Most Ford dealerships in my area are nothing more than used car lots already. Very few new cars if any. I wouldn’t be surprised if many just tell Ford to stick it.

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Originally posted by jljones:
Most Ford dealerships in my area are nothing more than used car lots already. Very few new cars if any. I wouldn’t be surprised if many just tell Ford to stick it.

The one big Ford dealer near me has so few of ANY car I actually thought they had gone under the other day driving by.

But yes, it's crazy to see all these new dealers proudly displaying 2016, 2017, 2018 cars as if they were brand spanking new and with a ludicrous high price too.

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There will be no elimination of IC vehicles by 2035 because....surprise....it will not be possible due to a total lack of infrastructure to support them. This liberal circle jerk isn't going to result in anything but chaos, taxpayer spending and debt, and rampant stupidity, insuring ICE vehicles will be with us for a long time into the future.

I know my own ICE vehicles will be with us for a long time into the future...
I keep up with my maintenance and have a mechanic friend who does what I don't or can't.

If the government keeps pushing the green socialism crap, the US will be like Cuba where they are still driving cars from the 1950's.

It will vary by region, but the lower maintenance costs will flip lots of fleets to electric.

I don’t see too many Ford dealers east of the Mississippi, resisting.

They do depreciate much more, though.

quote:

Originally posted by jljones:
Most Ford dealerships in my area are nothing more than used car lots already. Very few new cars if any. I wouldn’t be surprised if many just tell Ford to stick it.

Same here. To me there is something larger going on. There’s no way that there are still that many shortages of chips.

The auto industry can pay way more for a chip that is going into a $60k+ Vehicle than most of the other devices needing these chips.

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Originally posted by sdy:
https://techcrunch.com/2022/09...timatum-on-ev-sales/

...The automaker will use about 90% of the dealers’ investments to build out charging infrastructure including DC fast chargers that will allow dealers to be part of the Blue Oval Charge Network Map, according to a Ford spokesperson, who noted that dealers will own and earn revenue from chargers.

I'm sorry, but these idiots are seriously delusional! I've got a friend of mine who works for a major utility and I use to run an energy program myself. The grid in most places is NOT setup to feed the power necessary to these dealerships, truck stops or anyone else who may want it in volume without completely rebuilding the electrical grid from the substation out. You just can't simply flip and switch and have the magical unicorns fart fairy dust and make it so. You are talking hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars in electrical infrastructure across the country. You damn well bet that the Democrats/Biden will try make the U.S. tax payer pay for all of it.

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You are talking hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars in electrical infrastructure across the country. You damn well bet that the Democrats/Biden will try make the U.S. tax payer pay for all of it.

Yep. And that’s just infrastructure.
That doesn’t address the power generation problem. Where’s the dozens of new nuclear power plants? Or are we OK with coal again?
Natural gas?
Wind and solar are only capable of a tiny portion of what is needed.

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Originally posted by PASig:


There's not enough lead, lithium and cadmium in the entire Earth to mine to pull this stupid pipe dream off.

can I just invest in lithium ?? The price has to continue to rise, at least for a while.

There is a lithium and battery tech ETF. Symbol is LIT. Could be the best or worst investment of your life.

https://www.globalxetfs.com/fu...wEAAYASAAEgLwf_D_BwE

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Certified dealers will shell out an upfront initial investment of about $500,000 and focus on ownership and charging, with limited, built-to-order sales. Elite dealers will be asked to invest $1.2 million to handle ownership, charging and sales with stock on the ground, demo units and visibility on Ford’s website.

Given the property many of these dealers sit on, and how the finance industry has bow'd to green and public social pressures, these dealers shouldn't have any issues securing loads to make the required improvements Ford is demanding. Auto dealers, like hospitals & airports, are always doing some kind of capitol improvements to their buildings and lots.

As others have pointed out, and we're seeing in California, what improvements and investments are being made to the electrical grid to support this mandated move? Hint....its gonna be ugly for bit.

I would think there would be enough off peak capacity to meet most of the charging loads.

Charging a car is the equivalent of running a dryer or an oven.

If that’s done in the middle of the night, I doubt it would tax the infrastructure that much.

Solar panels do not make power during the night
.

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Originally posted by jcsabolt2:
I'm sorry, but these idiots are seriously delusional! I've got a friend of mine who works for a major utility and I use to run an energy program myself. The grid in most places is NOT setup to feed the power necessary to these dealerships, truck stops or anyone else who may want it in volume without completely rebuilding the electrical grid from the substation out. You just can't simply flip and switch and have the magical unicorns fart fairy dust and make it so. You are talking hundreds of BILLIONS of dollars in electrical infrastructure across the country. You damn well bet that the Democrats/Biden will try make the U.S. tax payer pay for all of it.

Hmmmm, you mean I can't shove 600v three phase through 14 gauge Romex [sarcasm and oversimplification]? Who would have ever guessed. This is all part of the 'details/delusion' the green energy clowns just don't want to talk about.

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Originally posted by architect:
Seriously considering selling my F. Great. consistent dividend over the years/decades, but I can't see it continuing. At around $12/share, seems like not the worst time to do so in general.

