I need to be reminded of this occasionally. The saying that happiness is not about getting what you want but wanting what you have.

Women have largely received what they wanted. But are they at the point where they are wanting what they have? I'm reminded of a comic strip of Sherman's Lagoon where the crab wants to be filthy rich and be happy but the turtle indicates that if he's not happy now, he won't be when he's rich either. The bar for happiness just gets raised.

If women aren't happy as a class, then perhaps they should reflect on why they aren't happy with that they have. Instead of wanting more, what's so bad with what they've got?

Like the turtle said, getting more isn't going to make them happy.

quote:

Originally posted by konata88:


If women aren't happy as a class, then perhaps they should reflect on why they aren't happy with that they have. Instead of wanting more, what's so bad with what they've got?

Why would they? Imagine if you were a young, attractive woman today. You have Instagram, TikTok, Snapchat, Tinder, Bumble, Hinge, Seeking Arrangements, etc. You post a picture of yourself on social media wearing a tee shirt and jeans and you get 50 likes. Cool. Then you go on vacation somewhere tropical and post a picture of yourself in a bikini. That picture gets 200 likes, you added a whole bunch of followers and got a couple DMs (direct messages) in your inbox. Then you put on a thong bikini and put dat ass on display. Now you're getting 500+ likes, your following is growing WAY faster than it did when you took wholesome photos about your family, your dog, etc. and now you're getting hundreds of DMs (NOT an exaggeration), and even some offers from wealthy men for expensive dinners, VIP in the club, trips on the yacht, first class plane tickets to vaca all over the world, etc. Why would you be unhappy? For the next 10 years of your life you're on easy mode. Doors open for you. Men desire you and other women wish they had your lifestyle that you make quite clear on all your social media platforms. As your following grows so does the amount of attention you get from men. What incentive do you have to "reflect" when you got that degree, you're slaying it at your career and men are competing with each other for your attention?


Most men have no idea about the female dating experience. A regular guy goes on a dating app and he's lucky if he gets 1 match a week. It'll probably take him 5-10 matches before he gets a date. An average woman can go on a dating app and have 20+ matches her first day. 90+ percent of those matches will go on a date with her. Her "problem" is trying to figure out which guy she wants to date. Ever since she hit puberty her "skillset" is trying to figure out which guys will give her the most benefit and there's no shortage of them. It's like the joke about women shopping for men where their criteria is satisfied more and more with every floor they go up until they reach the top floor and then they get nothing. In real life women shop between floors until the fire alarm is pulled and the building burns down. Then they'll never get to shop there again. That's why they're unhappy. That's why they're depressed. They had plenty of time to pick out someone nice and leave but instead they kept browsing until the place burned down and now they get nothing. AFTER it burns down is when they start to reflect. THEN they realize what a great deal some of those guys were but it's too late. The store is ashes and they see other girls living happily with the men they passed up. They see their friends with families and children and they're alone. Their fertility is gone, their beauty fades as they age and men stop giving them attention. Do they learn from their mistakes and advise younger women to not follow in their footsteps? HELL NO! They double down on the whole "boss bitch" persona and give younger women TERRIBLE advice about how it's better to be single and free than it is to submit to a man and rely on him even though that's the only way a woman can KEEP a man.


Yeah I said it and I'll say it again: the only way a woman can keep a man is if she submits to him. In a healthy relationship the man leads and the woman follows. That's why every major religion preaches the hierarchy of power in a family (God's word, man's word, woman's word). When the woman takes control of the relationship, bad things happen. When the man allows the woman to have equal say in the relationship, bad things happen. There's one President, not two. There's one CEO, not two. Sharing power and leadership in a relationship is a recipe for disaster and here’s why: When a man fucks up he can own it and recover from it. When a woman fucks up she’ll blame the man even though she’s the cause. If he submits and accepts the blame for something she did she won’t respect him. If he calls her out and holds her accountable she’ll resent him. It’s a lose lose proposition for the man when he's submissive and she's dominating. It’s better for a man to make the decisions, give credit when they’re good, take responsibility when they’re bad and ultimately lead his family to where they need to go.

