quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
The odds of them presenting the fact that it is a losing case to the potential client is slim.

Sorry you had a bad experience with an attorney.

Having once run my own practice for a number of years, I know that many attorneys prefer to reject cases that are on the losing side. Unhappy clients don't refer new business. Unhappy clients also ruin your reputation, don't pay their bills, and cause way too much trouble with the state bar. So, the notion that an attorney will just lead a client along for billables is possible, but hardly the rule among attorneys.

Yes, I've had family law cases that everyone, including my client, knows is a "losing" case. The goal, at that point, is to minimize cost and guide the client towards a quick resolution. You let the client know this in advance, and client satisfaction is generally OK. Even if you are on the losing side, you can still offer good service to the client by answering questions, guiding them and making court appearances.

Also, family law cases are rarely comprehensively a "win" or "lose" situation. Not unless there's a specific finite question being answered (like paternity). There are dozens of variables that each have to get negotiated or ruled on. For example, a client might lose primary physical custody, but the details of a visitation plan still need to be settled.

quote:

Originally posted by pedropcola:
The odds of them presenting the fact that it is a losing case to the potential client is slim.

I get the impression that your experience with Family Law Attorneys is based on limited, and obviously bad, exposure to them.

I worked in the local Family Law Court for 4 years and saw about 3000 cases come through in that time. Assuming that half those cases were Pro Per, that still leaves 3000 attorneys I was exposed to and was able to observe their behavior.

While there might have been enough to count on the fingers of one hand who fall into the description that you hold, the rest did not.

As Aeteocles has posted, family law is seldom a case of win or lose. There are many variables involved that need to be worked out...and applicable laws/rule involved...that abuse is seldom the case.

Cases where things are dragged out usually involve parties that want to make the other party suffer or parties that can't admit that they weren't responsible (at least partly) for the resulting situation

Nothing against any particular attorney, I have several that in private I will call friends, in public, well, that's a different story.

Learn the process, study the system, know the pitfalls and fees, it's up to you and the other party, nobody else, Attorney or Judge, to get to a final decision.


Remember, attorneys will do whatever you ask, regardless of outcome, it's just going to cost you, every time. Understand the more you attack, the more you do stuff, the worse you make it, the more they make. Some will warn you about the cost, or action. But remember all the time on the phone you're discussing this with them, the meter is running......

There her are some simple suggestions:

Remember Family Law doesn't care about anything but getting you and your soon to be ex to agree on your own.
Do not call them when your ex does something stupid, Do not call them when you ex is late with the kid, do not
call them over anything like this, unless you like writing checks for every email, text, phone call, meeting, rescheduled court dates, etc.

Every bit of family court is about directing you and your nemesis to sit down, act like an adults and come up your own agreement. If you think Judge Judy is going to smack down your ex in front of the audience and award you the golden scepter you are wrong. Remember this, you and your ex will Never, Ever, Ever! get into a courtroom, you will never see the judge.

If you take that approach hoping to get a Judge to force your ex to comply its not happening.

You will be delayed, rescheduled, reprimanded, have your kid assigned a guardian ad litim to represent your kid where you go to be interrogated, and pay for that privilege. In my daughters case, the GAL was great, as the ex-s family was completely hillbilly idiot nuts.... Proved it every meeting LOL.

The only way to win, is to be civil, sit down, get an agreement that benefits the kid(s) and both of you can live with.... not always easy.
Don't expect Judge Judy to smack down your ex for showing up 30 min late with the kid twice a week each time.

Do expect your attorney to bill you for that 9pm call or text at full rate to bitch about them not being on time.

Make notes, write down everything, phone call numbers, dates, time, general topic, physical meetings, etc.

But understand, the final agreement is all on you two, nobody else, all the judge will do is ask if both parties came
to a mutual agreement and make sure it doesn't violate any law.

Go to family court, spend a day watching the goings on, talk to people, research the judge for your area, know what to expect. Find out what attorney is good to hire.

Here’s the thing. My experience is limited. If you consider multiple attorneys and a dozen or more interviews/consults spanning more than a decade and two states and three moves. Awful. Every one. In my experience you guys who say attorneys don’t take losing cases are incorrect. It’s family law. You can argue either side could win and try to sound convincing. Hopefully it drags on for awhile and both attorneys make bank.

