quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Well, thank goodness that we're not missing the point.

Pretty much.

But on that note.
Kel-Tec RDB Bullpup: $1545
https://youtu.be/BASgtPpYfF0?t=2
I was not familiar w/ it.

A guard shack, and an enhanced fence. Sounds like a good idea. I wonder if positive points of controlled entry and a stronger barrier would help at the border?

Nah, I know, crazy talk...

Employing vets, check
Enhanced security at a public school? check
A leader who is more worried about the kids than some snowflake feelings? check
A leader who wants to carry the fight to the threat in as unfair a fight as possible? check

looks like a grand slam to me...

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:

quote:

Originally posted by Mountain Man:

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
Rocking the KelTec RDB.

Surprised, and bit disappointed they didn't go a M4 style patrol carbine.

Might have gotten a deal since Keltec is a Florida company.

I can see the desire for a bullpup in this case, a smaller overall rifle, harder for students to bump into / grab / etc.

But I would take an AUG or Tavor any-day over a Keltec.

Agreed, but they were probably more worried about cost. It is a public school after all..

quote:

Originally posted by RHINOWSO:
I can see the desire for a bullpup in this case, a smaller overall rifle, harder for students to bump into / grab / etc.

But I would take an AUG or Tavor any-day over a Keltec.

Absolutely! Either go Tavor, or FN P90, or let Spike's Tactical (another Florida based company) prep some AR-15 SBR's for these guys to use. Regardless, employing these guys to safeguard the school is an excellent idea that should hopefully remove any chance of a Parkland happening there.

I don't have a pony in the show (no children and don't live in Florida) but my only worry would be the cost of hiring 2 armed guards for one school. It has to be a significant expense. (I am not saying it is not justified and necessary, just that it may be hard to sell.)

And regarding the mother who said "I don't want Bubba protecting my kids!"--get over it, lady--such men are precisely who you want doing it.

flashguy

quote:

Originally posted by Sigmund:
The presence of an armed guard doesn’t necessarily deter violence.

Holy shit of course not! You need a gun-free zone to deter violence!

quote:

Originally posted by Sigmund:
The presence of an armed guard doesn’t necessarily deter violence.

No, but it greatly increases the chance that it will be directed in the right direction!

flashguy

1. What is the criteria or qualifications for such a job?
2. Along with that, what are they being paid for this full time job? People with a legit background on this would probably command significant salaries, on par at least, with teachers after pay, benefits and retirement.
3. On top of that, WHO is paying for it?
4. Are there any background checks required? Just being a veteran isn't enough. There are tons of "vets" who are criminals, or chose to engage in criminal behavior (seriously, not trying to taint the profession or the service, just saying there needs to be MORE than JUST being a vet).
5. Who takes the liability if there is a bad shooting, accidental discharge, or other such tragic incident. We train LE (minimally in many places) for this stuff and what training is required here??? Who is liable if they fail? Who is liable if they mess up?
6. What chain of command are they in during a mass casualty event? Will they be able to communicate with responding LE? Will they be in the way? WIll they engage is a "friendly fire" firefight with responding officers who have no idea who they are, where they are, or why there are there? Will they have radio contact? Will they have cross training with all possible first responders including Sheriff's deputies, local PD's and other surrounding municipal officers who will respond to assist?
7. What do they do during the myriad of "non shooter" situations that occur at schools that do not require deadly force situations such as child custody disagreements, restraining orders, truancy, autistic children tearing up classrooms or potentially harming classmates by throwing desks or stabbing with pencils.... ya know, the stuff school resource officers are training in how to handle... Just put two in the poor kid's brain pan?

I'm getting slightly hyperbolic, but I think we are lacking the big picture here and getting ahead of ourselves.

50k in many areas is a LOW wage job and will, by nature of economics attract the lower common denominators... And those questions above are just a few I could think of off the top of my head.

And like or not, and absolutely no offense to our members who have served, we all know that simpley serving in the military isn't a license for greatness. Just like other professions, there were tons of ass clowns there. Every vet I work with has stories of "that guy" who they wouldn't trust with a cap gun, and those guys got honorable discharges.... Hell, as a cop I have a few of those "that guys" that if it were up to me I'd fire in a hot minute, and THOSE guys seemed to pass more of a check than THESE guys.

Let's put a bit more thought into this.

quote:

Originally posted by dsiets:

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Well, thank goodness that we're not missing the point.

Pretty much.

But on that note.
Kel-Tec RDB Bullpup: $1545
https://youtu.be/BASgtPpYfF0?t=2
I was not familiar w/ it.

I don't think it matters if what they're carrying is a Kel-Tec or BCM or Knights Armament. I'm just glad to see a school allowing this type of armed presence. I live in California and I cannot see that happening in my wildest dreams. They just passed a law that lets the state overrule the local school district if the school allowed teachers to be armed.

quote:

Originally posted by Voshterkoff:
The elites children are protected by armed guard, about time the rest of them are.

True, but they needed to start somewhere.
Now, one can hope it takes off like a raging forest fire.

I think the deterrent effect will have anyone considering such activities to reconsider or go elsewhere.

No such thing here in WI, but police with the squad car are at the school rather often.

And if there is a disturbed cowardly kid in that school, I'm sure that they'll choose to forgo that sort of copy-cat attack because there will be quick consequences when the men step in to kick their ass.

Prevention.

No, they've got the wrong rifles and their tactical gear looks cheesy, so they cannot help.

Shhh! Listen!!

What's that faint whistling noise??

quote:

Originally posted by sourdough44:
I think the deterrent effect will have anyone considering such activities to reconsider or go elsewhere.

No such thing here in WI, but police with the squad car are at the school rather often.

While preparing our Workplace Violence Prevention and Mitigation training program, we researched many past active shooter incidents. It becomes clear that the primary fear of most active shooters it not being killed; most do not expect to survive the incident. Their primary concern is being interfered with before they get a body count. I will suggest that, irrespective of the brand names, adequately armed and equipped security professionals present a substantial risk of the shooter being interfered with. So move down the road and choose an unprotected venue for your rampage.

We train armed security officers for their firearms license in Florida. A trend we are seeing locally is for private and local government organizations to move away from unarmed security officers to armed security officers. It costs them more but it is a reflection of the kind of world we live in. Schools will have no choice but to move in this direction in the future.

No, the shooter will just go ahead with their plans to shoot up the school because they play COD and they know cheesy tactical gear when they see it and these guys don't even have the right rifles. Piece of cake.

Sure, that's how it would go.

quote:

Originally posted by drew3630:

quote:

Originally posted by dsiets:

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:
Well, thank goodness that we're not missing the point.

Pretty much.

But on that note.
Kel-Tec RDB Bullpup: $1545
https://youtu.be/BASgtPpYfF0?t=2
I was not familiar w/ it.

I don't think it matters if what they're carrying is a Kel-Tec or BCM or Knights Armament. I'm just glad to see a school allowing this type of armed presence. I live in California and I cannot see that happening in my wildest dreams. They just passed a law that lets the state overrule the local school district if the school allowed teachers to be armed.

This.

The statistical likelihood of any given public school student being killed by a gun, in school, on any given day since 1999 was roughly 1 in 614,000,000.

...but it all comes down to fashion, y'see, so...

That school has 2100 kids. And is a private Charter school. They can EASILY come up with 100K a year to hire two armed guards.

quote:

Originally posted by szuppo:
The statistical likelihood of any given public school student being killed by a gun, in school, on any given day since 1999 was roughly 1 in 614,000,000.

That all sounds just great, until it is your kid!