I just met a guy, upper 50’s or so, divorced 2 years ago. I’m not sure the details of the divorce, who wanted out. He still lives alone, so no squeeze lined up to run to.

Anyway, his ex wife wants back in. She says she still has the $$ from the settlement. Besides the $$ she tries with the naked pictures, not working so far.

Often other countries, with more traditional gender roles, have much higher happiness levels than here in the USA. They often have tighter family connections to go along with it all.

Wtf? I can’t believe how broad the brush is here, guys.
Just wow.
Maybe they’re unhappy because their husband’s a cheating whore, never helps with chores, never helps with the kids, is constantly at the bar drinking….
And if the gal stays home maybe the guy’s so tight with the pursestrings that they cannot purchase anything they need without his approval while he goes wild on purchases for himself. We won’t even get into the mental, verbal, physical abuse from partners.
Maybe she’s unhappy because she’s getting shit pay for a shit job because she couldn’t go to school for higher education/trade and get a better job?

I will say (completely out of topic) the most serene people that I have found are people that are well to do - both men and women.


Hildur, (you sound like another member who was commenting constantly on how women being submissive was the only way to a happy life) this is mostly directed to you:

Are you a woman?
Two of my closest friends are not married, are content with their lives, and have professional careers. They do not want children, they are fulfilled by their work and they feel that they have a purpose. I have another friend who is happily married and childless. Again, her choice. She did not need to be fulfilled by having a child. I know another woman who works as a doctor while her husband stays home and happily raises the children.

I’ve been on this board almost 20 years and I can’t count the number of times I’ve seen a guy hop online here about getting a divorce because they’re unhappy. I even have a good idea of what times of year it will happen.
And guess what? It’s not all because she’s a cheating whore or greedy or whatever else you’re spouting. People in general can get unhappy for a variety of reasons. Women are not alone in this.


I have a hard time believing that any of you fathers with little girls think that “education, career, travel, etc” is “a waste of time”, and they should set their sights on getting their MRS. What happens when he dumps her for a newer model? What happens when he has an untimely death? How does a woman whose “window has closed” because she’s wasted it on the wrong guy go about her life then?

Fathers, look your little girl in the eye and say that it’s a waste, and watch the light go out of her eyes, especially when you send her brother to do all those things because apparently he’s “worthy”, and it’s “wasted” on her. Jesus. Misogyny much?

I can think of a number of times in the past when you guys would see a picture of a woman on the board and criticize and critique or sexualize her. Para actually stopped allowing comments on looks (not the only reason, but..). Do you not recognize that you’re perpetuating the unhappiness situation if that is indeed the reason we are so unhappy? And keep in mind, every girl is not born beautiful, so they can’t flash “dat ass”, or… maybe we just don’t want to.

Absolutely I can understand why there would be gratification in getting more and more likes from showing more and more flesh.. but who are those likes and invitations coming from? In the great majority, men. So if I use deductive reasoning based on this, should I say that men are causing women’s unhappiness by creating a situation where we just can’t win? Or that we have to learn the “game“ and move faster in our timeline to get happy because our “window” closes first since the only thing we have to offer are looks? How sad.

Perhaps the pendulum has swung too far, but it swung for a reason in the first place.

As I’ve mentioned before in other threads, there are a few female members on the board, and for the most part I think they ignore these threads just as much as I do, simply because it’s pointless and not why I’m here, but I cringe at the thought of a potential member coming to look at this board and walking away because of the direction this thread took, without recognizing the vast majority of the members are being silent on this topic because they quietly disagree.

