I still have mine somewhere.
Our compound had civilians (many of them displaced from Eastern Europe that we somewhat derisively referred to as the "Lithuanian Freedom Fighters" - reflecting what we thought at the time was a hopeless cause)... Anyway

Our brigade S-2, as part of a security check, put a training version of the SMLM plate on his car, put on a Soviet officer's cap, gave his driver a fur cap with a big red star, and drove up to the gate.

He flashed his American Express card (green, same general color as a military ID card at the time), and was waved on through the gate.

He stopped, and had a chat with the guards' chain of command.

While I never saw an official SMLM, whenever we rolled into sector we saw (and reported) cars that seemed to be a little too interested in what we were doing. They usually had license numbers from Frankfurt rather than the local area, so stood out if you were looking for them.

As had the USMLM in East Germany, as did the British. The vast majority of the time, everyone followed a set of understood but unwritten rules about how much you can break the official rules, and everyone got along.

The U.S. officer (Major Nichols if I recall correctly) who was shot had been climbing into the window of a building to photograph new (to us) Soviet tank.

A guard panicked and shot him, and the Soviet chain of command panicked and froze, fearful of what to report vs. getting medical aid to him in time.

I don't believe there was any official policy on the part of the Soviets in play. Rather, the incident was likely a symptom of the Soviet Army's paralysis when initiative and decision making are called for at lower levels.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott in NCal:
She was stationed in Berlin, and was on the same team as the trooper that was killed.

According to the NYT article, the major’s name was Nicholson.

The Army CID opened a case and wrote a report on the incident, and I was at the CID headquarters when it was finalized and sent there for review. I wasn’t involved in the review process, but heard its being discussed. The one thing I specifically remember was that the senior Soviet officer at the scene refused to call for medical care for the major or to allow him to be immediately evacuated by the members of the US MLM. The investigation also examined whether the shooting was legally justified under Soviet Union law. The conclusion by (our) legal experts was that it wasn’t, and there was talk of citing “an unknown Soviet army soldier” for murder. That idea was evidently abandoned.

Years later I wrote a fictional short story about an incident in which a Soviet border guard shot and killed an American infiltrator near a sensitive site. I sent the story to a retired Soviet expert for his comments, and his response to the killing in my tale was, “Oh, no; no Russian guard would kill someone under circumstances like that,” but my story wasn’t all that different from the Nicholson incident: Who knows what a poorly trained conscript who had been given vague orders might have done? And as did.

quote:

Originally posted by mk689:
Rather, the incident was likely a symptom of the Soviet Army's paralysis when initiative and decision making are called for at lower levels.

Well put, and I agree. I often think of the incident in which a Soviet fighter shot down KAL flight 007—a civilian airliner.

The autopsy that was done on Major Nicholson showed that he bled to death, and wasn't killed immediately by the shot from the Soviet sentry.

The Soviets left him laying there for over two hours and would not allow anyone to approach him.


Arthur D. Nicholson

quote:

Originally posted by Scott in NCal:
It seemed to me that between 1982 and 1985 we became much more agressive in our drills and alerts.

Don't forget that 1981 - 1985 was probably the height of the Cold War era when we thought that war with the Soviets could occur at any time.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott in NCal:
It seemed to me that between 1982 and 1985 we became much more agressive in our drills and alerts.

I was really struck by how many things in the US military changed after Reagan was elected President. Even CID agents were issued M16 rifles that we actually had locked up in our own offices.

Its these kind of details that younger people today, and many in the media, have no clue about what the Cold War encapsulated.

The levels of social engagement, the political detente and how treaties were actually implemented by the military during the Cold War, is very lost on those younger than 30. You try to explain how mutual inspections and compliance worked, and why having such a framework like SALT with the Chinese, Iranians and Norks is necessary and you get strange looks and head shaking. There a huge generation of diplomatic officers within State and Defense that have never lived in such a world, no concept of such.

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
Its these kind of details that younger people today, and many in the media, have no clue about what the Cold War encapsulated.

Truer words were never written.

And as I read your comments, it occurred to me that even the small minority of us who read world histories are likely to know far more about things like World War I and II than the Cold War. A couple about the CW that made an impression on me are Reagan at Reykjavik: Forty-Eight Hours That Ended the Cold War by Adelman and The Strange Death of the Soviet Empire by Pryce-Jones. But for every one like those two, I’ve read many more about other conflicts. Appeasement by Tim Bouverie is one I’m in the middle of now and it mentioned that prior to the war Hitler rejected any disarmament agreement that included mandatory inspections. My thought was that all despotic regimes are the same, but as you point out, so many people cannot, or will not, understand the simple reason why.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by corsair:
Its these kind of details that younger people today, and many in the media, have no clue about what the Cold War encapsulated.

Truer words were never written.

