I think that’s the handle of the member that used to work with training service animals. I am getting some conflicting information from a family member who wants a service dog and I’m trying to verify the legitimacy of the information she’s provided. Any member with a service animal or involved in training etc. of such animals please feel free to chime in.

What is the question?

An emotional support animal is an animal that makes someone feel better simply by being present.

A service animal has been trained to perform an active task to assist a person with a disability as defined under the ADA.

That is a WIDE category. Everyone is aware of seeing eye dogs. There are service animals trained to assist with other physical disabilities (e.g., to pick things up off the floor or open doors for people with physical disabilities). There are also much less obvious cases, like service animals trained to detect and alert their owners (in a variety of different ways like barking or pawing) to impending seizures, diabetic hypoglycemia, etc. There are also service animals trained to assist with psychiatric disabilities in things like detecting panic attacks or PTSD episodes and interrupting them by barking, pushing, biting (gently), lying on top of the person, etc.

The distinction between an ESA and a service animal for someone with a psychiatric or mental disability is that the service animal is trained to perform a task (actively actually do something) to assist with a recognized disability under the ADA, while an ESA makes someone (possibly a person with a disability recognized under the ADA, that doesn't change things) feel better by being present (so they aren't alone, so they have something to pet and pay attention to, etc).

There is NO legal requirement for certification or registration of service animals, there is NO legal requirement for any kind of harness or indication the animal is a service animal, and there is NO legal requirement for who does the training (you can do it yourself).

An ESA can absolutely provide a legitimate, meaningful benefit to a person with a legitimate, horrific mental illness that easily qualifies as a disability under the ADA, but is still not legally a service animal.

You can email me if you'd prefer to discuss privately. I am not a professional trainer but know quite a bit about service animals and the legal stuff.

What's your question?

I believe what maladat posted is spot on.


My significant other's sister works for a non profit that trains service dogs. The training their dogs get is incredible. The process starts at birth.


We occasionally short term foster service dogs in training and our current dog was in training to be a service animal until an injury disqualified him from becoming one.

If you are the least bit intuitive the difference is obvious. The price is another. A service animal first checks out the room for you then lays down and alerts you if needed. The emotional support animal is basically a pet.

The wife had a service dog for mobility assistance - a 90 pound Malamute, a pretty sturdy dog - bracing her while walking, helping her get up from chairs (and at least once from the ground after she toppled - not the dog's fault), pulling her wheelchair when she was chairbound and pulling her shopping cart.

Other services - Opening mandoors both by pushing on them and pulling on ropes tied to doorknobs, as well as rearing up to push the "push here" electric buttons. Opening cupboard doors. Opening the refrigerator was deliberately NOT taught. Picking things up from the floor - bigger and softer worked better; the dog never got the hang of car keys, but I understand other dogs do this.

When the dog had the vest on, she did a good job of ignoring everything and everybody that wasn't in her job description. When we'd go to a restaurant, she'd disappear under the table and no-one would know she was in the building until it was time to leave, when she'd pop out to support the wife.

The "pulling the wheelchair" bit didn't work too well - the dog couldn't comfortably pull it slow enough. Going too fast for the wife - that the dog could do.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
The price is another.

If you purchase a dog that has already been trained as a service dog, sure. A trained service dog tends to cost enough to buy a pretty good car.

However, the legal requirement is that the animal be trained. There are NO legal requirements regarding who does the training, NO legal requirements about how the training is performed and NO legal requirements for any kind of certification or evaluation of the training. Depending on a person's specific needs and knowledge of animal handling, it can be entirely feasible for a person to train their own service animal (or a family member to train a service animal for them, or whatever).

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
The emotional support animal is basically a pet.

This is pretty much true. It doesn't mean that an ESA can't be of tremendous benefit to someone, but legally an ESA is not a service animal and is not subject to the same legal privileges and protections.

I am not for regulations in general,but sounds like some is needed. Thanks for your input.

Maladat is spot on. I work in Federal Buildings and I can only ask "Is your dog required due to a disability?" If the answer is "Yes", they can proceed. If the dog/animal is obviously not trained (owner doesn't have adequate control, it growls at people, or disrupts normal business, think pees on someone's shoes), it is not allowed in the building.

I'm not sure if I'm addressing the issue the OP is asking so I apologize if my 2 cents worth has no bearing on the information he is looking for.

I worked at a hotel for 32+ years and the issue came up very often as to what is a service animal. It was a pet free hotel and a good majority of people would try to check in with their pets passing them off as emotional support animals which in most cases they are not. Although we were very lenient with veterans.