For the last few decades, women have been told they’re as good as any man which subliminally affects their behavior. This seems to make a significant portion think they should act like men. They’ve been conditioned to be as promiscuous as the guys and I believe this screws up their biological clocks and emotional base. I’ve seen a few very young women at work that act like “one of the guys” when it comes to sexual activity. They throw themselves into too many beds and parade it around like a guy would. Guess who are unhappy with actual relationships when they try to base them on more than the sex they started out with?

As an aside, how many guys want a serious relationship with a chick that fucks a lot of different partners? When guys get the idea to settle down, it often isn’t with the girls that “get around”, unless they are drop dead gorgeous. From what I’ve seen, this makes women a little more anxious, less picky, or more likely to end up in yet another fuck-buddy relationship with a less than serious guy that has no interest in a serious long term personal relationship. It’s a vicious cycle that repeats until their options are pretty much reduced to the lowest common denominator, relationship-wise.

Irreverent, you can play the “exception to the rule” game all you want. The data is the data. Facts are facts. I don’t care if you know 3 women who chose not to have a family and are happy with their lives. The FACTS show that women are using antidepressants at a level never seen before, marriage rates are going down, birthrates are going down and STD/casual sex has skyrocketed. If you want to play that game, for those 3 women you mentioned I could name dozens of mothers and grandmothers that I know personally who would unequivocally say that raising a family was the best thing that ever happened to them. Women argue possibilities. Men rely on probabilities. Are you a woman? Honest question because you sound like one with those types of arguments.


Did you not read the statistics about divorce? 80% of women initiate. It increases to 90% initiation for college educated women. Men typically don't divorce women yet women are divorcing men by a LARGE margin. Same thing in premarital relationships. Men rarely break up with their girlfriends but their girlfriends break up with them because they think they can always do better. Once again, with each generation there’s a higher number of 30+ year old women with careers, no husband, no children and they’re miserable because they held out too long. This isn’t my opinion, it’s a fact. Do your own research and try and prove me wrong. I won’t hold my breath.


No, I’m not a father but if I was I would advise my daughter to skip college, focus on getting a good man and have a family. College is a waste of money and these days is more liberal indoctrination than education. As for her career why would I want her to submit to some asshole boss at a stressful job to repay 100k+ of student loan debt when she could marry a good man, submit to him instead of her boss, be a good wife, a good mother and raise her children according to THEIR values instead of leaving it to a bunch of strangers who will indoctrinate them starting as early as day care? More importantly the MAJORITY of women would choose to be a stay at home Mom if given the choice. Again, this isn’t my opinion it’s a FACT. Careers are stressful. Companies take a lot more vs. what they give when compared to prior generations. Making money and being independent GETS OLD, especially when it’s a woman because she’s not biologically wired to accumulate excess resources because the majority of women don’t HAVE to provide for a mate whereas men NEED to. Men don't care about women's education or career because we need to make our own money and enough of it to attract women. Women don't need money to attract men. A man could walk into a store and if the woman working the cash register was attractive enough and her values aligned with his he'd marry her. When's the last time you ever heard of a successful woman marrying a man who worked at McDonalds or some minimum wage job?


Going back to my future daughter: A good man who will provide for her and treat her right so she can raise a family is exponentially more important than a degree and a career and here’s the point to remember: her prime is 18-25. A successful 25 to 40 year old man who makes a high income, has assets, has his shit together isn’t going to want some ran through career woman with student loan debt. He is going to want someone who is CHASTE (or damn close to it), respectful, loyal, cooperative, agreeable, supportive and coachable so he can lead her and show her how to help him in ways that her education and career never would (both would actually do the opposite). In her prime she’ll also be FERTILE which means their children are more likely to be strong and healthy. Health and especially mental issues increase substantially in newborn children when a woman is in her 30s. That said, you really think a successful man who busted his ass for years, taking calculated risks that paid off to make a lot of money, invest, build his assets and his status in society did all that so he could come home to a ~30+ year old career woman who lost half her eggs and is going to argue and fight with him because she is educated, she makes her own money and therefore in her mind “she’s his equal?” That if she calls a divorce lawyer he'll lose everything that's important to him along with over half his income and assets? No thank you. He'll take the younger, more attractive woman who is going to SUBMIT and get with his program instead of arguing and fighting with "an equal" who moved into the castle he built.