And as I read your comments, it occurred to me that even the small minority of us who read world histories are likely to know far more about things like World War I and II than the Cold War. A couple about the CW that made an impression on me are Reagan at Reykjavik: Forty-Eight Hours That Ended the Cold War by Adelman and The Strange Death of the Soviet Empire by Pryce-Jones. But for every one like those two, I’ve read many more about other conflicts. Appeasement by Tim Bouverie is one I’m in the middle of now and it mentioned that prior to the war Hitler rejected any disarmament agreement that included mandatory inspections. My thought was that all despotic regimes are the same, but as you point out, so many people cannot, or will not, understand the simple reason why.

Try to explain how Berlin was WITHIN East Germany (as in surrounded) and it had a Western/Allied sector, let alone explaining what the process was like to drive from West Germany, thru the GDR, in order to get to Berlin. The vast majority of Americans have no clue or, concept, even those older than myself who lived in that period, have a hard time visualizing that.

Thank you for sharing such an artifact. While museums and websites are able to explain and show the major plot points of history, its folks like yourself and others that are able to explain the day-to-day details of that period, and more importantly provide perspective.

Quote
Try to explain how Berlin was WITHIN East Germany (as in surrounded) and it had a Western/Allied sector, let alone explaining what the process was like to drive from West Germany, thru the GDR, in order to get to Berlin. The vast majority of Americans have no clue or, concept, even those older than myself who lived in that period, have a hard time visualizing that.


FLAG orders needed to drive your POV from Berlin to West Germany. My parents visited when I was stationed in Berlin (1971). We drove from Berlin to West Germany in my car. It shook my mother up went we went around the barriers at the wall and stopped to process my paperwork with soviets (not east Germans) on the other side. My orders were if detained to ask for a Russian, the US did not recognize East Germany.

I dug through some really old pictures today and found a couple of very faded shots taken during a 1/3dACR patrol along the West/East German border - snowy, barren, except for the multiple fences and a guard tower. Date on the back was January 1964. Sorry, they were not clear enough to scan and up load.
Some of you all can relate to running those patrols.

Blackhorse4

quote:

Originally posted by Blackhorse4:
Definitely remember the cards, protocol, from our 3D Armored Cav border patrols from 1963-1966 on the East German border. Our post was near the Fulda Gap. The 14th Armored Cav had primary responsibility IIRC. Shadowed more then one of those cars.
Regards.
Blackhorse4

I was in the 3rd. Armored Division. If the balloon went up, our initial combat position was the Fulda Gap. Mission? Keep "them" from getting through the gap for 72 hours. After that, any survivors were to infiltrate to the rear and join other units. Pre-positioned fighting positions, too. Where tanks were to fight from those pre-dug fighting pits. Only the turrets exposed to enemy fire.

quote:

Originally posted by Scott in NCal:

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by Vanwall:
From what I was told the British, French, And US each had a specific number of cars that could be in East Berlin and and vice Vera for Soviet’s.

An American Army officer was killed by a Soviet guard in East Germany during one mission.



Link

I was a Spearhead trooper, 3AD, stationed in Gelnhausen when that happened. I remember it well. I still have that card, along with my drivers lic and other treasures in a box my kids will toss when i am gone. Not all that long ago I met Nina Willner(sp ?) the auther of a book 40 Autumns. Her mothers family was divided. Her mom married a soldier and she became one. OCS or ROTC I think. She was stationed in Berlin, and was on the same team as the trooper that was killed. I always assumed he was some place he wasnt suppose to be, she said no though. It seemed to me that between 1982 and 1985 we became much more agressive in our drills and alerts. Also I think our warplanes probed the border near Fulda a bit more, and that, along with the tactical nukes, Perishing 2 and GLCMs, was part of it. Of course that could have been my imagination, GI gossip
or lost helecopter pilots. Now it all seems like a long long time ago in a land far far away. I was young, I miss those days sometimes.

As I recall, that was CCC in Gelnhausen, was it not?

Maybe you remember a little village about 5-6 miles outside Gelnhausen, named Kassel? My wife is from there.

I was in CCA in Butzbach, then transferred to Combat Command HQ on Kirch Goens base outside Giessen. Did 4+ years there. Ended up in communications and spent a LOT of time sitting on mountain tops providing commo relay services for the 3AD.

quote:

Originally posted by Elk Hunter:
I was in the 3rd. Armored Division. If the balloon went up, our initial combat position was the Fulda Gap.

I remember attending a briefing in Germany about what combat would be like if the Soviets attacked. It was the first time I heard the expression that something would be a “target rich environment.”

Even though I wasn’t in the combat arms and it was something I was already intellectually aware of, stated that way made a vivid indelible impression on me. It is, however, another of those things that the vast majority of Americans would be incapable of understanding on any level.

quote:

Try to explain how Berlin was WITHIN East Germany (as in surrounded) and it had a Western/Allied sector, let alone explaining what the process was like to drive from West Germany, thru the GDR, in order to get to Berlin. The vast majority of Americans have no clue or, concept, even those older than myself who lived in that period, have a hard time visualizing that.

