Ok, I'll admit, this guy went a little overboard (actually quite a bit overboard) but damn, 10 years and a Dishonorable Discharge.


A Marine Corps drill instructor convicted of physically abusing young recruits, one of whom killed himself, was sentenced Friday to 10 years in military prison.

The eight-man jury at Camp Lejeune, N.C., on Friday also sentenced 34-year-old Gunnery Sgt. Joseph Felix to forfeiture of all pay, reduction of his rank to private and a dishonorable discharge.

Felix had been found guilty Thursday of hazing and maltreatment of recruits at the Marine Corps’ Parris Island, S.C., boot camp. The jury of five sergeants and three officers determined that Felix punched, kicked and choked recruits, zeroing in on three Muslim military volunteers for special mistreatment.

In March 2016, Raheel Siddiqui, 20, a Pakistani-American from Taylor, Mich., committed suicide by jumping off a stairwell after Felix yelled at him and slapped him, prosecutors said. Siddiqui’s family filed a $100 million wrongful death lawsuit last month against the Marine Corps.

Felix was one of six drill instructors at Parris Island charged with abuse after Siddiqui's death. Eleven others faced lesser, administrative discipline

Lance Cpl. Shane McDevitt, one of Siddiqui’s fellow recruits, testified that Felix called Siddiqui a "terrorist" approximately 10 times.

The government did not charge Felix with any crime directly related to Siddiqui's death. The judge, Lt. Col. Michael Libretto, did not allow testimony about whether Felix's actions were responsible for the recruit's death.

Two other Muslim recruits said Felix once pressured them into an industrial clothes dryer and turned it on.

Trainee Lance Cpl. Ameer Bourmeche testified Felix forced him into a clothes dryer and turned it on as Felix demanded he renounce his Islamic faith. Bourmeche testified he twice affirmed his creed and twice Felix and another drill instructor sent him for a bruising, scorching tumble inside the dryer. After a third spin, Bourmeche said he feared for his life and renounced his faith. The drill instructors then let him out, he said.

Felix also was convicted of ordering Rekan Hawez, a native of Iraqi Kurdistan, to climb into the dryer. The machine was never turned on.
The jury decided Felix also roused nearly two dozen recruits from their sleep, ordered them to lie on the floor, and then walked on their bodies along with two other drill instructors.
Felix was found guilty as well of ordering Bourmeche to simulate chopping off the head of a fellow Marine while reciting "God is great" in Arabic.
In a closing statement Wednesday, defense attorney Navy Lt. Cmdr. Daniel Bridges, said the government unfairly fashioned contradictory witness accounts into a case against the brawny drill instructor who called all recruits "terrorist."

Prosecutor Lt. Col. John Norman said Felix "picked out Muslim recruits for special abuse because of their Muslim faith. He degraded their religion and put them in industrial appliances."

Norman told the jury that Felix was "drunk on power, and sometimes Fireball whiskey."

"He wasn’t making Marines," Norman added, "he was breaking Marines."



http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017...busing-recruits.html

Deserved, but the juxtaposition with the Bergdahl decision makes that look even worse.

There is no room for this kind of abusive behavior in our military. Assault and Battery and psychological abuse are far beyond the pale of anything you could call training and discipline. By the time the convening officer and court of military appeals gets done with it I surmise the sentence will be reduced some but it appears he got the sentence he deserved.

Having spent 4 years trying recruits for the Navy I'll say that a DD and 10 years sound about right.

You can get away with a lot of things, and we did, but you don't ever strike a recruit (first) and you don't tread on their religion no matter which one it is.

We had a E7 come in drunk one night, get the division out of bed, and proceed to dry shave a few of them with a zippo lighter. Direct path to E1 and orders to Kansas. I don't remember for how long.

Being responsible for every aspect of 80+ recruits for 9 weeks is one of those things that you must do to understand.

To understand the impact ask anyone who has been in the military who their DI/RDC/CC was. They will probably remember who they were.

(35 years ago, AD1 Sims & BM1 Cox)

quote:

Originally posted by HayesGreener:
There is no room for this kind of abusive behavior in our military. Assault and Battery and psychological abuse are far beyond the pale of anything you could call training and discipline. By the time the convening officer and court of military appeals gets done with it I surmise the sentence will be reduced some but it appears he got the sentence he deserved.

I think he should have gotten 20-30 years. That SOB singled out Marines (who, like many of us, joined the military to serve their country out of a sense of love and patriotism) and BLATANTLY violated the trust and confidence that was entrusted to him. I despise those who abuse power, and this is of the worst sort. The blood of that young man who took his own life is on this turd's head. POS should fry for what he did. This is WORSE than murder - he got perverse pleasure out of torturing and tormenting US MARINES!!!!

quote:

Originally posted by SpinZone:


To understand the impact ask anyone who has been in the military who their DI/RDC/CC was. They will probably remember who they were.