I always let the guests know that if their "emotional support" animal bit or attacked or in any way menaced another guest that they should be prepared to be sued. A guest in a nearby hotel had been attacked by a so called emotional support animal and the owner ended up being sued and paying out a sizeable chunk of money.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
I am not for regulations in general,but sounds like some is needed. Thanks for your input.

There is plenty of regulation. A service animal legally has to be trained to perform a task to assist with a recognized disability, and legally has to be well-behaved or can be excluded from public places. That is EXACTLY what actually matters.

Service animals are expensive enough (or enough work to train yourself) as it is. It is frankly a God-damned miracle that our invasive ever-expanding government hasn't made it drastically harder (both financially and in burdensome bureaucratic bullshit) for people who need service animals to get them.

quote:

Originally posted by odin:
Maladat is spot on. I work in Federal Buildings and I can only ask "Is your dog required due to a disability?" If the answer is "Yes", they can proceed. If the dog/animal is obviously not trained (owner doesn't have adequate control, it growls at people, or disrupts normal business, think pees on someone's shoes), it is not allowed in the building.

Your workplace policy may not have allowed it, but legally, you can also ask what task the animal is trained to perform.

What you CAN'T ask is what disability the person has, for proof of training, for any kind of certification or registration or license (none has any legal meaning to begin with),
for demonstration of the task, or anything else.

quote:

There is plenty of regulation. A service animal legally has to be trained to perform a task to assist with a recognized disability, and legally has to be well-behaved or can be excluded from public places. That is EXACTLY what actually matters.

^^^^^^^^^
Thanks for the clarification. I was referring to ESR pretending to be service animals, not for legit service animals.

quote:

Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:

quote:

There is plenty of regulation. A service animal legally has to be trained to perform a task to assist with a recognized disability, and legally has to be well-behaved or can be excluded from public places. That is EXACTLY what actually matters.

^^^^^^^^^
Thanks for the clarification. I was referring to ESR pretending to be service animals, not for legit service animals.

Sorry!

Fraudulently claiming an animal is a service animal is illegal, but there's no practical way to police or enforce that without placing an undue burden on people who need service animals.

Just asking the "what task?" question will make most pretenders go "uhhhh..." and then they can be asked to leave.

I don't believe any federal laws currently provide privileges for emotional support animals. A few states have laws that do.

For a while regulations made by DoT under the authority of the Air Carrier Access Act required airlines to allow ESAs in-cabin subject to some additional requirements that don't apply to service animals (like submitting a letter from a therapist supporting the passenger's need of the ESA), but those regulations were changed in 2015. Airlines are no longer required to accommodate ESAs and as far as I know, all the airlines only allow ESAs in-cabin if they are able to travel under the normal in-cabin pet policies.

Thanks for the clarification.

Sorry I’ve been busy today, and haven’t been able to check back. I just recalled that at some point ChicagoSigman was involved in training service dogs, so I was hoping for illumination.

I have a family member who wants to purchase and train her own service dog (I am not certain what disability they have, tbh). She directed me to a website and wanted my opinion on whether or not it was legitimate and if I could somehow help her get them to accept the breed of her choice (toy, not super trainable, prone to accidents, skittish). My experience is that service dogs are professionally trained to perform the tasks required, and that they are extremely expensive, so I was very suspicious of the online site and the fact that you could pretty much pick up a mutt from the pound and train it (some of my best dogs have been mutts, so please don’t take offense, I just remember there being a lot of dogs culled from programs because they weren’t “whatever” enough- pick your poison).

I think what she really wants is an ESA -at least that’s what she’s described to me. She’s lonely and she wants companionship, but she wants that companion to be able to accompany her everywhere.

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
I think what she really wants is an ESA -at least that’s what she’s described to me. She’s lonely and she wants companionship, but she wants that companion to be able to accompany her everywhere.

I'd say you are correct. Caveat, I really like dogs but my ass is tired of being forced to accept irresponsible owners and their poorly trained ESA's that they try to pass off as service dogs. My last two flights as prime examples. An entire plane subject to constant barking from boarding time to deplaning just so some jackwagon feels emotionally supported.

I have a great love of dogs and think service dogs are awesome. That said I find a lot of the Emotional Support Animals to be complete and total bullshit.

