain something to a two, it was gruff and felt angry. You can tell that I was a two by the way I'm explaining it. Once I asked what a question meant as the wording wasn't clear to a first grader. "YOU'RE A TWO! FIGURE IT OUT!"

Yikes. I still cringe when someone yells in public. She was a comely woman. It taught me that skin deep beauty was often frightening.
 
Posts: 45676 | Location: Pennsyltucky | Registered: December 05, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Common sense is genius dressed in its working clothes
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I don't really remember anything like that. I did have a teacher in third grade that was an evil witch. She treated every student in the room the same. How she kept her job when she was so damned hateful is beyond me. To this day some fifty odd years later I still have a mental block on some parts of the multiplication tables. That fuckin zombie will haunt me till my dying day. I can still picture her hideous face with absolute clarity.


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Posts: 1967 | Location: Douglas County, Colorado | Registered: July 13, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Sounds like you went to a school with a fucked up teacher.

I don’t remember my childhood with enough clarity to tell you specifics. I can tell you that while raising our kids, there were always parent volunteers helping out every day. Both my wife and I amongst others would spend a couple hours doing many little things to help the elementary school teachers. Which meant we saw a lot of the curriculum.

I never witnessed anything worth commenting on except for one thing. They would “mainstream” children with mental handicaps to the point of complete distraction. They would usually have a paid teachers helper one on one and the fits, and outbursts were common and tolerated. It kind of shocked me. They happened so often you almost got used to it. It never seemed beneficial to either set of kids. No brainwashing though.
 
Posts: 7540 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 18, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Three on, one off
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YOUR teacher was clearly doing an experiment. A messed up one at that. I grew up in the '70s and attended public schools (Florida) but didn't see any of that going on.
 
Posts: 4470 | Location: Michigan | Registered: November 03, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Why don’t you fix your little
problem and light this candle
Picture of redstone
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This happened a lot. One of the most famous is the Blue Eyes/Brown eyes experiment. She is celebrated to this day when in fact she was doing psych experiments ON HER own STUDENTs. but it was to show the pain 'of discrimination' and the dangers of bias.

I had to study this and others in grad school. It is also one of the reasons why we have the IRB (institutional review board) and EVERY study has to be approved by the board.

Link

Elliott, who developed what has become known as the “Blue Eyes/Brown Eyes” exercise after the assassination of civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr., will show how people can learn to recognize and identify disparities in the ways in which power is assigned and maintained.

She asked her students if they wanted to participate in an exercise to see how discrimination worked. The students agreed. The next day, she separated the children with blue eyes from the children with brown eyes. The blue-eyed children were told they were the superior group and given extra privileges such as more food portions at lunch, more playtime and they sat at the front of the class. The blue-eyed children were encouraged to play only with other blue-eyed children and ignore those with brown eyes.

The brown-eyed children wore collars made of fabric to identify them as a minority group and made to sit in the back rows. Elliott also reprimanded the brown-eyed students when they made mistakes or didn’t follow the rules.

The brown-eyed students initially resisted the notion that the blue-eyed students were better, but Elliott deliberately lied, telling them that the melanin responsible for making the students blue-eyed also gave them higher intelligence and learning ability. As the experiment progressed, the blue-eyed students became arrogant, bossy and otherwise unpleasant to their “inferior” classmates. Their grades also improved. The brown-eyed “inferior” classmates changed into timid and subservient children, who isolated themselves during recess. Even their studies suffered. The following week, Elliott reversed the exercise, making the brown-eyed children superior. While the brown-eyed children did taunt the blue-eyed ones in ways similar to what had occurred the previous day, it was not as intense.

At the end of the exercise, the students were asked to write down what they learned. The students wrote that it was not right to be judged by the color of their eyes and that the color of their eyes did not make a difference on the type of person they were.

The children’s compositions were printed in the local papers and the story was picked up by the national news media. The story led to Elliott’s invitation to be a guest on “The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson” to talk about the experiment and the children. After her appearance, the “The Tonight Show” received hundreds of phone calls and letters, many of them complaining. An often-quoted letter states, “How dare you try this cruel experiment out on white children?”

But not all the reaction was negative. As more people learned about the experiment, Elliott was asked to repeat the exercise and it eventually evolved into professional training for adults. In 1970, Elliott staged the exercise at a White House Conference on Children and Youth, staging it for adults.

Elliot now works as a diversity trainer and lecturer who is recognized most prominently as an anti-racism activist and educator. She has been the focus of two television documentaries, “Eye of the Storm” in 1971 and “A Class Divided” in 1985, and has received many awards, including the National Mental Health Association Award for Excellence in Education.



