A good friend is moving back to CA to look after her elderly mom and she and my wife are going to drive from VA to CA in two weeks time, then my wife will fly home from there. Both have Virginia concealed carry permits which looks to give them good coverage as long as they stay out of Illinois and of course CA.

What's the best strategy for my wife here? Stop at a Fedex or UPS and drop a pre-paid parcel off addressed back to our house from somewhere in western Arizona? (Obviously USPS is not an option)

I don’t believe UPS or FedEx currently allow a non-licensee to ship a handgun. Only FFLs. I’d have her carry a handgun that’s permissible in CA, unload it and stow in in her suitcase when she reaches the CA border. Then fly home with it in her checked baggage, complying with the regulations of TSA and the airline and airport.

Just about any handgun would be fine as long as you don't have any magazines with greater than 10 round capacity. While in California, keep it unloaded in a lockbox separate from the magazines and ammo in the car and fly home with it in that box. A handgun doesn't need to be on the California roster just to bring it in visiting.

She’s on an 0500 flight to come back east so not ideal to fly with anything given the way most airline counters don’t know how to handle.

I’m ok risking the pistol and FedEx account should they pick it up in shipping; it’s their rule, not a law to be concerned about. Cheaper than the cost of a missed flight and rebook if she has a prob at the counter

What airline? Procedures are similar across most. And if you get the occasional Troglodyte, ask for a Supervisor.

I've ridden my bike, driven a car and flown to CA about 100x and almost never without a gun. Even been pulled over a few times while carrying. Concealed means concealed. Riding my bike from AZ to IN soon and have to ride through IL on the way.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Rick Lee,

She probably should be at the ticket counter at least 60 minutes prior to departure, perhaps 90 minutes at some airports, and even 2 hours at LAX or SFO.

If you are confident the counter will be open then, I'd have her do as others suggest, put it in her checked luggage. It is 100% legal and usually very easy. Just be sure the handguns and magazines are legal in CA.

If 5 am is their first flight for that airline, I'd see if there is a slightly later flight just to ensure the ticket counter is open.

What would be the penalty for sending the handguns via Fedex or UPS if discovered? I would be surprised if they could confiscate them. The other question would be if the commie CA desk agent might somehow alert law enforcement and create an issue.

Here the UPS will sometimes drop off at the post office for final-mile delivery (which for us is a PO Box). I would research that a bit before using UPS. I don't know enough to understand under which situations UPS does that.

If there is no significant penalty if found in the Fedex or UPS package, it wouldn't bother my conscience to ship it.

2 separate boxes of gun parts would be in compliance.

For me, I'd check it at the counter.... it as to be open right? It is really not that big a deal to check a firearm when flying... at least in my experience.... I've done it a couple dozen times over the last 10 or 15 years...

you just declare a firearm at the ticket counter and they ask questions... they used to want to see the firearm and you'd have to open the case and show it but no one has done that to me lately.... don't just check the TSA rules but also the airline rules for packing... some airlines are stricter... Delta requires any ammo be in a 'factory case' or such... TSA only requires it to not be loose...which means with TSA the ammo can be in a Magazine but not in the gun....

Oh but be prepared when she lands in Virginal her bag will be at the lost luggage office not on the normal luggage conveyer thingy... and they might just have tied the bag up with long nylon straps to keep her from opening her luggage and retrieving the gun in the airport and shooting people... now how a person cuts the nylon strap with out a sharp instrument before they get home is a mystery to me.... well not really, I figured out how to do it... with a very small flat head sqrew driver you can unlock those nylon straps.... and you can carry one of these in your carry on bag.

You are ok in Illinois if you have a ccw from your own state. You are covered if in your vehicle.

Look up the TSA web page for flying with firearms and the web page for the airline she will be flying. She will need a lockbox. Something simple like the nano is fine. I don’t believe that I have ever had the magazines in separate cases than the firearms, but check the restrictions for the airline she will be flying.

Oh, other hot tip: print out both the TSA page and the airline page, preferably with the URL shown. Should you run into some who doesn’t know, politely showing them that you are going by the guidelines of their company (or agency).

As far as CA, you can have a loaded firearm in your domicile (hotel room, parked motor home, etc), but your need it locked up and empty while traveling in CA. Check with the DOJ’s website, but I am not sure you need to put ammo in a separate case from the gun. With the vast majority of cops, they would be happy that you were trying to do the right thing, but research the law (and maybe print that out too) so you don’t have a problem with “that one cop.”

ETA: The last several times I flew the gate agents didn’t want to see the gun. They just wanted me to sign the declaration that they taped to the case. The said to hang around for a bit in case TSA wanted me to open the case. The one time I asked TSA if he needed me to open the case, he laughed and said, “with our equipment we can see everything we need to see without opening anything. Go ahead to the departure lounge.”