As I recall, there were only 2 legal ways for Americans to get to Berlin during those years. Duty train from Frankfurt, or fly. We had 2 "know-it-all" knotheads working in combat command HQ, had top secret crypto clearances. They decided they knew better and drove. They were stripped of their clearances, busted down to PFC. and transferred to some infantry battalion elsewhere in the division.

Working in that HQ at the time, I had some limited dealings with them, and they were true assholes.

quote:

Originally posted by sigfreund:

quote:

Originally posted by Elk Hunter:
I was in the 3rd. Armored Division. If the balloon went up, our initial combat position was the Fulda Gap.

I remember attending a briefing in Germany about what combat would be like if the Soviets attacked. It was the first time I heard the expression that something would be a “target rich environment.”

Even though I wasn’t in the combat arms and it was something I was already intellectually aware of, stated that way made a vivid indelible impression on me. It is, however, another of those things that the vast majority of Americans would be incapable of understanding on any level.

Indeed. Telling someone today about spending 9 years of an 11 year military experience "guarding" the east-west German border would blow their minds.

Always figured we(3dACR troopers on the border) would be in a world of hurt on that border if the balloon went up. Have any of you read Tom Clancy’s “Red Storm Rising”?
To me, the descriptions depicted what could be expected in the Fulda Gap.
Blackhorse4

I was there 77-80 3/32 armor.Remember those cards well. Think I still have one somewhere.

quote:

Originally posted by Elk Hunter:

quote:

Try to explain how Berlin was WITHIN East Germany (as in surrounded) and it had a Western/Allied sector, let alone explaining what the process was like to drive from West Germany, thru the GDR, in order to get to Berlin. The vast majority of Americans have no clue or, concept, even those older than myself who lived in that period, have a hard time visualizing that.

As I recall, there were only 2 legal ways for Americans to get to Berlin during those years. Duty train from Frankfurt, or fly. We had 2 "know-it-all" knotheads working in combat command HQ, had top secret crypto clearances. They decided they knew better and drove. They were stripped of their clearances, busted down to PFC. and transferred to some infantry battalion elsewhere in the division.

Working in that HQ at the time, I had some limited dealings with them, and they were true assholes.

We had a Spec 4 in our Signal Corp outfit with Crypto clearance get drunk at a local bar one night in Seoul and began telling the Girls (Korean) about his work, to impress them, I guess.

Next morning two MP's came to get him and his gear. The last we saw of him.

quote:

Originally posted by Elk Hunter:

As I recall, there were only 2 legal ways for Americans to get to Berlin during those years. Duty train from Frankfurt, or fly. We had 2 "know-it-all" knotheads working in combat command HQ, had top secret crypto clearances. They decided they knew better and drove. They were stripped of their clearances, busted down to PFC. and transferred to some infantry battalion elsewhere in the division.

Working in that HQ at the time, I had some limited dealings with them, and they were true assholes.

I was in the Army security agency (ASA) and worked at Field Station Berlin. Everyone had a Top Secret clearance at the site. When I arrived in Berlin the only way ASA members could travel there was duty train (overnight) or air Pan Am and BEA. Near the end of my tour we could drive out with Flag orders but we had to have another car soldiers car follow us that did not have TS clearance. If we we detained in East Germany the other soldier was to notify the west checkpoint that we were detained.

Remember it? We were told to expect seeing those plates at the PX. Soviet personell working the uniformed liaison mission were authorized access and they used the crap out of it. The first time I saw a Russian major in the class 6 I was 'like WTF!?' There wan't too much classified stuff down south, so not much drama where I was.

quote:

Originally posted by Vanwall:

quote:

Originally posted by Elk Hunter:

As I recall, there were only 2 legal ways for Americans to get to Berlin during those years. Duty train from Frankfurt, or fly. We had 2 "know-it-all" knotheads working in combat command HQ, had top secret crypto clearances. They decided they knew better and drove. They were stripped of their clearances, busted down to PFC. and transferred to some infantry battalion elsewhere in the division.

Working in that HQ at the time, I had some limited dealings with them, and they were true assholes.

I was in the Army security agency (ASA) and worked at Field Station Berlin. Everyone had a Top Secret clearance at the site. When I arrived in Berlin the only way ASA members could travel there was duty train (overnight) or air Pan Am and BEA. Near the end of my tour we could drive out with Flag orders but we had to have another car soldiers car follow us that did not have TS clearance. If we we detained in East Germany the other soldier was to notify the west checkpoint that we were detained.

Wasn't there three autobahn routes that one could drive, from West Germany to West Berlin? Besides having the right identification, you had to have business in the Berlin sector, if you stopped for whatever reason, you had the Stasi and GDR Customs all up in your business...?