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| Raised Hands Surround Us Three Nails To Protect Us  |
While I agree this is likely a bad shoot but all I have is the dash cam. Some food for though. How does the officer know the person in the SUV is the one who called?? Very rarely does an officer know who actually called until the scene is assessed. Secondly from my view (only going by the video) is does not seem like a simple traffic collision. Upon the officers arrival the SUV is still moving, if someone called it in already, why is the vehicle moving upon the officers arrival?? Officer likely thought the vehicle was about to flee hence the reason he turns on his siren. That could be the reason for the officers high alert. All speculation on my part based upon the camera footage only. I have no idea how the dispatch to the call went. And yes I have had many people flee the scene of a routine collision after my arrival. ———————————————— The world's not perfect, but it's not that bad. If we got each other, and that's all we have. I will be your brother, and I'll hold your hand. You should know I'll be there for you! | |||
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Ammoholic |
What indicates the vehicle was moving? I did not see the reverse lights come on from shifting from drive to park. I did not see brake lights either. The was a slight shift in the vehicle, likely from the driver reaching for his wallet that he probably had on passenger seat. Jesse Sic Semper Tyrannis | |||
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| Rail-less and Tail-less |
To me it look more like someone moving inside be car causing a bouncing effect. Like when picking your butt up to reach for your wallet. Looking closely it doesn't look like the tires move at all. _______________________________________________ Use thumb-size bullets to create fist-size holes. | |||
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| Big Stack |
It can get much worse than this. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/...ing_of_Amadou_Diallo 41 shots fired because he pulled out his wallet. All officers aquitted. As it stands, a LEO will almost always be acquitted in these situations because their motive is legitimately, if incorrectly, self defense. | |||
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| Raised Hands Surround Us Three Nails To Protect Us |
To me it looks like the right brake light comes on at the 5/6 second mark coupled with the backend bouncing. Though possibly could be the lens changing focus as the camera passes the other vehicle. Just going by the camera does not work. We are seeing different things yet watching the same video. Now put yourself there in real life, highway noise, radio traffic, flashing lights, looks kind of rainy. And it most certainly in the video looks like he is coming out with a gun from the chest. Again, likely a bad shoot but it is way to hard to judge from one camera view. ———————————————— The world's not perfect, but it's not that bad. If we got each other, and that's all we have. I will be your brother, and I'll hold your hand. You should know I'll be there for you! | |||
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| No double standards |
Just thinking out loud. For those who think it was a sad, but good shoot (including the officer and judges), how would they feel if one of their loved ones was the person shot in this situation? Would they still hold the same position? "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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Oriental Redneck |
No one on here has said it was a "good shot". Q | |||
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| No double standards |
Maybe substitute "not wrong" for the word good, but my question remains. If that was your son who was shot, would you be of the same opinion? "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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Sigforum K9 handler |
It depends on the actual court testimony states, not an visceral, emotional response from watching a video. I normally stay out of these things, but based upon the IA investigation, prosecutors investigation, and not one, but two courts opinion on negligence, I think it is possible that there are more factors that the video alone doesn't show. I may be wrong, I don't know, wasn't there. My opinion would likely be different if it were a IA and prosecutors ruling only. But, there is something that two courts that are seeing that we are not. Yes, it was a tragedy. No, I wouldn't want it to be my son. But, I think there is something more there that hasn't been in a press release, an interview with the family, or the video. Courts hand out wrongful death money like candy in this day and age. Why not this one? | |||
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3° that never cooled |
Hated to see that young man shot. I investigated many accidents. Everyone is different, unexpected things happen,emotions run high,people do rush up, etc. This tragic situation reminded me of a scenario that occurred in some of our yearly FATS trainings. A guy suddenly whips out a wallet, or some other harmless object. I didn't shoot him, but it was a split second decision. I don't know what other officers did as we did the scenarios individually so, just like the real world, we wouldn't know what to expect. I wouldn't be surprised though, if some officers shot the guy with the wallet, etc. I am not trying to justify the actions of the officer in the video, just sharing some experience. NRA Life | |||
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| Member |
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| No double standards |
You make excellent points. It seems to me many peoples view of what is right and wrong in society changes if they have to apply the same rules to their own lives that they apply to others lives. "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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safe & sound |
"With all facts, as supported by video evidence, viewed in a light favorable to Davidson, Hancock's use of force was objectively reasonable. In so holding, we do not want to understate the suffering Davidson endured as the result of Hancock's disastrous mistake. But the positions of Davidson's wallet and hands the moment before the shooting mean that mistake did not violate Davidson's constitutional rights." | |||
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Member |
I won't go as far as saying it was a good shoot by any means. I tried to watch the video from the officer's point of view. He didn't know at the time that was a wallet in his hands. It's a stressful job for sure and as several have said, not everyone has what it takes to handle that stress. | |||
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Info Guru |
With the additional information, the subject line needs to be changed. The officer was dispatched on an erratic driving call with a description of the SUV. As he pulled up the SUV and truck were just coming to a stop and that's when the driver jumps out with his wallet in both hands pointing at the officer. The officer was not dispatched on a wreck call. “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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| Member |
Good point. One has to look at all angles. Too often body cam video or dash cam video is not enough. | |||
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| JOIN, or DIE |
They basically maimed an innocent and unarmed young man for life. The least they can do is some sort of settlement. | |||
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| Member |
Based on what I saw I'd say the moral of the story is there are a bunch of cops that should be in another line of work. | |||
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| Info Guru |
You should read the additional information link posted on this page of the thread. It was not an officer being dispatched to work a routine fender bender. He was dispatched on an erratic driving call with a description of the SUV - probably working on the assumption that the driver was impaired in some way or a road rager who just caused an accident.This message has been edited. Last edited by: BamaJeepster, “Facts are stubborn things; and whatever may be our wishes, our inclinations, or the dictates of our passions, they cannot alter the state of facts and evidence.” - John Adams | |||
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| When you fall, I will be there to catch you -With love, the floor |
easy to say when you have the time to sit and analysis the video in the leisure of a comfy chair. Make it in what probably was a few seconds. As this was a situation not unlike the subject incident, what would YOU do? Officer Miguel Moreno, a nine-year veteran of the police force, was shot in the head during the encounter Thursday. The gunman fired on Moreno and his partner, Officer Julio Cavazos, as they stepped out of their patrol car. Cavazos also was shot but returned fire and attempted to pull Moreno out of the line of fire. DEMAND time to assess the situation? View from different angles? Would be nice to have that ability. | |||
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