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I believe in the
principle of
Due Process
Picture of JALLEN
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Originally posted by bigdeal:
Well the government is shut down. I guess the most pressing question I have now is, how do we keep it this way?

I bet releasing that memo would go a long way.

Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me.

When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson

"Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown
Posts: 48369 | Location: Texas hill country | Registered: July 04, 2005Report This Post
wishing we
were congress
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another example of how deceptive Glenn Simpson's testimony to House Intel comm was:

Bruce Ohr's wife was hired by Fusion to work on the op research against Donald Trump. That wasn't known when Simpson testified to House Intel

The news Nellie Ohr worked for Fusion broke 13 Dec 2017. (from Fusion financial records)

Bruce Ohr was demoted in DoJ the week before.

Simpson's testimony to House Intel was 14 Nov 2017

I wonder if Simpson's testimony was how DoJ discovered Ohr met w Simpson and Steele ?

adding: a reminder that Simpson is saying the FBI/DoJ didn't talk w him before the election. But Steele had multiple discussions w the FBI starting in early July 2016.

Isn't that odd? Fusion hires Steele in June 2016, Steele immediately goes to the FBI w his initial "research" a few weeks later, but Fusion doesn't meet w FBI.

Simpson says he never met w the FBI. Before or after the election. ???

The FBI took the dossier to Barack Obama and later to Donald Trump, but never talked to Fusion.

Did Steele tell the FBI he was doing op research ?
Posts: 19623 | Registered: July 21, 2002Report This Post
10mm is The
Boom of Doom
Picture of Fenris
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>>> WINNING <<<

The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People again must learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. ~ Cicero 55 BC

The Dhimocrats love America like ticks love a hound.
Posts: 17471 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 08, 2008Report This Post
10mm is The
Boom of Doom
Picture of Fenris
posted Hide Post
Originally posted by bigdeal:
Well the government is shut down. I guess the most pressing question I have now is, how do we keep it this way?

This is DC. A 1/4 inch of snow would do it.

The budget should be balanced, the Treasury should be refilled, public debt should be reduced, the arrogance of officialdom should be tempered and controlled, and the assistance to foreign lands should be curtailed lest Rome become bankrupt. People again must learn to work, instead of living on public assistance. ~ Cicero 55 BC

The Dhimocrats love America like ticks love a hound.
Posts: 17471 | Location: Northern Virginia | Registered: November 08, 2008Report This Post
No, not like
Bill Clinton
Picture of BigSwede
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Shut it down!


Posts: 5366 | Location: GA | Registered: September 23, 2009Report This Post
quarter MOA visionary
Picture of smschulz
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The shutdown was horrifying.
I heard the countdown clock from 24 and then the huge mental explosion.
It was terror like no other.
Then nothing but the was awful.
What are we going to do? Frown
Posts: 22974 | Location: Houston, TX | Registered: June 11, 2006Report This Post
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It would be a sad existence if as a private citizen the government shutdown had any effect on your life.


The butcher with the sharpest knife has the warmest heart.
Posts: 13414 | Location: Bottom of Lake Washington | Registered: March 06, 2007Report This Post
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It would have been FANTASTIC if the memo had been released in President Trump’s first, but but reading it early in his second would be pretty great too! Something tells me it will kickstart draining the swamp.
Posts: 6939 | Location: Lost, but making time. | Registered: February 23, 2011Report This Post
Ethics, antics,
and ballistics
Picture of Dtech
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DACA has no business being part of any budget or CR bill.

I find it very curious that Democrats are so for the DACA fix, yet they are against the wall, actual border security, and everything and anything that would make it more difficult to recruit and pander to a dependent class of illegal immigrants for votes, both existing and future. Border security with any and all means to secure the border, including a wall, shouldn't even be a matter of consideration or partisanship. You either FULLY support border security and do everything possible towards accomplishing it because it is in the best interest of the country, or you have some alterior political motivation which you are putting before the good of the country in which case you don't belong in political office, at least not in America. Fixing DACA means fixing border security. Period. You can not have one without the other. Border security solves so much more than just illegal immigration.

I personally know Republicans AND Democrats alike that are tired of this crap and I predict this is not going to have the effect the Democrats are hoping and praying for in the mid-terms.

On another note, I'm going to be telling the people I know that I will gladly take any additional amounts that materialize in their paychecks in February or bonuses that come their way off their hands, if their guilt of it coming from the Trump administration is too much for them to bear.