(35 years ago, AD1 Sims & BM1 Cox)

December 1990-January 1991

3743 Training Squadron
TSgt Dechant
(Buck) Sergeant Cruz

3706 Training Squadron
SSgt Smith
SSgt Powell

Point being, I know what it's like to be subjected to a benevolent DI. It's terrifying; they control your entire world like a god. I can't imagine being subjected to an a-hole like this guy. It's abuse of the worst kind.

quote:

Originally posted by bobtheelf:
Deserved, but the juxtaposition with the Bergdahl decision makes that look even worse.

Yeah, Bergdahl just got a Dishonorable Discharge and a fine.

At least they provided the details, I think generally speaking, the military has gone too soft. What an average civilian would consider "abuse," I would consider oddly comforting.

Yes, this guy went way too far and it was actual abuse.

There is a difference between high stress general purpose hazing to build people up and make them stronger (and weed out the weak) and what he did.

My Drills yelled and cursed and made us do all sorts of exercises while calling us all sorts of mean names. However, they were professional, it wasn't personal to them or meant to be taken personally by us. Nobody got singled out due to religion, race, or just not being liked, it was related to performance (lack thereof ).

Well deserved and probably had an inferiority complex.

quote:

Originally posted by Strambo:
At least they provided the details, I think generally speaking, the military has gone too soft. What an average civilian would consider "abuse," I would consider oddly comforting.

I agree with this 100%.

But there are limits. This appears to have surpassed them. I am all for physical and mental extremes. Being a soldier or a Marine is not for the faint hearted, and limits MUST be pressed to help determine future response.

This DI went too far.

Punching (in the arm, chest, etc), Kicking (mild to moderately, but still...), Shoving, and otherwise fucking with recruits was absolutely done when I was in basic (1990). Mind over matter (the joke), NBC PT, you name it. It's supposed to be hard.

I was walking down the hallway with my friend when one of his Drills punched him in the chest hard enough to taco his ID tag. My friend picked himself off the floor, shook it off, and in true and normal form snapped to and said "Thank you, Drill Sgt, May I have another".

It was absolutely harmless in a broad sense, in that form, as was a mild to moderate kick or two while in the Thinking Position, which I've seen and had done. One of our Drills ran one fuckup with two left feet until he literally passed out. Big damn deal.

If those sorts of things are too much for you, in that context, you're the problem.

Such things are not unique to the marines.

When my youngest grandson was in Ft. Benning they had 3 guys kill themselves in his unit. He found one of them hanging in the shower, got covered with the guy's feces trying to save him.

Another they found hanging inside his wall locker, the 3rd took a nose dive out a second story window breaking his neck.

I have no knowledge that the DI were actually physically abusive, just making life hard on the trainees, as is done in virtually every basic training unit.

quote:

Originally posted by 46and2:

If those sorts of things are too much for you, in that context, you're the problem.

It is irrelevant what was allowed 'back in your day.' I, too, think they are too soft today. This, too, is irrelevant. Because, the standind rules and regs TODAY do not allow it. Therefore, ANY such actions are unacceptable.

If somebody cannot follow lawful orders, they have no place in the military.

This guy was abusive in the extreme, and a US Marine is dead because of him, because he violated orders. Willfully and often, from the sound of it.

quote:

Originally posted by Hound Dog:
It is irrelevant what was allowed 'back in your day.' I, too, think they are too soft today. This, too, is irrelevant. Because, the standind rules and regs TODAY do not allow it. Therefore, ANY such actions are unacceptable.

If somebody cannot follow lawful orders, they have no place in the military.

This guy was abusive in the extreme, and a US Marine is dead because of him, because he violated orders. Willfully and often, from the sound of it.

Bingo. Back "in the day" was different. This is NOT acceptable.

There is a difference between training for the enemy and training for this.

The new rules are (mostly) the problem.

The rest is what's (mostly) irrelevant.

This incident ought to motivate folks to unfuck the new rules, first and foremost.

And, then... IF there's some crazy deviation that's demonstrably and tangibly dangerous, then address that.

But instead we have what we have now.

Bad rules are bad rules and need to be dealt with before the rest, yet almost never are, and I'm sick of hearing about the rest (in general, not from you guys).

The root cause of THIS incident IS (primarily) the new rules, IMO.

SGT J D Androlowicz August to October 1964 MCRD Parris Island South Carolina brutal and sadistic were his best attributes. Our training series had three Drill Instructors relieved from one platoon.