Edited further to add: CA Attorney General website saying transport is okay: https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/travel

Referenced statutes:

https://leginfo.legislature.ca...PEN§ionNum=25610.

https://leginfo.legislature.ca...um=16850&lawCode=PEN

I’m a little kerfuffled as I “know” that the firearm has to be unloaded in the box, but I’ll be darned if I can see anywhere in either of those statutes where it says that.

On the advice of a local Sheriff’s Office employee who ought to know, when I have to go to a non-permissive environment, the correct way to secure my legally carried handgun is to unload it, lock it in a lockbox which is temporarily secured (generally by a cable) to the vehicle where it is out of sight. According to this individual, the magazines and the round that was in the chamber may be secured in the same box. I’d be a lot happier if I could point to the specific law or laws that spell that out, but…

Oh, and re Blume9mm’s comment - Great idea on the small screwdriver! Also, be flexible and if you have two people divide and conquer, ie go to the baggage carousel and lost luggage. On my last trip flying commercial with a handgun, on the trip out they said nothing about it being in lost luggage, but it was. On the trip back, they said it would be in lost luggage, but the carousel spit it out. By having one person in each spot, you’ll find it whichever spot it is in.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: slosig,

quote:

Originally posted by Fly-Sig:

What would be the penalty for sending the handguns via Fedex or UPS if discovered? I would be surprised if they could confiscate them. The other question would be if the commie CA desk agent might somehow alert law enforcement and create an issue.

It is perfectly legal to send guns via FedEx and UPS with no FFL involved. It's against their rules and they'd never pay a claim on a lost gun. But their rules are not laws.

Might be worth reading the linked article:

https://www.nraila.org/article...shipping-of-firearms

“In addition, federal law requires that the carrier be notified that the shipment contains a firearm or ammunition, prohibits common or contract carriers from requiring or causing any label to be placed on any package indicating that it contains a firearm and requires obtaining written acknowledgement of receipt.

[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(2)(A), 922(a)(5), 922(e) and (f); 27 CFR 478.30 and 478.31]”

Could she give it to an FFL in western Arizona (or even California) and have that FFL send it Priority Mail to an FFL back home in Virginia? I think that would be legal (FFL-to-FFL via Priority Mail is definitely kosher), the actual shipping cost would be WAY lower than FedEx or UPS. The variable would be the charges by the FFL at either end.

It is perfectly legal to ship a gun to an FFL via UPS or FedEx without notifying them. You just can’t ship to a non-FFL without notifying the carrier. But then why would you? Not sure if there’s a loophole for mailing to oneself.

This is the part you need to be concerned with:

18 U.S.C. 922e

(e)It shall be unlawful for any person knowingly to deliver or cause to be delivered to any common or contract carrier for transportation or shipment in interstate or foreign commerce, to persons other than licensed importers, licensed manufacturers, licensed dealers, or licensed collectors, any package or other container in which there is any firearm or ammunition without written notice to the carrier that such firearm or ammunition is being transported or shipped; except that any passenger who owns or legally possesses a firearm or ammunition being transported aboard any common or contract carrier for movement with the passenger in interstate or foreign commerce may deliver said firearm or ammunition into the custody of the pilot, captain, conductor or operator of such common or contract carrier for the duration of the trip without violating any of the provisions of this chapter. No common or contract carrier shall require or cause any label, tag, or other written notice to be placed on the outside of any package, luggage, or other container that such package, luggage, or other container contains a firearm.

quote:

Originally posted by slosig:

Oh, and re Blume9mm’s comment - Great idea on the small screwdriver!

I would think a lighter/matches would be easier to melt the zip tie off, or are those not allowed too?

The screwdriver would work, but I just have a pair of nail clippers in my carry-on bag or pack. Works perfectly--but you'll need extra zip ties.

quote:

You just can’t ship to a non-FFL without notifying the carrier. But then why would you? Not sure if there’s a loophole for mailing to oneself.

From the OP’s question I presume they’re proposing to ship the gun to themselves, not a FFL. Maybe I’m mistaken.

As to “mailing” a handgun to oneself, I’m pretty sure that’s not permitted, either. At least if obedience to the law (however stupid it is) makes any difference.

It seems to me the simplest, most clearly legal and legitimate way to get the pistol home is in a checked bag on the airplane.

And the suggestion made by another to ship the disassembled firearm in two boxes isn’t really a solution either. The law considers that serial numbered frame to be the firearm.

Yeah, she would be shipping either back to our address or to an FFL here who doesn't charge us much and was where she bought the gun originally. Neither are permitted by commercial carrier since January this year due to the pressure on them.

I think she's not going to bring the pistol along...the friend she's helping to move has a spare she's going to carry so it will stay with the friend in CA when my wife comes home. Seems like the easiest option.

Ship my gun is a service from Bud's gun shop.

I have not used them but I have heard good things about it.

It is pretty painless I have been told.