Yeah, the resolution of the conflict will probably hurt some feelings... just like it would have years ago and thousands of dead bodies ago. Both sides get to be disappointed. Wrap this shit up and let's all be happy to be alive.

There will be no WWIII here, at least not one coming out of this stupid war, despite the wish of the warhawks. Trump will fix this shit.

quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:

If history can be a guide on Russian behavior take a look at the times Russia invaded Western Europe.

1. When they were attacked by Napoleon, they counter attacked and entered France. They withdrew back to Russia on their own accord and were not militarily forced out.

2. When they were attacked by Adolph Hitler, they counter attacked and entered Germany. They withdrew back to Russia on their own accord and were not militarily forced out.

I truly believe that this war between Russia and Ukraine would not have evolved without NATO expansion, and pressure on Russia.

Remember when the Russians were going to put missiles in Cuba and the world almost blew up?

How does the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact fit into this theory?

^^ Well, it doesn't! Not long after that was signed (approx 1 month later!) WWII started, and I assume when NAZI Germany invaded Russia 18 months later, the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was basically null and void...I'm gonna go out on a limb Russia felt they were 'unburdened by what had been' the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact!

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
^^ Well, it doesn't! Not long after that was signed (approx 1 month later!) WWII started, and I assume when NAZI Germany invaded Russia 18 months later, the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact was basically null and void...I'm gonna go out on a limb Russia felt they were 'unburdened by what had been' the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact!

Ah. So the plan to carve up parts of Europe by the Soviet Union and Germany is moot because Hitler was a backstabber?

Poland will be overjoyed by the news.

If we're going to examine past Russian behavior, let's not be selective in our examples.

quote:

Originally posted by parabellum:


Once Donald Trump is back in the White House, the gravy train rolls to a stop and Zelenskyy will have to accept terms.

I hope PDJT locks up the brakes on that train so hard he puts flat spots on wheels. Both sides in this war are run by corrupt thugs, and neither deserves any help with their idiocy.

Like the man said, "I want the dying to stop."

quote:

Originally posted by justjoe:
"Thank you, Para" for having originated this site, and for keeping it going on such a high level.

Ditto. Moderating is a lot tougher than it looks. Moderating and running a site isn't for the faint of heart. Para does an amazing job.

.

quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:
Fed161

quote:

I do not think that Putin plans to stop. He already has designs on the Baltics. I think that President Trump was right to begin providing military aide to Ukraine. I support his decision. I don't need to lay out the beginnings of World War II in Europe here. I do see similarities. Over and out.

If history can be a guide on Russian behavior take a look at the times Russia invaded Western Europe

SNIP

2. When they were attacked by Adolph Hitler, they counter attacked and entered Germany. They withdrew back to Russia on their own accord and were not militarily forced out.

After their economic collapse in ‘91, and the murder of millions.

Eastern Europe did not join the Warsaw Pact/stay in it, voluntarily.

They were, almost always, occupied by Russian Troops/under Russian Administrations.

Biden-Harris Govt Forgives $4.7 Billion in Ukrainian Loans.

https://thenationalpulse.com/2...-in-ukrainian-loans/

The Biden-Harris government has moved to forgive approximately $4.7 billion in U.S. loans to Ukraine. During a press briefing on Wednesday, Miller indicated that this decision was aligned with legal provisions but noted that Congress retains the authority to reverse it.

This recent development is part of a broader pattern of financial and military support from the U.S. to Ukraine, with the government’s total expenditure nearing $60 billion. In April, Congress passed legislation that included $9.4 billion in loan forgiveness for Ukraine as part of a package allocating $61 billion for military resources and governmental operations.

Senator Rand Paul (R-KY) introduced a motion to block further loan forgiveness.

As President Biden approaches the conclusion of his term, he stands accused of attempting to prolong the conflict at almost any cost. Biden has boosted financial and military aid, positioning the U.S. as the single most critical ally in the war.

President-elect Donald Trump has indicated plans to pursue a peace agreement soon after taking office on January 20. This stands in contrast to recent actions from the departing government, which include approving missile strikes within Russia and the deployment of anti-personnel landmines in Ukraine. These moves have led to heightened tensions and threats of retaliation from Russia.

The Mysterious Ballistic Missile Russia Fired At Ukraine

https://www.forbes.com/sites/d...eaky-treaty-dodgers/



After warning U.S. officials of its intention to launch, Russia lobbed a mysterious new ballistic missile at the city of Dnipro in eastern Ukraine early Thursday morning, damaging buildings and injuring potentially dozens of people.