It’s clear that you have no idea what the current relationship dynamics are like because you’re old and think modern women have some kind of resemblance to women of prior generations. You missed my comment about Hoeflation so go back and read it again. It’s real and if you’re over 50 and had a good marriage I guarantee that if you were a young man today and tried to do it all over again using what worked for you back then you’d either die alone or divorced with the way modern women are. Think I’m kidding? Make a fake profile on a dating app, run your game then post your results.


By the way I could 100% look my future daughter in the eye and tell her that her brother NEEDS to have an education (not necessarily college) and a career. Did you not read anything I wrote? Men MUST provide value. Men MUST create excess resources. My son could not sit around looking pretty hoping for a rich, attractive woman to come and save him. IT WILL NEVER HAPPEN. Therefore he MUST build up his knowledge and skills to make money. He MUST learn how to network and build up his social status so he can move up in the world. Without that he will never be able to provide for the kind of woman I would raise my daughter to be. Whatever "light" she would lose in her eyes will reignite 100x brighter when she's in a secure relationship with a healthy family to carry on their legacy. Contrast that with the eyes of a career woman who's single, knows she's past her prime and ends up alone without a family. Could you look your daughter in the eye when you're on your deathbed, knowing that she's going to die alone and without children by her side because YOU convinced her college and a career was more important?


Once again, it doesn’t matter about what happened on this board about how critical our membership was of a woman’s physical appearance (not all men are Sigforum men with higher standards). An overweight fat chick on social media could fuck more people this year than an average man would in his lifetime and thanks to modern day feminism, they do. If you understood anything about the male sex drive you’d understand there’s a lot of dogs out there who would fuck anything with a pulse and 3 openings.


I see now that you are a woman. To answer your question: NO. Men are not causing women’s unhappiness (thanks for reinforcing my point about women blaming their problems on men). There’s a reason why every major religion protects female virginity/sexuality and that’s because men value women’s chastity. A successful man who worked hard his whole life didn’t do it so he could give a whore his last name. That’s why porn stars and the next generation of them, onlyfans “models,” are not getting wifed up by successful men. Why would they? Could you imagine a man climbing the social ladder and taking his onlyfans wife to a business function and anyone there could see her butthole for $5.99? Can you imagine the harassment his children would get at school when other kids are sharing videos of his wife sucking cock while shoving a cucumber up her anus? It’s happening right now. Last year a young man killed himself because the kids at school knew his mother was an onlyfans model and he had to take the shame for something he had no control over. So no, it’s not men who created this. Most men would prefer women who weren’t acting like (or are) whores and were selective about who they slept with. Most men would hope women pick their partner based on the quality of the man, not just what he can offer financially. However, it’s women who want it all. It’s women who feel entitled to have a lifestyle most men are not able to provide. At the end of the day, it’s women who make the choice to live their life the best way they see fit and therefore they can reap what they sow. Women control sex, men control relationships. The fact that women are giving away so much sex is why so many men aren’t committing to relationships. If women stopped giving away sex, you’d see a lot more commitment from men.


The pendulum has swung too far and I disagree that it needed to be swung in the first place. If you want to debate it in full, I’m game. I’ll just say that a lot of problems in our country today are because democrat politicians know how to solicit women’s emotions to get their votes. The majority of women vote democrat/liberal and that’s because women don’t carry the same responsibilities as men. I’ll leave it at that.