One DI for each platoon would stay overnight with the platoon. Before lights out Androlowicz announced that if anyone wanted to leave during the night his Edsel Ford station wagon was parked in front of the barracks unlocked with the keys in the ignition along with his Smokey the Bear hat.

His instructions were simple place the hat on you head the MP’s at the end of the causeway would think it was a DI thus wave you thru. Turn right go one mile. Park the car, put the keys under the seat drivers side and lock the car.

The next morning it was noted that two recruits had departed.

Androlowicz beat on recruits normally when the senior drill instructor for the platoon was not present. The third drill instructor was indifferent for he had been reduced in rank previously for hands on attention to recruits also.

After all these decades I can’t remember an incident with a Drill Instructor that was worth laughing about.

While in Viet-Nam I noted a copy of Life Magazine on the front cover none other than now Staff Sargent Androlowicz still at Parris Island.

No there was nothing funny about our Drill Instructors!

This is the exact reason Bergdahl plead guilty and hoped the judge would show leniency - a military jury of NCOs and Officers would have sent him away for a long time.

My Basic Training was quite genteel:
My DI inspected my footlocker and discovered my GI duffle bag was.... Improperly folded! I was marched out onto the second floor landing of my Deluxe WWII era wooden (fire trap) barracks and the duffle bag was put on over my head. I then had to shout "I am a dildo" for a long period of time while female recruits marched nearby.
I was once told by my DI to never walk on the grass surrounding the Deluxe WWII era wooden (fire trap)barracks. He later observed me.... Walking on the grass! I was ordered to my hands and knees and told to crawl on the lawn while shouting "I'm sorry grass, I'm sorry", for a long period of time.
During my stint as Latrine Queen, I confirmed (at a distance of about 3 inches) that there was in fact a pube in one of my urinals.
And my DI? A been there, honest to God real life hero. Was a Pararescue in Nam assigned to A Jolly Green chopper detailed to rescue downed pilots. On one mission, he was guiding a jungle penetrator to downed pilot when the chopper took multiple hits from a .51 caliber machine gun. He was hit in the leg by the 51 and the chopper crashed and he was knocked unconscious. He came to in the burning wreckage and then survived a hand to hand encounter with a Viet Cong who had rushed to the crash site. After being rescued himself by a second Jolly Green crew, he spent months in the hospital and in rehab learning to walk again. He wore a built up boot to compensate for bone loss.
Sounds like a movie, doesn't it? I saw his citation for the DFC (somewhat rare for a VN era enlisted man) on the DI office wall. He did not wear the DFC, so I cant recall if he actually won it or was just cited for it. But he did wear the CIB. I did not know much about the military then, but I knew this was a dude I did not want to let down. He weeded out a few unsuitables but I never saw him hit a recruit.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: YooperSigs,

Abuse recruits? I've seen it.

I witnessed a South Korean Major slap the shit out of a South Korean soldier, because the kid didn't salute him quick enough to suit the Major.

Conscription into the Korean Army at that time (1959) was a general round up of kids of age off the streets, so we were called to stand guard at our fences with unloaded M1 rifles to keep these kids from climbing over fence to safety in a US base to escape the South Korean Army "draft".

Our drill sergeants in '86 could be pretty tough.

We had one SOB that, like 46and2's experience, had no issue with striking (with fist or jungle boot) us. Sometimes he'd just slap you, which was almost worse. Typically it was hard enough to knock off your soft cap, then he'd jump on you for being outside without a cover and make you do push ups until you either puked or he got tired. On several occasions he challenged us to meet him behind the barracks if we had a problem with him. Only one guy took him up on it and we didn't see him again.

Our Senior Drill Sergeant was just plain fucking crazy. Batshit crazy. One of the few times we saw him he would come into the mess hall and walk around the tables eating food off of our trays. He'd pick something up, take a bite out of it, say it tastes like shit, and put it back on the tray while laughing maniacally. Then, he'd move on to the next table. He was certifiable that one.

The one guy I really remember was SSG Williams. Black guy, about 6'3", and built like you can't believe. Solid muscle. He used to say that he was bionic. Tough as all hell, but fair if you tried. I wouldn't mind meeting him again and buying him a drink. He was a good guy.

I have no problem with drill sergeants being tough on trainees, up to and including being physical with them (within reason). If you're not tough enough to take that physicality or the psychological stress, then you really have no business wearing the uniform to begin with IMO. Boot camp ain't just about teaching you how to march and shoot an M16. It's also about turning you into a soldier who can deal with the physical and mental abuse that you might face down the road.

It's supposed to be tough. If you decide that the drill sergeant is being too mean and choose to take a header off the second floor instead, well...it sucks to be you. Millions of us have made it through just fine despite "mean" drill sergeants.