With interest rates being garbage right now, might try to convince the wife to put the pool off for a year & see if things are better next winter.

Personally, I'd rather put the money now into a generator & water softener/filter system that we could [probably?] pay cash for.

I realize the generator spec varies on need, but curious if anyone could ballpark what it's running recently? Am I looking at ~$10k, or is it crazy like $50k?
Also, any brand to recommend or avoid? I see Kohler & Generac the most.

2k sq ft between the main house & a small guest house in the back, plan to incorporate a pool in the future.
Looking back at our usage, we peaked in August at 2500kWh, but we were still in process of settling & were in/out a lot & the average temp was 99*

We've only been in the house since June, so don't have a full year's worth of energy use data, obviously it's trended down as we've gone into Autumn. Last bill was <1000kWh.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: P250UA5,

Here in Iowa I paid 6600 for a 22KW Generac and around 1200 for install. My generator is 3 feet from my gas meter and 6 feet from my main breaker box so material costs were lower than most. The few times I have needed it made me realize I will never be without one.

I put in a 14KW Kohler (much better reputation than Generac locally) several years ago for around $8000. It's 30-ish feet from the house so materials cost was a bit high - wire is NOT cheap.

That included the generator, the transfer switch and panel, the electrician to install it and the install certification from a Kohler rep. I formed and poured the pad and dug the trench myself.

It has been absolutely flawless. Did have one battery die on me, but that was the NAPA battery, not the genset.

My 2017 20 kw Kohler generator install had a longer run of natural gas and power than 50' to get to an area that would meet fire code (ie cost extra). My installed cost was a tad over $10k but also included coordinating with natural gas company for the larger meter, obtaining all permits, concrete pad for generator, load shedding (I have a lot more AC than someone in northern climates so I cannot run both ACs, dual oven, and electric dryer at the same time).

Going with the largest air cooled Kohler with load shedding was still significantly cheaper than the smallest liquid cooled Kohler (closer to $20k in 2017). It's also $100/year less maintenance for an air cooled vs liquid cooled generator.

I tried to obtain quotes from 4 Kohler certified dealers - platinum level, gold level, and ordinary. Surprisingly, the platinum level was the lowest cost and the owner (master electrician) did the sales. The gold level company used a salesman who wasn't an electrician (i.e. couldn't answer questions) and the 2 regular dealers were no shows despite having an appointment.

Generally, Kohler and Cummins-Onan have better reliability reputations than Generac or other brands (cue the responses form people who don't understand the word generally and think their individual experience applies globally). I suspect it's because they started on the large commercial side (e.g. the 2 megawatt ones we use post-hurricane at work) and then got into residential. Skins used to install Generac, and he's previously posted that quite a few issues first year with Generacs but tended to be good once they got beyond a year.

Had to upgrade the supply line… That was $7K

24kw installed around here is $12-14k.

Not inexpensive here (PNW)

In 2021 I was quoted $14k for a 24KW Generac, running on LP.

In 2018, I had a 22KW B&S installed for $8.5k at my previous house.

Both included 200 amp auto transfer switching. The Generac authorized gouger who wanted 14k tried to tell me it was because he had to run 20 feet of wiring to the breaker box. I could buy the same Generac equipment from Menards for about $8k (and get 11% back), so effectively he wanted 6k to run 20 feet of wire and connect stuff to the breaker box.

I didn't proceed. YMMV, but Generac use a network of 'Certified Installers' who charge like wounded bulls.

I guess that's a good follow-on question.
Is this DIY-able?
I'm no electrician, but my stepdad is (in NV).

I imagine the process is much easier via a certified installer.

22KW Generac in Central Ohio is $10,500, three estimates this past Fall from 3 contractors. I passed.

quote:

Originally posted by P250UA5:
I guess that's a good follow-on question.
Is this DIY-able?
I'm no electrician, but my stepdad is (in NV).

I imagine the process is much easier via a certified installer.

If you use a "certified installer", you're basically hiring a "contractor" who handles probably 2 subcontractors (electrical and nat gas/propane). If you have a phone, can read documentation, and can speak clearly, I'd personally just contact a couple companies myself and assess whether they've done a generator install for one of these "certified installers" before. Probably save you +$1k or more, but that's just me. They'll probably also talk you into a service contract, if you can't or don't want to do the maintenance, choose your poison...

quote:

Originally posted by P250UA5:
I guess that's a good follow-on question.
Is this DIY-able?
I'm no electrician, but my stepdad is (in NV).

I imagine the process is much easier via a certified installer.

If by DIY-able you mean you doing all the installation work yourself, maybe. Download the installation manual and read it. Look up your local building codes. If between those two things you have any questions, hire someone.

If by DIY-able you mean hiring an electrician and plumber to do the work, then yes, it’s DIY-able. You’re still going to have to read the installation manual and make the decisions with where to install it though.

Find out who is the nearest service vendor. We charge $241 an hour and $3.75 a mile so a long trip can get costly quick.

