Honda switched over from timing belts to timing chains around the 2012-ish time frame...sooner on some models than others or perhaps later. Anyway, we bought my daughter a 2013 Honda CRV with a timing chain. We have had it for about 90 days and took it in to the mechanic because it had been making a noise which we thought was the tensioner on the serpentine belt. It was, but the noise did not entirely go away. Nearly $1,400 later the timing chain (stretched by 1/2 inch) and actuator and a few other parts to do with those mechanisms have all been replaced.

After speaking with our long time mechanic he said that this is very common on Honda's with 120k-150k miles on them. Ours only has 90k miles. He believes the issue is the weight of the oil they use 0-W20. The oil is simply too light and they are trying to force too many miles between oil changes. He strongly recommended 3,000 miles between oil changes on that vehicle.

We have no other cars/trucks that run on 0-W20 oil, my wife's 2007 Odyssey runs on W30 I think and my 2008 GMC 6.6L Duramax runs on 5-W40 or 15W40, Shell Rotella T6 specifically is what I use. We run full synthetic on all vehicles, Mobil One preferred except for my diesel.

To say I am disappointed with Honda is an understatement. I have put no less than 230k miles on any vehicle I have ever owned. I keep them until they die as automobiles are just money pissed down the drain as far as I am concerned, but a necessity none the less. My wife has about another 100k to put on her Odyssey before we replace it, but most likely we will be very careful as to what it is replaced with.

Unfortunately this is a common tactic with manufacturers in their efforts to squeeze ever last 1/100 mpg out of a vehicle. As long as the car lasts past the warranty they really don’t give a shit about what happens after that.

Having said that I am running the recommended oil in our new Gladiator until the warranty is up then I’ll be going to a higher weight oil. Jeep is offering 4 free oil changes in the first 24 months of ownership which for me is about every 5K miles and I’ll take that instead of 9-10K if you listen to the computer...

I thought all Honda SUV's used belts

As long as they can squeeze the slightest bit of fuel economy for the EPA, they don't care about the end user. Start/stop technology? YAY!

The new game plan is to push electric vehicles onto people who didn't want them so the EPA becomes the power company's problem.

In my opinion and experience Honda just isn’t making engines nearly as good as they used to. They have lost their engineering prowess and have focused too much on fuel economy and not enough on longevity and quality.

Timing chain stretching, sometimes accompanied by the variable timing sprocket also bad (makes a "teeth-gnashing" sound upon startup or gets stuck out of time) has been going on with that engine since ~2002 and before 0W20 oil (both 5W20 and 5W30). I have repaired several, the last one a 2008 Accord. I wouldn't go longer than 5000 miles on an oil change, for sure, no matter what the oil life monitor may say.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: egregore,

Can you expand on what the problem is? How is lightweight oil causing early wear for the chain/belt and other components?

I have a couple of (toyota) cars that use lightweight oil and are either chain or belt. And 120-150K miles on them now. What am I watching for? And should I switch to heavier than OEM recommended weights?

We had a relative that recently bought a lower mileage 2014 CRV (60,000) with the same problem.
I did a search and there are are lots of pages about this.
The fix is a new cam sprocket, some other gizmo, and the chain, (which I don't think is really the issue) for $1500-2000.
Seems like it is a design flaw in the variable timing system that Honda should have recognized and fixed much earlier. I'm really surprised there isn't some sort of legal action about this.

I have a 2012 CRV as does a woman in my office. Hers has a 130,000 miles and she had it in the shop last week for a strange noise. She thought it was a belt. They examined the car and found the vehicle had 1 quart of oil in the engine. They performed the last oil change, a couple of thousand miles ago. No oil leaks. They told her CRV's of this era have an oil consumption issue. They recommend she stop by once a month and allow them to check the oil consumption.

Not sure if this is related, but I will ask her what weight oil they have been using.

I have had no issues with mine, which has 172,000 miles.

My BMW calls for 0W20 oil too but I always put 5W30 in it. No problems what so ever.

I would be worried that an engine that's designed for 20 weight oil at temperature might have flow issues with a higher viscosity oil. The engine tolerances may be designed around 20 weight.

This is owners trying to stretch oil changes. I hear it a lot; this car cna go longer. Synthetic can go longer

Combustion byproducts form acids in the case. With operation and condensation, these acids are washed into the oil. It doesn't matter if it's synthetic of mineral. It doesn't matter if it's synthetic. The acid is still there. Synthetic may not break down thermally as fast as mineral; the oil should be changed anyway. Every 3 to 4 months, even if the car is never started. The acids still build, still lay against cams, bearings, journals. Corrosion still occurs.

Change the oil every 3 to 4 thousand miles, a lot of problems don't occur.

There are a buttload of vehicles that specify 0W-20 oil . I'm going to wait and see the long term results before I panic .

quote:

Originally posted by sns3guppy:
This is owners trying to stretch oil changes. I hear it a lot; this car cna go longer. Synthetic can go longer

Combustion byproducts form acids in the case. With operation and condensation, these acids are washed into the oil. It doesn't matter if it's synthetic of mineral. It doesn't matter if it's synthetic. The acid is still there. Synthetic may not break down thermally as fast as mineral; the oil should be changed anyway. Every 3 to 4 months, even if the car is never started. The acids still build, still lay against cams, bearings, journals. Corrosion still occurs.

Change the oil every 3 to 4 thousand miles, a lot of problems don't occur.

How does all of that stretch the timing chain?

I call BS on most of this. mt 2012 Pilot just turned 159K. 0/20 oil change. every 10k miles. NO oil consumption issues, no noise.

My wife gets cr-v's, runs em to 200k, gets another one. Ran one to 320K No issues. Sorry not buying this.

quote:

How does all of that stretch the timing chain?

Typical timing chain set for this engine:



The chain doesn't stretch in the manner of, say, a rubber band. What happens is that the over 100 links and pins develop wear and slack between them, causing an increase in length. The chain guides also wear. Eventually, the hydraulic tensioner (the little cylinder-shaped part at lower left) piston is pushed all the way out trying to take up the slack. If enough slack develops, the chain will skip teeth on the sprockets, putting the camshafts out of time. Usually by the time I see the car, they are so far off that the engine won't even start. All of this will happen if the chain isn't getting good lubrication.

The second, little chain goes down into the oil pan and drives the oil pump. This one is usually OK because it is submerged in the oil pan, unless the oil is run extremely low.

quote:

Originally posted by BBMW:
I would be worried that an engine that's designed for 20 weight oil at temperature might have flow issues with a higher viscosity oil. The engine tolerances may be designed around 20 weight.

And this is the point at which I always offer up this little tidbit. The Honda Pilot my wife drives calls for 0w20. The exact same vehicle, build on the exact same assembly line(s), but shipped to Australia for sale, calls for 5w30. This light weight oil nonsense is purely game playing to try and placate US CAFE standards.

quote:

Originally posted by tatortodd:

How does all of that stretch the timing chain?[/QUOTE]

It doesn't. Increased wear causes increased values in every link, causing a longer chain, just as wear affects many other clearances within the engine.

Change the oil more frequently.

The engine wears. The oil carries the wear particles, much of which is too small for the filter. That increases wear further, regardless of oil type.

quote:

Originally posted by FN in MT:
Sorry not buying this.

You don't have to. "This" doesn't require your buying into it to be true.

Timing chains are a wear item. 120k miles is a long time for a timing chain.

My 2019 VW Jetta calls for 0W-20. It never gets real cold in Phoenix, so maybe I can go with something heavier. It's cooled off now and I am due for an oil change.