Initially mistaken for a 3,400-mile intercontinental ballistic missile, minus the nuclear warheads for its six independent reentry vehicles, the mystery weapon turned out to be something else: an intermediate-range ballistic missile, or IRBM.

Its name, according to Russian President Vladimir Putin, is “Oreshnik.” That’s Russian for “hazelnut tree.”

Sabrina Singh, the Deputy Pentagon Press Secretary, described the Oreshnik as a variant of Russia’s RS-26 ballistic missile. The RS-26 is a 40-ton, solid-fueled missile that straddles two treaty categories.

Depending on the angle at which it’s fired, the RS-26 could travel slightly more than 3,400 miles. That would make it an ICBM. But it’s more comfortably an IRBM that ranges fewer than 3,400 miles.

The problem for the RS-26’s designers was that, until 2019, the United States and Russia were both party to the 1987 Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces Treaty, which banned the testing and deployment of missiles traveling between 310 and 3,400 miles.

Capable of carrying a nuclear payload and also capable of striking with minimal warning, IRBMs are uniquely destabilizing—hence the treaty. But Russia secretly continued developing missiles in this category, ultimately prompting the United States to quit the INF regime—over some objections from arms-control advocates—in 2019. Russia soon followed suit.

To avoid openly violating the INF Treaty during pre-2019 testing, the Russians angled the RS-26 to lob it just past the 3,400-mile treaty threshold—even though the missile’s design favored intermediate rather than intercontinental range.

That the new Oreshnik is apparently a version of the RS-26 underscores that the former isn’t necessarily an ICBM—and the latter almost certainly isn’t one. Hans Kristensen, a nuclear weapons expert with the Federation of American Scientists, said the Oreshnik is “kind of funny” owing to its convoluted origins.

No one is actually laughing, of course. Putin clearly ordered his forces to launch the Oreshnik at Dnipro in retaliation for Ukraine’s own deep strikes targeting arms depots and command posts in western Russia. The United States, the United Kingdom and France recently authorized Ukraine to use its best American, British and French munitions in those strikes.

Targeting civilians with a powerful, multiple-warhead ballistic missile represents “a clear and severe escalation in the scale and brutality of this war,” Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky stated.

https://www.zerohedge.com/geop...capable-reaching-any

Terrifying Infographic Shows Reach Of Russia's New Hypersonic Missile: 'London In 20 Minutes'

Soon after warning that Russia's newly deployed 'Oreshnik' nuclear capable hypersonic missile is able to reach any European capital, at a top speed of Mach 10+ —which is significantly faster than a bullet—Russian state media issued the below ominous infographic.

It touts that Eastern European capitals could be hit in a matter of a few minutes, and that Berlin is reachable in only 15. It lists capitals as far away from the Kapustin Yar rocket launch complex like London and Paris as reachable by the Oreshnik in just 20 minutes. This means if proverbial all hell broke loose and WW3 came to Europe, these populations would have very little time to reach shelter.



On Thursday Moscow had shocked the world after six independent war heads of a new intermediate range ballistic missile were launched on the Yuzhmash missile plant in Dnipro Ukraine. Thus Putin has demonstrated that the West has crossed his 'red lines' after its long-range attack authorization granted to Kiev.

many outlets initially reported to be an ICBM, the Kremlin is touting that it launched a cutting-edge hypersonic missile for which there is no defensive intercept capability.

Russia says that Washington has now understood and been able to grasp Putin's warnings and red lines more clearly following the missile strike a Ukrainian defense industry facility in Dnepropetrovsk Thursday morning. The new hypersonic weapon, dubbed 'Oreshnik' is capable of delivering a nuclear warhead.

"We have no doubt that the current administration in Washington has had the opportunity to familiarize itself with this announcement and understand it," Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters. Putin had said the West's escalation, seen this week in authorizing Ukraine's long-range strikes on Russia with US/UK-made weapons, makes Ukraine a "global" conflict.



US defenses helpless against Russian hypersonic weapons

Putin highlighted the strategic advantage of Moscow’s new missile technology, stating that Western defense systems, including those at US bases in Europe, are powerless to intercept them. He framed the deployment of the Oreshnik system as a response to NATO’s increasingly aggressive actions, including Washington’s withdrawal from the Intermediate-Range Nuclear Forces (INF) Treaty in 2019. “Missiles like Oreshnik are our answer to NATO’s plans to deploy medium- and shorter-range missiles in Europe and the Asia-Pacific,” he said.





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