Get the extended warranty as a control board replacement with time and travel will cost more than the warranty.

If you can get a liquid cooled as most of the air cooled ones are just twin cylinder lawnmower engines running at 3600 rpm. The liquid cooled run at 1800 rpm and do a lot better in hot and high humidity areas and extended outages.

Most are about the same it is the control that makes the biggest difference. Generac evolution control is a big flop and don’t last long. Kholer and Cummins use the same control that they use on larger generators with modifications that allow built in generator monitoring with a computer webpage and phone app.

Residential are sold and serviced by a dealer here and I only work on them every now and then. Installation here run between $12,000 to $25,000 depending on size and if you need load control to turn different appliances on and off due to load demand.

In 2020, I had a 24kw Kohler liquid cooled natural gas unit installed for $18K, complete. It was installed next to my home, so no issues with electrical cabling/gas lines.

We just had a Generac 24kw installed in August and with tax, came to 11,985. Our home is 1400 sq ft and we hooked up to our natural gas line. Now, this was a complete install, all permits, and everything done by the company, we didn’t have to pay any additional as they did it all. So far, so good. Now it might depend on what costs are by you and what they might offer. Generac was the one most available here. Still took a few months to get it installed, luckily they had them in stock, was the work we had to wait on.

Over the hundreds I have estimated the range was between $7K and $18K. For Air cooled and more for liquid cooled.

$7K got you a 8KW, small transfer switch, gas, electrical, and permits. $18K was a 100' run buried of gas and electrical piping upsized for the long runs. Two 200A transfer switches, 22KW gen, and load shedding.

The average for a simple install, with in 25' of both gas and electrical meters and limited modifications to a properly installed electrical panel, 200a ATS, 22KW gen, and no additional bells and whistles was $11-$12K.

Thanks Jesse.
Unfortunately, I believe my gas line terminates right off the back patio & just off the living room (noise-wise), and is around the corner from the meter (which is full, based on the pool builders taking a look at it & recommending a sub-panel for the pool equip).

A co-worker has a whole home generator that cost something like 12k, iirc.

We paid 13K to add it when house was new construction.

quote:

Originally posted by stoic-one:

quote:

Originally posted by P250UA5:
I guess that's a good follow-on question.
Is this DIY-able?
I'm no electrician, but my stepdad is (in NV).

I imagine the process is much easier via a certified installer.

If you use a "certified installer", you're basically hiring a "contractor" who handles probably 2 subcontractors (electrical and nat gas/propane). If you have a phone, can read documentation, and can speak clearly, I'd personally just contact a couple companies myself and assess whether they've done a generator install for one of these "certified installers" before. Probably save you +$1k or more, but that's just me. They'll probably also talk you into a service contract, if you can't or don't want to do the maintenance, choose your poison...

P250 and I live a nearby. If he uses the platinum Kohler dealer I used:

they perform their own electrical work and it’s top notch techs who take pride in their work (26 years O&G and have managed a tens of millions in E&I scope). Family owns two businesses, generator business and electrical business.

their civil work left a little to be desired. If I did again I’d dig and pore my own foundation. My foundation standards are higher than electrician’s’ foundation standards.

Natural gas company does the meter swap. Generator contractor coordinated and I did nothing.

---

Ego is the anesthesia that deadens the pain of stupidity

DISCLAIMER: These are the author's own personal views and do not represent the views of the author's employer.

quote:

Originally posted by P250UA5:
Thanks Jesse.
Unfortunately, I believe my gas line terminates right off the back patio & just off the living room (noise-wise), and is around the corner from the meter (which is full, based on the pool builders taking a look at it & recommending a sub-panel for the pool equip).

I'm not sure I follow. Either way, the closer electrical and gas meters are the lower your cost will be.

If your gas meter is at capacity, a upgrade is available as well as split systems that provide your existing appliances standard pressure gas and your generator a higher pressure with smaller gas piping needed to install the generator at 2PSI.

If you're electrical service is at capacity then you can upgrade it to 200a. The bad news is that it's really expensive, $1,600-$2,500 normally. The good news is you have to rewire your electrical panel to install a whole house generator anyways, making the ATS your main panel, and your existing panel a sub panel to the ATS. The difference in cost for most cases for upgrading the panel during a whole house generator install is about $400-$700 in materials and 4hrs labor. We used to charge $1,000-$1,200 generally for an upgrade. Adding a sub panel for the pool will in most cases only add an hour or two labor and <$200 in materials.

*It's been 8 years since I was in the generator field, and obviously inflation and supply chain issues with add some costs/delays to installs. So take that into consideration, also take in consideration I live in the most affluent county in the US and the DMV area has inflated costs in general compared to other areas.

Thanks for the above 2 posts.

Todd, I'll have to get your contact.

Jesse, not sure on the gas meter, but my elec panel is full. It's on the side of the house, gas line is centered on the back.
Location, I meant more for the noise aspect, with it being off the patio & living room, if we went right off the gas termination into the house.