This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it. -Rear Admiral (Lower Half) Joshua Painter Played by Senator Fred Thompson
 
Posts: 3694 | Location: Central Virginia | Registered: November 06, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Surprised you recall with such detail your first grade experiences!


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Posts: 8809 | Location: UT | Registered: December 05, 1999Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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My last year in public school was early 70's so I guess I'm a little older, but I do not remember anything like this. I do remember a severe crush on my Spanish teacher. She was a babe.


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Posts: 864 | Location: in the PA woods | Registered: March 11, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Eye on the
Silver Lining
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quote:
Originally posted by sandman76:
I don't really remember anything like that. I did have a teacher in third grade that was an evil witch. She treated every student in the room the same. How she kept her job when she was so damned hateful is beyond me. To this day some fifty odd years later I still have a mental block on some parts of the multiplication tables. That fuckin zombie will haunt me till my dying day. I can still picture her hideous face with absolute clarity.


Ours was in 5th. She was evil- so much so that my mom refused to have me in her class- she’d screwed with my older brother and sister so badly.

Per the experimenting, no. I remember nothing like that.


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Posts: 5570 | Registered: October 24, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
W07VH5
Picture of mark123
posted Hide Post
quote:
Originally posted by redstone:
This happened a lot. One of the most famous is the Blue Eyes/Brown eyes experiment. She is celebrated to this day when in fact she was doing psych experiments ON HER own STUDENTs. but it was to show the pain 'of discrimination' and the dangers of bias.

I had to study this and others in grad school. It is also one of the reasons why we have the IRB (institutional review board) and EVERY study has to be approved by the board.

Link

Elliott, who developed what has become known as the “Blue Eyes/Brown Eyes” exercise after the assassination of civil rights leader Martin Luther King Jr., will show how people can learn to recognize and identify disparities in the ways in which power is assigned and maintained.

She asked her students if they wanted to participate in an exercise to see how discrimination worked. The students agreed. The next day, she separated the children with blue eyes from the children with brown eyes. The blue-eyed children were told they were the superior group and given extra privileges such as more food portions at lunch, more playtime and they sat at the front of the class. The blue-eyed children were encouraged to play only with other blue-eyed children and ignore those with brown eyes.

The brown-eyed children wore collars made of fabric to identify them as a minority group and made to sit in the back rows. Elliott also reprimanded the brown-eyed students when they made mistakes or didn’t follow the rules.

The brown-eyed students initially resisted the notion that the blue-eyed students were better, but Elliott deliberately lied, telling them that the melanin responsible for making the students blue-eyed also gave them higher intelligence and learning ability. As the experiment progressed, the blue-eyed students became arrogant, bossy and otherwise unpleasant to their “inferior” classmates. Their grades also improved. The brown-eyed “inferior” classmates changed into timid and subservient children, who isolated themselves during recess. Even their studies suffered. The following week, Elliott reversed the exercise, making the brown-eyed children superior. While the brown-eyed children did taunt the blue-eyed ones in ways similar to what had occurred the previous day, it was not as intense.

At the end of the exercise, the students were asked to write down what they learned. The students wrote that it was not right to be judged by the color of their eyes and that the color of their eyes did not make a difference on the type of person they were.

The children’s compositions were printed in the local papers and the story was picked up by the national news media. The story led to Elliott’s invitation to be a guest on “The Tonight Show Starring Johnny Carson” to talk about the experiment and the children. After her appearance, the “The Tonight Show” received hundreds of phone calls and letters, many of them complaining. An often-quoted letter states, “How dare you try this cruel experiment out on white children?”

But not all the reaction was negative. As more people learned about the experiment, Elliott was asked to repeat the exercise and it eventually evolved into professional training for adults. In 1970, Elliott staged the exercise at a White House Conference on Children and Youth, staging it for adults.

Elliot now works as a diversity trainer and lecturer who is recognized most prominently as an anti-racism activist and educator. She has been the focus of two television documentaries, “Eye of the Storm” in 1971 and “A Class Divided” in 1985, and has received many awards, including the National Mental Health Association Award for Excellence in Education.


Wow, that’s amazing. I haven’t heard of that but it feels similar. The only differences in my case was that it was arbitrarily assigned and the students weren’t to treat each other differently. The teacher seemed like two different people in one body.
 
