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Originally posted by ZSMICHAEL:
Have you ever thought what it would be like to live there when everything around you is gone. There are many areas of the the Gulf Coast that have one or two houses and nothing but slabs surrounding them. This is twenty years after the storm.

I have a couple neighbors whose trashy houses I would love to see gone, but that's another story....

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Originally posted by YooperSigs:
Before you choose, do an internet photo search for of the 1974 Xenia OH. tornado. You will see an entire subdivision scrubbed off down to the slabs. The rest of the city was devastated as well. I was in the outskirts of that and saw wind driven golf ball sized hail go across a school parking lot that sounded like anti aircraft fire and left not a single piece of vehicle glass intact.
If I was to own a home again in tornado country, I would do a "family safe" type shelter.

I arrived in Dayton shortly after that happened. I visited Xenia many times after the tornado-the reference of time with the locals was "before" or "after" the tornado. There were many empty slabs in that town for many years after. Hurricane Michael did similar damage to Mexico Beach Fl in 2018, as did Hurricane Andrew to Homestead FL in 1991.

Just build a root cellar. Dual purpose.

Thanks for all the responses. Guess getting one makes good sense if just for insurance/peace of mind.

Not looking at underground for a number of reasons including flooding concerns so it’s a matter of deciding between welded or bolt together design above ground models, with some manufacturers offering both types. The bolt together ones main advantages seem to be being easier install in interior locations like closets and having the ability to unbolt your way out if door is somehow blocked. Welded strikes me as stronger but I doubt know enough to be sure. Most, regardless of type, seem to be 3/16” in household size units, although at least one outfit uses 10 gauge steel, which seems light. Mostly I’m hoping someone has already gone through the process and knows anything to help choosing a manufacturers , or vendor in the case of ones not sold direct.

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Originally posted by ChuckFinley:
Keep self-extraction tools in it (pry bars etc) to get yourself out afterwards. This isn't Hollywood where there is guaranteed to be a nice, camera ready, open space in front of your door.

That's a great point. I think I'd rather have a bolt-together with the fasteners removable from the inside if it's as strong as the welded boxes.

The bolt together shelters are great for retrofitting an existing space where you can't get a one piece unit into.

The thought of unbolting them for egress is a bad idea. The doors on these open inward, and some have both a door and a secondary hatch. You register your location with emergency management so they know you have a shelter to look for. After an event your area will be swarming with search and rescue, so even if you are stuck inside you shouldn't be for long.

The last thing you want to do is start unbolting your shelter from within because the door is blocked and then get crushed by the Cadillac that you can't see sitting on top of the shelter.

I do not live in tornado country. Although we can get a freakish type event. But I would think a lot of damage to structures is from flying things like pick up trucks and mobile homes, etc. Something of significant size and weight flying around and slamming into a house could wipe a lot of thing out. I want to be under ground. But being above ground in a secured box is better than other options for sure.

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Originally posted by old rugged cross:
I do not live in tornado country. Although we can get a freakish type event. But I would think a lot of damage to structures is from flying things like pick up trucks and mobile homes, etc. Something of significant size and weight flying around and slamming into a house could wipe a lot of thing out. I want to be under ground. But being above ground in a secured box is better than other options for sure.

Bingo! People usually think about the high speed wind but don’t consider the debris flying around. I live a few miles south of Moore OK. Pictures of tornado devastation are one thing. Actually seeing it in person is surreal. That’s why I really don’t consider anything above ground a particularly good shelter. Ask yourself how your bolt together shelter might fare if a Kenworth dropped on top of it from about 1,500 ft.

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Ask yourself how your bolt together shelter might fare if a Kenworth dropped on top of it from about 1,500 ft.

Typically just as good as a below grade shelter, and much better than a regular basement covered with a wood floor.

You have to understand that there are simply some parts of this country where a below grade shelter is not possible. If an option, below grade is better than above. But if above grade is your only option, these steel shelters are life savers.

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Typically just as good as a below grade shelter,

I don't know... When meteorologists on three networks all tell people they need to be under ground and refer to the incoming F5 tornado as a "Ground Scraper", I tend to believe them.

Down in South Louisiana , if you want to go underground you must first build a mound . Seriously .

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I don't know... When meteorologists on three networks all tell people they need to be under ground

The question I was answering was how the shelter would fair with a tractor trailer dropped upon it from above. Above ground or below won't matter.

What you're talking about is a wind speed high enough to eradicate homes from their foundations. These shelters are tested for that. This is why you can find several photos of these shelters after total devastation still intact.

The people who use these shelters aren't doing so because above ground is a better choice. They are using them because below ground isn't an option due to rock or water levels. If you have a basement that's the best place for a shelter. If you're on a slab, these shelters are the best option considering the other option is usually nothing at all.

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The question I was answering was how the shelter would fair with a tractor trailer dropped upon it from above. Above ground or below won't matter.