"I've got a life to live, people to love, and a God to serve!" - sigmonkey

"Strive not to be a success, but rather to be of value." - Albert Einstein

"A man can never have too much red wine, too many books, or too much ammunition" ― Rudyard Kipling
Posts: 4413 | Location: Central Florida | Registered: April 03, 2006Report This Post
Peace through
superior firepower
Picture of parabellum
posted Hide Post
We'll wrap up this thread in a few minutes. Thanks to everyone who's been with us on on this incredible journey.

Just as on this day one year ago, I can't help but think of Winston Churchill's "end of the beginning" speech that he gave in November of 1942 in the wake of the second battle of El Alamein. When Churchill gave this speech, WWII was in its third year, and I think that it is now even more fitting than it was last year.
Simply substitute "Americans" for "British", and "Leftists" for "Germans":

"The fight between the British and the Germans was intense and fierce in the extreme. It was a deadly grapple. The Germans have been outmatched and outfought with the very kind of weapons with which they had beaten down so many small peoples, and also large unprepared peoples. They have been beaten by the very technical apparatus on which they counted to gain them the domination of the world. Especially is this true of the air and of the tanks and of the artillery, which has come back into its own on the battlefield. The Germans have received back again that measure of fire and steel which they have so often meted out to others. Now this is not the end. It is not even the beginning of the end. But it is, perhaps, the end of the beginning."

May God bless the United States
Posts: 107838 | Registered: January 20, 2000Report This Post
Moving cash
for money
posted Hide Post

"When in danger or in doubt, run in circles scream and shout" R.I.P. R.A.H.
Ooga Chakka Hooga Hooga Ooga Chakka Hooga Hooga
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Posts: 9912 | Location: Jawjah | Registered: December 30, 2005Report This Post
Only the strong survive
Picture of 41
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Originally posted by jehzsa:
IIRC, the last time amnesty was granted, an I-245 (Adjustment of Status) cost $1,500.00. That was way back in the 90s.

Problem with DACA is chain migration. You provide a path to citizenship, the relatives also benefit when they get there.

But if we stick with an I-245 for DACA only, I'm sure they will come up with, at least, a $10,000.00 filing fee. And a long waiting period.

Say, 800,000 X 10,000 = $8,000,000,000. And don't hire extra hands for processing.

NUMBER USA has been beating the drums for years against Chain Migration:

End Chain Migration

Chain Migration refers to the endless chains of foreign nationals who are allowed to immigrate to the United States because citizens and lawful permanent residents are allowed to sponsor their non-nuclear family members.

It is the primary mechanism that has caused legal immigration in the U.S. to quadruple from about 250,000 per year in the 1950s and 1960s to more than 1 million annually since 1990. As such, it is one of the chief culprits in America's current record-breaking population boom and all the attendant sprawl, congestion, and school overcrowding that damage Americans’ quality of life.


Chain Migration starts with a foreign citizen chosen by our government to be admitted on the basis of what he/she is supposed to offer in our national interest. The Original Immigrant is allowed to bring in his/her nuclear family consisting of a spouse and minor children. After that, the chain begins. Once the Original Immigrant and his/her spouse becomes a U.S. citizen, they can petition for their parents, adult sons/daughters and their spouses and children, and their adult siblings.

The Family-Chain categories are divided into four separate preferences:
1st Preference: Unmarried sons/daughters of U.S. citizens and their children (capped at 23,400/year)
2nd Preference: Spouses, children, and unmarried sons/daughters of green card holders (capped at 114,000/year)
3rd Preference: Married sons/daughters of U.S. citizens and their spouses and children (capped at 23,400/year)
4th Preference: Brothers/sisters of U.S. citizens (at least 21 years of age) and their spouses and children (capped at (65,000/year)


Due to Chain Migration, distant relatives of original immigrants may come to see immigration as a right or entitlement. When they realize that they may, in fact, have to wait years for a visa to become available because of annual caps and per-country limits on several of the family-based immigration categories, many decide to come illegally while they wait for their turn.

According to recent Visa Bulletins prepared by the U.S. Department of State, green cards are currently being issued to Philippino-born adult brothers and sisters of U.S. citizens (the fourth preference under the family-sponsored categories) who first filed their green card applications in the early-1990s.

While these adult family members are guaranteed green cards under current law, the wait time is so long, these family members instead choose to come to the United States and remain here illegally until their green card becomes available. In fact, the long wait times created by Chain Migration was one factor leading to Congress' decision to increase the annual caps on legal immigration in 1990.


Immigration Act of 1924 -- Congress exempted spouses and unmarried adult children between 18-21 from per-country quotas

Immigration and Nationality Act of 1952 -- Congress created chain categories for parents, adult children, and adult siblings in a limited number of countries. Highly-educated or skilled immigrants, however, received priority.