Posts: 45676 | Location: Pennsyltucky | Registered: December 05, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
W07VH5
Picture of mark123
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Orndorff:
Surprised you recall with such detail your first grade experiences!
I remember a lot from my youth. Back to age 3, I’d say. I especially remember the times that I was singled out. I still sometimes wonder why I was treated differently.
 
Posts: 45676 | Location: Pennsyltucky | Registered: December 05, 2001Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Peace through
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Not where I went to school
 
Posts: 110047 | Registered: January 20, 2000Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Army brat, so I attended school in several states and DODS overseas(Department of Defense) schools during the 70's. Never remember anything like that, I remember the paddle, both times I deserved it. Kids had a lot of respect for our teachers back then.

I do remember a teacher that must have been a major league pitcher, any time someone talked in his class you would not see it coming but an eraser would fly across the room followed by a cloud of white chalk smoke at impact on the guilty parties head.
 
Posts: 3930 | Location: FL, GA,HB, and all points beyond | Registered: February 10, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Diablo Blanco
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My only real recollection of first grade was Mrs Bass yelling at me because I used to write with both hands. When one hand got tired I switched to the other one. I eventually settled on writing lefty and doing just about everything else right handed. I used to throw a baseball left handed but my dad forced me to become a righty thrower because I was able to use my brother’s hand me down gloves. Money was tight but we didn’t know it, as we had everything we needed. I switch hit the entire time I played baseball, but wonder how much further I could have gotten as a lefty. I’m even shooting right and left these days. Being left eye dominant but way more comfortable as a right handed shooter I am starting to wonder what it would have been like if I started shooting lefty.

Now back to the topic, I really don’t remember any real pay ops things from school in the 70s. I grew up in the rural small CT town of Southbury, which primarily centered around dairy farming and agriculture.


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Posts: 3055 | Location: Middle-TN | Registered: November 05, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
semi-reformed sailor
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I went to school in the 70s in Tampa and nothing like that happened



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Posts: 11570 | Location: Temple, Texas! | Registered: October 07, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Raptorman
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Yes. They LOVED to experiment with twins psychologically back then so they could get their name in some book.

Out of nowhere they would accuse us of cheating to see if answers on tests would change on subsequent tests.

It's probably some of the reason I sought to destroy the school system I worked for.

I remember I had been at the system for a few years when I encountered one of the old psychologists that so happened to drop by my classroom. He was "amazed I turned out so well". I told him no thanks to YOU, your experiment failed and all you did was cause harm. It took me decades to recover and to try to become normal! and politely asked him not to step foot back in my room again without orders from the superintendent. Never saw him ever again after that.


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Posts: 34575 | Location: North, GA | Registered: October 09, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Just because you can,
doesn't mean you should
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I finished my public schooling in the early 70's FWIW.

I not only don't recall any such activity, I never heard any rumor, much less credible story of this until now, decades later.

I also never heard any mention by others I knew or even in any news media or from strangers.

Sounds like yet another internet rumor.


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Posts: 9985 | Location: NE GA | Registered: August 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Started Kindergarten in 1967 in a Chicago suburb. Never saw anything like what the OP described.




This space intentionally left blank.
 
Posts: 5059 | Location: Florida | Registered: August 16, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
thin skin can't win
Picture of Georgeair
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Teachers may have been, overall, less well trained and less professional. Not that there isn't some boneheaded shit going on now as well of course.

quote:
Amy and I kissed on the school's playground's swing set


I believe I still have a firm marriage commitment with Grace from second or third grade. I mean, SHE checked the damn box!



You only have integrity once. - imprezaguy02

 
Posts: 12888 | Location: Madison, MS | Registered: December 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Savor the limelight
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Using the giant paper cutter shear thing, my kindergarten teacher purposely smashed the B-25 model airplane my dad and I built that I brought in for show and tell. One of my second grade spelling words was hippopotamus. Amy and I kissed on the school's playground's swing set the last day of second grade because I was moving from New Jersey and we'd never see each other again.

I'm drawing a blank on freaky experiments at Warnsdorfer Elementary School though.
 
Posts: 11996 | Location: SWFL | Registered: October 10, 2007Reply With QuoteReport This Post
אַרְיֵה
Picture of V-Tail
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quote:
Originally posted by Chris Orndorff:

Surprised you recall with such detail your first grade experiences!
Things that make a strong impression create memories that tend to stay with a person. I have a very clear memory of Pearl Harbor day, very detailed. I was younger than first grade at the time -- five weeks short of my fifth birthday.



הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים
 
Posts: 31703 | Location: Central Florida, Orlando area | Registered: January 03, 2010Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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