We had more of a problem with it in Arizona than we do in Alaska of people trying to bring their Emotional Support Animals in with them when checking into the ER. I was the one responsible for the hospital policy banning them after I was bit by a terrier in Arizona. They presented all kinds of issues for staff; potty breaks, food and water, what to do with them when the patient is inside an MRI for an hour, not to mention fleas, ticks and lack of grooming. Then with me when the patient screamed as I was administering a shot, I got bit in the hand. And oh yeah, security had K-9's and sometimes the ESA's would lose their shit, literally, when seeing a 95lb. Maligator.

Policy was we would ask at registration if the dog was a service animal. Partners with true service dogs usually had no problem stating that their dog was, would offer up without being asked what service they performed and may times had documentation with them. If the answer was, "He's here to keep me calm" or anything like that they would be informed of the policy and told they were welcome to check in but their emotional support animal could not accompany them. We could usually tell, if the dog was calm and well behaved, chances are it was a service animal; barking, dressed in a sweater and being carried, pulling at the leash and leaving puddles in the hallway chances are it was an ESA.

There was an individual in Phoenix who trained service dogs for diabetics. These dogs were amazing and would alert if their partner's blood sugar got too high or low. The way he acquired his dogs is that he developed a test to see if dogs were sensitive to detection of blood sugar levels. He would go to the pound and work with local rescues to acquire dogs, see if they were sensitive and train them. I thought this was totally awesome for both the dogs and their partners and the dogs could be any type of breed or mix.

We did have some patients that we were familiar with them and their service dogs. Those dogs were treated like royalty by the staff. They would get walked outside by staff, provided water and snacks if the owner gave permission. And if needed they would hang out in the nurses' station if the patient was having an exam or procedure that the dog could not be at bedside for. But those are things we could not do for an untrained and unsocialized ESA.

I appreciate all the responses. Powers, I completely agree with you. 2000Z-71, thanks for your description of how the individual acquired his trainable dogs. As I said, my absolute best dogs were crossbreeds and mutts, but I couldn’t figure out how someone could just collect a pup from the pound and decide it was workable to a specific need (we aren’t herding anyone here, and being able to alert to an impending seizure would be a pretty unique skill, I would think).

That said, what my sib verbalized they wanted was a service animal, but her description of that service animal was that of an ESA. Hell, man, most of us want an ESA. I’d love to drag my dogs and birds everywhere, damn straight I feel better scratching under a chin or stroking a furry ear while I’m talking to a stranger, but that’s not how we work here in the U.S.

And as I said, unless she’s suddenly been diagnosed with something, I’ve no clue what the disability is.

Maladat, I’ll send an email. Thank you for the legal clarification thus far. Certainly I didn’t realize it was as vague as that.. and that may well be why she thinks she can do this… because no one can ask, no paperwork is required, and she believes she can do it herself.

quote:

Originally posted by Powers77:

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
I think what she really wants is an ESA -at least that’s what she’s described to me. She’s lonely and she wants companionship, but she wants that companion to be able to accompany her everywhere.

I'd say you are correct. Caveat, I really like dogs but my ass is tired of being forced to accept irresponsible owners and their poorly trained ESA's that they try to pass off as service dogs. My last two flights as prime examples. An entire plane subject to constant barking from boarding time to deplaning just so some jackwagon feels emotionally supported.

I honestly feel like now is the time to require placards or ID cards for service animals to make identification seamless. It's required for handicapped parking idk why it's not required for the animals. As of right now you're only allowed to take someone at their word for it and that makes it prime for abuse.

quote:

Originally posted by ryan81986:

quote:

Originally posted by Powers77:

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
I think what she really wants is an ESA -at least that’s what she’s described to me. She’s lonely and she wants companionship, but she wants that companion to be able to accompany her everywhere.

I'd say you are correct. Caveat, I really like dogs but my ass is tired of being forced to accept irresponsible owners and their poorly trained ESA's that they try to pass off as service dogs. My last two flights as prime examples. An entire plane subject to constant barking from boarding time to deplaning just so some jackwagon feels emotionally supported.

I honestly feel like now is the time to require placards or ID cards for service animals to make identification seamless. It's required for handicapped parking idk why it's not required for the animals. As of right now you're only allowed to take someone at their word for it and that makes it prime for abuse.

Who will administer this system?
Who will be responsible for determining what qualifies?
Who will be responsible for ensuring the dog is properly trained?

I also have some misgivings about asking a disabled person to walk around with a sign (even on their dog or whatever) identifying themselves as such. I understand it when it comes to parking since there are a limited number of spaces in any given area, but I see some sort of obvious identifier as potentially embarrassing for some and a victimize me sign for others.