I wouldn't sell at 12...it was as high as 25 in January. EV's are coming and the electrical grid will be enhanced and rationed as necessary to make it happen. Not only would I not sell the Ford stock, I would likely try to invest in some of the charging technology. I don't disagree with anyone about how silly the whole thing is, but it's happening in real time.

When will this idiot bubble finally burst?

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Originally posted by 83v45magna:
When will this idiot bubble finally burst?

Forget the government does everyone think that the people who will be selling EV’s in the future haven’t thought of all of the stuff that routinely gets trumpeted as fact.

I just read an article that GM already has contracts signed for all the elements needed for their cars for a very long time and potentially for the entire fleet. Tesla is building massive storage batteries that are going to pull electricity from off peak times and send it to their infrastructure during peak times. There has also been billions of OUR dollars advocated to improving infrastructure.

Whether the current infrastructure can handle the added charging depends on where you live. If you live in an area that is already running near 100% then probably not but most places are more like 70% percent capacity during peak and 50% off peak so off peak production will need to be kicked up closer to peak production.

It’s a little bit funny that people think someone smart enough to make NASA look like a high school science project hasn’t thought of everything that people keep repeating as the downfall to EV’s. I think the real cause of it is because those are the people who tie the Democrats to the EV movement and can’t view it objectively. This movement was well under way way before Biden became president so let’s not give him credit because when the movement is successful we don’t want everyone thinking it was because of the Democrats when it isn’t.

I personally think EV’s are a little ahead of their time but there’s also no doubt in my mind that this is the way the entire industry is going. People can’t just think of the U.S. in the EV scenario it’s a global industry. The one thing I can guarantee is electricity is going to go up drastically in cost and you can’t cut your electricity usage back much since you use it in so many different aspects of your life. This is undoubtedly going to be expensive. Just look at Europe who is way ahead of the U.S. with their green movement and you will see major power problems because of the cost of electricity soaring.

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The one thing I can guarantee is electricity is going to go up drastically in cost and you can’t cut your electricity usage back much since you use it in so many different aspects of your life. This is undoubtedly going to be expensive. Just look at Europe who is way ahead of the U.S. with their green movement and you will see major power problems because of the cost of electricity soaring.

This is what is coming, you won't have a Shell or Exxon bill anymore, that money is going to be transferred to your power bill, same for your oil change money.

The electric companies have excess capacity to sell, and lower power use times will be when they expect to see vehicles charged. Even if it's the amount of power used to run your dryer, all night, every night, it's going to raise your bill, and actually it will be two dryers, since many households have two cars maybe more. That means its Millons of dryers, running all night, every night nationwide.

Electric companies will also raise the rates, night time will no longer be off peak, so you'll see your cost of heating and cooling your home in the evening likely double.

Since it's night, renewables won't work, that means LG or Coal or Nukes. We won't get any new nuke plants, the government is working hard to reduce coal, most of it's going to China anyway, but increased use means increased demand and that causes markets to bump prices up on commodity's that are threatened by government policy aka non renewable sources.

The additional revenues that states will need to make up are gas taxes or road taxes. Around the USA gas taxes are between $150 to $400 per vehicle, CA, PA, IL, NY, WA leading the costs, those fees will need to be collected from motorists.

Remains to be seen if it's use tax on your EV charging ports as a per watt charge, so it's equitable to the amount of driving you do, mileage reports which EV's will automatically report to both your insurance carrier and the DMV, as well as increased registration fees all combined to make up EV road tax use, or Tolls, probably a combination of all three.

Oh and your insurance carriers will know how you really use your car, so those who report there use as "pleasure" the lowest rating tier, when they really drive 25 to 30K or more a year will get a nice insurance rate increase.

Cars will become the new E-appliance where more data is obtained, sold, and used to market and charge consumers.

Good friend in the equity hedge business and I discussed this 10 years ago, his comment was that your mortgage won't be the expensive part of home ownership, the power bill will be.

Quick question for those who think this is inevitable and no big deal, who's going to pay for charging stations for every parking place in an apartment condo complex, install, maintain, monitor. What will you do when someone who is visiting leaves their car in the last open space as you come home from work, not charging, and there's no open spaces for you to charge,

If people are getting upset over shopping carts, think how long until we see "charging space rage".

Yes the renter pays, with increased rent along with marked up E-charging rates, of course.



It's a brave new world!

^^^Well, I guess we'll need to/continue to print more money then...Easy Peasy!

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Originally posted by nhracecraft:
I guess we're gonna need to/continue to print more money then...

We're gonna need a bigger printer...

Actually, it will go e-currency first, they need to know, how far you drive, the speeds you drive, if you came to a complete stop, your insurance carrier wants this, so they'll pay Tesla, GM, FORD for it.

Remember customers HAVE to buy Onstar's tattle tail system now, and pay GM to gather your data for resale.

The push to EV's have little to do with cleaning up the environment...

You know, and I know, that chaos and bedlam are consuming the entire world! UV light waves are only the beginning, we have an inch of Topsoil left, Sexually transmitted diseases, deforestation, irreversibly progressive depletion of the global gene pool. It all adds up to oblivion, pal. Governments will fall, anarchies will reign. It's a brave new world.