An exposed metal box above ground literally stands 4X the potential of impact from large heavy objects than an under ground shelter. The above ground box has 5 exposed sides. The only potential it offers is lack of flooding, which can occur in in-ground shelters.

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What you're talking about is a wind speed high enough to eradicate homes from their foundations. These shelters are tested for that. This is why you can find several photos of these shelters after total devastation still intact.

And what you are forgetting is tornadic winds can move very large heavy objects that would easily destroy an exposed metal box. Those shelters are rated to withstand tornadic velocity winds, NOT large heavy objects flying at high velocity.

Photos you mentioned of homes ripped off their foundations are due to tornadic winds, not necessarily heavy objects being propelled at high velocities. Two separate and distinct threats. One of the best ways to help protect your home from high wind is to upgrade your garage door. High speed winds can easily rip the average two car garage door apart. When that happens, it creates an air pocket in the garage which then can blow your roof off the wall studs. Once that happens, the walls will likely collapse. Naturally it won’t stand up to a direct hit from a tornado, but it can help save your house in most high wind situations. If you’re building a house, you can opt to use metal brackets to connect your roof joists to your wall studs. Again, it’s not going to tornado proof your house, but it can reduce damage from other high winds.

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An exposed metal box above ground literally stands 4X the potential of impact from large heavy objects than an under ground shelter. The above ground box has 5 exposed sides.

If you drop something from above, it's only going to hit one side: The top. Doesn't matter if your shelter is above ground or below.

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And what you are forgetting is tornadic winds can move very large heavy objects that would easily destroy an exposed metal box.

I'm not forgetting that at all. This is really easy. Where his home is located can not have a below grade shelter. The only option is above grade. Should he have an above ground shelter or no shelter? Which is the better choice?

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If you drop something from above, it's only going to hit one side: The top. Doesn't matter if your shelter is above ground or below.

You seem to miss my point... If you drop a heavy object on a tin box, it will likely compress and crush the occupants inside. A properly built in-ground shelter is less likely to be compressed than an above ground tin box. If the heavy object strikes from any of the four vertical walls, it will smash the tin box like a pop can. (Boxes have 5 sides, including the top.) Therefore the occupants stand a 4X greater peril in an exposed tin box.

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I'm not forgetting that at all. This is really easy. Where his home is located can not have a below grade shelter. The only option is above grade. Should he have an above ground shelter or no shelter? Which is the better choice?

Obviously, a reinforced above ground shelter is better than nothing at all. However it will offer less protection than a proper in-ground shelter. Any above ground shelter is a significant compromise.

Jesus I think we can all agree that a shelter buried underground is the best option IF that is feasible given the ground conditions which in many parts of the country IT IS NOT!

Now having said that the above ground steel shelters (rated by FEMA) firmly bolted to a substantial slab offers more protection than just about anything else available.

End of discussion.

Keep in mind the VAST number of tornados are not F4/F5 raze the earth monsters.

The VAST number are F0-F1.

F2-F3 are by far the most common of the violent Tornados.

The primary cause of injury and death in Tornados come from missiles/debris. It is exceedingly g rare for that missile to be a semi dropped from the heavens and far more likely to be ballistic 2x4s.

Also keep in mind there’s have been above ground shelters that have survived F4/F5s

When my FIL built his house, he put up an above ground shelter because my MIL is extremely handicapped and would never be able to get below ground. So there’s another reason to consider for an above ground shelter besides geological constraints.

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Also keep in mind there’s have been above ground shelters that have survived F4/F5s

Yeah, the wind maybe, sometimes a tornado wipes out your neighbors house and yours remains intact. The place who built my gun vault has a photo of one of their vaults standing upright amidst a house that’s been wiped off the foundation. It can happen. Would I trust my bolted to the slab vault in a tornado? Probably not.

You folks have obviously made up your mind on the subject. Not much chance you’d take my advice, which is OK. There are also a LOT of people here in Oklahoma who live in trailer parks too and I doubt they would listen to anyone suggesting they get a real house instead. To each their own.

Then again, sometimes an in-ground shelter becomes an above ground shelter:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JSbNFRgFljc

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The place who built my gun vault has a photo of one of their vaults standing upright amidst a house that’s been wiped off the foundation. It can happen. Would I trust my bolted to the slab vault in a tornado? Probably not.

I know a thing or two about building vaults, so I would have a good start to forming an opinion on whether I would be safe inside of a certain type of structure during specific types of conditions.

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You folks have obviously made up your mind on the subject. Not much chance you’d take my advice, which is OK.

Can you post a single example of a fatality that occurred as a result of a storm impact on an above ground rated shelter?

I'm willing to change my opinion on how dangerous they are once I see some real examples.

I will save you some time, because I don't believe you'll find any. There's one single example that has been pointed out to me in the past, and after an investigation it was determined that the door on the structure was not rated causing it to fail.