Lastly, you couldn’t be more incorrect about the “silent majority.” The real silent majority are men who aren’t allowed to be men anymore. The modern system is designed to empower women and suppress men. If a man calls a woman out on her bullshit, he’s a misogynist or take your pick from a list of terms modern day feminism and radical leftists have come up with. As a woman, you have no idea how men disqualify women. We do it silently because it’s not worth wasting our time and effort to argue something she is unlikely to accept and then there's the potential to get cancelled on top of it.


You’re entitled to your opinion that this discussion will scare potential members away and I think that’s incredibly conceited and self centered on your part. I’ve been preaching these values way before “red pill” and “MGTOW” was a thing. I’ve discussed this with hundreds, probably close to a thousand men and every single man agreed with me. If anything a man who comes across this thread (or this forum!) would be more likely to join because there are very few places where men can be men. Frankly women need to know this too because they’ve been lied to and society won’t tell them the truth. Then again, women prefer comfortable lies over uncomfortable truths so I'd expect things to get worse before it gets better.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Hildur,

Just wow.
I would love to see the citations of these facts and see who funded those studies, on second thought, never mind. I think we all know how well statistics can be skewed and variables ignored.
Do we agree on the fact that women are better at communication and therefore, perhaps more willing to seek help when they need it? That alone could skew numbers.

I’m not interested in getting into a pissing match with you. It’s not why I’m on this board, so we can simply agree to disagree. In my mind, you’re living back in caveman times, and most of the world has moved on.

Hmm, I guess by your standards I’d be old, because you sound like you’re about 25-30 years old with very little real life/woman experience. I pray you don’t have a little girl to foist this bullshit onto, but as luck typically has it, the men I’ve known to be the worst typically have little girls to humble them.

Best of luck.

Apologies, OP, for drifting this far. I’ll step out of it and move on.

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:

I have a hard time believing that any of you fathers with little girls think that “education, career, travel, etc” is “a waste of time”, and they should set their sights on getting their MRS. What happens when he dumps her for a newer model? What happens when he has an untimely death? How does a woman whose “window has closed” because she’s wasted it on the wrong guy go about her life then?

Fathers, look your little girl in the eye and say that it’s a waste, and watch the light go out of her eyes, especially when you send her brother to do all those things because apparently he’s “worthy”, and it’s “wasted” on her. Jesus. Misogyny much?

I don't think anyone is saying what you've perceived. I'll assert that when a woman pursues those things you've listed to the exclusion of her natural call of the wild as it were, she'll eventually feel unfulfilled, IME.

There are things in life that are of prioritized value. Let's say it this way. There is no success that can compensate for failure in the home. On the last day above ground, neither the travel, education, career, possessions nor social media praise will be there to lower you into the grave and weep for your loss.

Of course women should educated themselves and experience as much in life as possible.....while raising her children and creating a home.

Whether any of us is happy at any point is completely up to us to choose. We're all just trying to get through this life as best we can. You can say scriptures are the guides, maybe they are, but I've always found them lacking. Everyone is alone down here, and we all have to figure it out as we go.

Ask me what I have come to value in a partner and the biggest attractions for me are if she's smart, good with money, and experienced sexually. Usually one out of three will do...for a while, but it gets tiresome. Not unbearable, obviously, but tiresome.

To get three out of three, I have to really have my shit together to attract and keep that caliber of woman. That's on me and, to some extent, my luck, not her.

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
Just wow.
I would love to see the citations of these facts and see who funded those studies, on second thought, never mind. I think we all know how well statistics can be skewed and variables ignored.
Do we agree on the fact that women are better at communication and therefore, perhaps more willing to seek help when they need it? That alone could skew numbers.

I’m not interested in getting into a pissing match with you. It’s not why I’m on this board, so we can simply agree to disagree. In my mind, you’re living back in caveman times, and most of the world has moved on.

Hmm, I guess by your standards I’d be old, because you sound like you’re about 25-30 years old with very little real life/woman experience. I pray you don’t have a little girl to foist this bullshit onto, but as luck typically has it, the men I’ve known to be the worst typically have little girls to humble them.