Either I’m a legal genius (disclaimer: I most certainly am not) or just a great guesser. I knew every single time we went to court it was a loser. I’m not a lawyer but I can read statutes and cases online. Hand on a Bible, with well over a dozen lawyers spanning more than a decade, not one single lawyer presented our case to my wife as anything other than you have a good chance of winning or better. So I was left to go back home with my wife and try to convince her that we didn’t have a case and the “experts” were wrong. It is a tough spot to be put in. I firmly believe if I had stopped her our marriage might have been over so we went forward. Lost resoundingly each time and over time our marriage survived this.

Oh yea, I was bitter. If the lawyers, any of them, had been forthcoming, truthful, on the actual chances of success I could have gone home and probably taken a different path saving us loads of unnecessary heartache and a shit load of money. Money can be replaced. I can’t ever get the other part back.

My limited experience has yet to put me in the same room with a family law attorney who won’t say whatever the client wants to hear to get that fat retainer check and all that follows.

Am I saying all attorneys are bad? Nope. I have yet to run into a good one in family law though. I’m sure they are out there. I’m sure the Family Law attorneys here would tell me the truth and let us decide whether to proceed with a case. I never met those attorneys though.

Back on topic. Your nephew needs to figure this out now before the marriage because it has potential to be the single biggest issue in their marriage. Be wary of legal advice. Get multiple opinions. It it sounds wrong it very likely is. Once you get married you might be forced into legal actions that you want nothing to do with. Funny thing is I’m not bitter now. I used to be. I’m almost 10 years past my experiences, the kids are adults, the ex is nowhere to be seen, all is well. I am a cautionary tale however, if you can avoid this road, do so.

At least get a meme that is spelled correctly. So an ass and dumb as well.

quote:

Originally posted by MelissaDallas:
I’m a family law paralegal in Dallas. My guess is that if Dad is very involved they likely do have orders in place. Those orders would probably restrict the child’s residence to Dallas and contiguous counties. If Dad is involved and they don’t have orders, expect that he will file with the court for orders, including orders that Mom can’t remove the child. Texas family code is all about what is in the best interest of the child, and the court believes that it is in the child’s best interest to have frequent and continuing contact with both parents. The parties can agree between themselves that Mom can move, possibly involving that Mom pay all increased costs of travel for dad, but the court will likely side with Dad if he is not okay with her moving.

I do practice family law in Texas.

This summary by MelissaDallas is accurate. I would expect that there is a geographic restriction on the residence of the child, but there is no guaranty that is true. I also agree that if dad is involved in the child's life that it might be hard to get an ordered geo restriction lifted, especially for a newish relationship. But that doesn't mean it is impossible. And, there may be room to negotiate some middle ground.

But many (if not most) judges would have trouble allowing a child to be moved away from an involved parent, and that isn't hard to understand, is it?

Your nephew's fiance should talk to a lawyer about her precise fact situation, because these things are extremely fact-dependent. If you want to have her call me, let me know via email.

(And pedropcola, meaning no disrespect, you suck. You shouldn't generalize, and I know dozens of family lawyers who do not act as you describe, and few who do. It is not in a lawyer's own interest to misrepresent the chances of success, especially in family law, because that leads to unhappy clients. Unhappy clients don't pay their bills and file grievances against their lawyers. No case is worth that. I often tell my clients, very accurately, how cases will come out, and then find my clients are surprised when I am right because they are so invested in their own beliefs about how family cases should turn out.

And HRK, I would like to read your post to my clients verbatim. Most people who go through the experience don't learn what you learned, and you are exactly correct. Clients need to know that to maintain some control over what happens, you have to act like an adult and be willing to compromise. Letting the court decide is rarely the best plan.)

I appreciate the compliment. Coming from a lawyer I take that as high praise.

Not one lawyer in 10 years over 2 states. At least 4 were hired and paid for and another 8-10 interviewed. Not one. Ever. Told the truth. It was a dog of a case. They told her what she wanted to hear. They preyed on a mother’s instinct. I should have tried harder to head off the nonsense, that’s on me. Their lies are on them.

Like I said , good ones I’m sure they exist. I just couldn’t find a single one. You guys can say all the same bullshit about references and not paying, blah, blah, blah. It’s not worth it to fib. Oh fucking brother. In my experience the retainer was never insignificant and the bills came monthly after that. If you didn’t pay you wouldn’t have a case or a lawyer. Save the bullshit for people who believe it.