Immigration Act of 1965 (Hart-Celler Act) -- Congress extended the chains to every country of the world and reversed the priority so that the chain categories had preference over skill categories.

Immigration Act of 1990 -- Congress raised the caps on chain categories.

The 1952 Immigration and Nationality Act established a four-category selection system for countries in the Eastern Hemisphere (Northern and Western Europe were heavily favored). As in the past, the Western Hemisphere was not subject to numerical limitations. The first preference, accounting for 50 percent of all green cards issues, went to skilled immigrants. The next three categories were divided among specified relatives of U.S. citizens and permanent resident aliens.

30 percent were made available to parents of U.S. citizens aged 21 or older.
20 percent were made available to the spouses and children of lawful permanent residents.
Unused visas (capped at 25 percent per country) were made available to adult siblings and adult children of U.S. citizens.

From "A Brief History of U.S. Immigration Policy" by Joyce Vialet, Congressional Research Service, December 22, 1980:

Although U.S. immigration policy incorporated family relationships as a basis for admitting immigrants as early as the 1920s, the promotion of family reunification found in current law originated with the passage of the 1952 Immigration and Nationality Act (INA, P.L. 82-414). While the 1952 act largely retained the national origins quota system established in the Immigration Act of 1924, it also established a hierarchy of family-based preferences that continues to govern contemporary U.S. immigration policy today, including prioritizing spouses and minor children over other relatives and relatives of U.S. citizens over those of lawful permanent residents (LPRs).

Immigration numbers soared during the second half of the 1950s and early-1960s, with more than half of all immigration coming from the Western Hemisphere which was not subject to numerical limitations. According to the Congressional Research Service:

The gradual recognition that the national origins quota system was not functioning effectively as a means of regulating immigration was an important factor leading to the major policy revision which came in 1965.

The 1965 Immigration and Nationality Act made two significant changes that, in combination with the chain categories, doubled immigration over the next 25 years.

Revised the means by which immigration was regulated by replacing the national origin quotas with annual limits:

170,000 annual limit for the Eastern Hemisphere
20,000 per country
120,000 annual limit for the Western Hemisphere
20,000 per country (added in 1976)

Reversed the priority system for the Eastern Hemisphere so the chain categories gained preference over education and skills.

Amendments in 1976 applied the preference system to the Western Hemisphere as well.

In 1976, Congress amended the 1965 bill by reversing the priority system -- family-sponsored then employment-based -- for both the Eastern and Western Hemispheres. Then, In 1978, Congress ended the per-county limits and replaced them with a single worldwide cap of 290,000. Through passage of the Refugee Act of 1980, Congress reduced the worldwide cap to 270,000, but removed Refugees as a preference.

The 1990 Immigration Act raised the annual caps on these chain categories in bold (P.L. 101-649, Section 111):

unlimited for parents of adult U.S. citizens
23,400 for unmarried adult children of citizens
114,200 for spouses and minor children of legal permanent residents; and unmarried adult children of LPRs (with 77% reserved for spouses and minor children)
23,400 for married children of citizens
65,000 for adult siblings of citizens age 21 and over


The Immigration Act of 1990 called for a bi-partisan commission to "review and evaluate the impact of this Act and the amendments made by this Act" and to issue findings and recommendations on (among other things) the "impact of immigration...on labor needs, employment, and other economic and domestic conditions in the United States."

The commission, chaired by Barbara Jordan, recommended the elimination of the chain migration categories.

"Unless there is a compelling national interest to do otherwise, immigrants should be chosen on the basis of the skills they contribute to the U.S. economy. The Commission believes that admission of nuclear family members and refugees provide such a compelling national interest, even if they are low-skilled. Reunification of adult children and siblings of adult citizens solely because of their family relationship is not as compelling." – Barbara Jordan, June 28, 1995

Sen. Tom Cotton (R-Ark.) introduced legislation that would end Chain Migration based on the Jordan Commission's recommendations – the Reforming American Immigration for Strong Employment (RAISE) Act (S. 354). The bill would reduce legal immigration by up to 50% by ending future chain migration and the diversity visa lottery.

Posts: 11828 | Location: Herndon, VA | Registered: June 11, 2009Report This Post
Get on the fifty!
Picture of Andyb
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New law: Anytime the government shuts down, ALL members of congress are fired with lifetime benefits revoked. An emergency election is held to fill in the places for the remainder of the term.

And happy next thread to all!

"Pickin' stones and pullin' teats is a hard way to make a living. But, sure as God's got sandals, it beats fightin' dudes with treasure trails."

"We've been tricked, we've been backstabbed, and we've been quite possibly, bamboozled."
Posts: 3609 | Location: OK | Registered: November 07, 2008Report This Post
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