Best of luck.

Apologies, OP, for drifting this far. I’ll step out of it and move on.

Ok bye. Thanks for playing. You literally had nothing of substance to say. The only thing you responded to was the fact that I called you old and then you tried to insult me without knowing anything about me. It's obvious you don't have the slightest experience with modern dating because if you did you'd empathize with men but then again you're a woman. The world revolves around you. When you're not blaming men for your problems, you pretend like ours don't exist. If all you can bring to this discussion is your feelings then I'd leave too.

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
In my mind, you’re living back in caveman times, and most of the world has moved on.

What has it "moved on" to? What we have now? That's a good thing?

Irreverent, I for one greatly appreciate your membership and input here. Same with the other women who are members here.
I agreed with some of the content in Hildur's original post.
Not so much in subsequent posts. I agree about making broad brush type statements. If you read any of my post's I tend to agree we have a pretty active "women are the devil" contingent here.

I think your response's in this thread are well thought out and I agree. I feel some posts responding to your posts are somewhat out of line.

Thanks for entering into a lions den of a thread with your perspective. It was definitely needed imho.

quote:

Originally posted by Gustofer:

quote:

Originally posted by irreverent:
In my mind, you’re living back in caveman times, and most of the world has moved on.

What has it "moved on" to? What we have now? That's a good thing?

She won't answer because her feelings will be exposed by facts. For example, since the beginning of mankind to the present day women have always wanted men who are taller than they are. Who are stronger than they are. Who will gather more resources (money) than they do. Who will protect them from physical harm and provide safety and peace of mind should they hear a bump in the night. It's always been this way because women NEED men like that to give them the best chance of survival.


Come on gurl! It's 2023! Go date a short dude who couldn't beat you in a wrestling match and makes way less than you do. When someone threatens your life, you don't need him to stand up for you. Take that threat on yourself, it's 2023!!!!


See how stupid that sounds? That's women for you. She called me a caveman yet if you actually talk to women and find out what they want, they all want that. Who's living in prehistoric times now?


But God forbid if a man wants a younger woman who's more fertile. "He's a predator! He's insecure! He can't handle an educated woman who makes more than he does!" Bullshit. Men have always been attracted by women's beauty and it doesn't take an educated career boss bitch to know that an attractive woman at 25 won't be as attractive at 35. That with education, career and "her own money" she's going to take on more masculine traits: disagreeable, combative, assertive, dominant. No man wants that. No man wants to come home after fighting the world so he can provide for his family just so he can fight with his wife. A woman is supposed to bring a man peace. How is that supposed to happen when she's got her own problems and stress from her career and laying them on her man is supposed to make him relaxed?


Like I said, modern day feminism fucked the world. Women pushed for it and men let it happen. 60 years ago a man could raise a family of 4+ kids with a high school degree working at a factory. Now most families need two incomes with advanced degrees to raise 1.7 kids because when women entered the workforce companies got double the labor for half the cost. Remember that.


EDIT: Men like oldruggedcross are the reason why modern day feminism is what it is. A woman blasts off a bunch of nonsense and when it's rebutted with fact, she responds with emotion and there's the simp to reassure and feed her ego. I can't make this stuff up.

OK, folks, let's take it easy, please.

Ok Hildur, we get it. Keep preaching it to mom's basement walls. The more you preach it the more we get it. And the more ridiculous it gets

Sorry Para. I was typing this as you posted.

She's not going to fuck you so stop trying to defend her so hard. Don't you respect women and their equality? It's 2023, she can defend herself you chauvinist!

HEY!!

I

SAID

COOL IT!!

Mind your manners. I'm not asking you.

That's very rude and you will refrain from ever again : A- making such crass remarks to and about other members and B- defying my directives.

My apologies, I didn't see your post above.

Even if that is so, your remarks in that last post are way out of line. Don't ever again do that in this forum.