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I have noticed that the Russian soldier has been placed in a Fiberglass enclosure during the trial. If I recall correctly the Russians use an enclosure with bars. Other than security are there any other particular reasons for this? To me it almost signals guilt of the defendant.
 
Posts: 17643 | Location: Stuck at home | Registered: January 02, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Picture of Pyker
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Protection - it works both way - of the defendant and of the court staff

Escape prevention

Rescue attempts.
 
Posts: 2763 | Location: Lake Country, Minnesota | Registered: September 06, 2019Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie
Picture of Balzé Halzé
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I agree, it undermines the presumption of innocence. I know also in the UK, New Zealand, and I think even Canada the defendant sits in a dock separated from his counsel. He is also surrounded by fiberglass or even a cage. I'm glad we don't have this practice in the US.


~Alan

Acta Non Verba
NRA Life Member (Patron)
God, Family, Guns, Country

Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan

 
Posts: 31138 | Location: Elv. 7,000 feet, Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Innocent until proven guilty here.

Russia... Yeah, not so much.


______________________________________________________________________
"When its time to shoot, shoot. Dont talk!"

“What the government is good at is collecting taxes, taking away your freedoms and killing people. It’s not good at much else.” —Author Tom Clancy
 
Posts: 8613 | Location: Attempting to keep the noise down around Midway Airport | Registered: February 14, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie
Picture of Balzé Halzé
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quote:
Originally posted by CPD SIG:
Innocent until proven guilty here.

Russia... Yeah, not so much.


Under the Russian constitution, the defendant is also innocent until proven guilty.

But yeah, a Russian courtroom is probably one of the last places I want to be.


~Alan

Acta Non Verba
NRA Life Member (Patron)
God, Family, Guns, Country

Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan

 
Posts: 31138 | Location: Elv. 7,000 feet, Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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A somewhat related story...

At the local county court the jury sits directly in front of but a little lower than the judge, in swivel chairs.

The witness booth sits about ten feet out directly centered in front of, facing, the jury and judge. It is elevated a couple steps high and enclosed about chest high on three sides but open on the front, toward the jury and judge. So the witness is sitting directly in front of and facing the jury and judge. Got that picture?

Several years ago a "lady" witness testified in a trial... In a very short skirt... with nothing underneath Eek

The next day my Contractor dad was called by the county judge to build and install a door to the witness booth. Big Grin

That was probably 40 or so years ago and the door is still there, and still in use.



Collecting dust.
 
Posts: 4203 | Location: Middle Tennessee | Registered: February 07, 2013Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Conveniently located directly
above the center of the Earth
Picture of signewt
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quote:
That was probably 40 or so years ago and the door is still there, and still in use.


....so much for those open & shut cases we've heard about
 
Posts: 9877 | Location: sunny Orygun | Registered: September 27, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Freethinker
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It’s actually “not guilty” until proved guilty, not “innocent.” Innocent as most people understand it means “didn’t do it” or something similar such as an unavoidable accident. Not guilty beyond a reasonable doubt can be due to things like insufficient evidence, jury bias or incompetence (e.g., cannot understand the evidence), judge’s ruling, etc., but not necessarily that the defendant didn’t commit the act that was charged. This is a common misconception and something Vincent Bugliosi pointed out in one of his books or articles (don’t remember now where I read it).

I once observed a trial in which the charge was rape and the defendant had admitted to picking up the woman, driving her to a secluded location, and threatening her with a knife to have sex with him. She did and then immediately reported the incident to the German police who referred the case to Army CID.

The defense was “She would have consented anyway even if he hadn’t threatened her with the knife in a remote location far from any possible help or hope of escape.” The prosecutor was the most incompetent I’d ever seen, something the other CID agent also present agreed with. Despite an earlier JAG ruling that the victim’s morals, character, etc. in such cases must not be attacked in court, that’s exactly what the defense did with no objection by the judge or prosecutor. One of the telling accusations against the woman was that she had a tattoo!! on her arm. (Horrified gasps.)

The outcome was that the “She’s a slut and would have consented anyway” defense was accepted and the defendant was found not guilty (but not “innocent”) of rape by the jury.




6.4/93.6
___________
“We are Americans …. Together we have resisted the trap of appeasement, cynicism, and isolation that gives temptation to tyrants.”
— George H. W. Bush
 
Posts: 47860 | Location: 10,150 Feet Above Sea Level in Colorado | Registered: April 04, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Whether our defendants sit at a table rather than in a dock, nearly all of them (except those who have been out on bail) are leg shackled and handcuffed (and have a CO or Deputy sitting behind them) until a judge directs that their restraints be removed.

Quite few appear in jail jumpsuits as well, so I don't see there's much difference.

More of an issue is the fact that most jurors are fully aware of who the defendant is (because they are neighbors, especially in small towns) and the press (if it's a serious or heinous crime) has been trying them in the court of public opinion for weeks if not months beforehand.

In Europe, or at least the UK, there are restrictions about what may, and may not, be reported on prior to, and during the trail to try and avoid tainting a verdict. A few reporters/journalists/editors have found themselves standing 'Tall before The Man' for contravening the rules.

No Nancy Graces allowed.
 
Posts: 2763 | Location: Lake Country, Minnesota | Registered: September 06, 2019Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Just because you can,
doesn't mean you should
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Also remember, these proceedings are being conducted in a country that is in the middle of a war and the local populace is likely very unhappy with the country and actions the defendant represents.
I suspect this proceeding, and it's timing, is meant as a statement to others in the Russian military and government that if you don't outright win this, we will be coming for you too. Especially if you continue to act as barbarians.


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Posts: 9929 | Location: NE GA | Registered: August 22, 2002Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Tinker Sailor Soldier Pie
Picture of Balzé Halzé
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quote:
Originally posted by sigfreund:
It’s actually “not guilty” until proved guilty, not “innocent.”


It is a presumption of innocence during trial; not a presumption of not guilty.


~Alan

Acta Non Verba
NRA Life Member (Patron)
God, Family, Guns, Country

Men will fight and die to protect women... because women protect everything else. ~Andrew Klavan

 
Posts: 31138 | Location: Elv. 7,000 feet, Utah | Registered: October 29, 2012Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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quote:
Originally posted by cparktd:
A somewhat related story...

At the local county court the jury sits directly in front of but a little lower than the judge, in swivel chairs.

The witness booth sits ...

That was probably 40 or so years ago and the door is still there, and still in use.


Contrary to everyones most basic instinct.


____________________



 
Posts: 16276 | Location: Florida | Registered: June 23, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Step by step walk the thousand mile road
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the Russian soldiers, they earned it. I hope the war criminals are brought before a court, tried, and when found guilty, executed by immediate hanging.





Nice is overrated

"It's every freedom-loving individual's duty to lie to the government."
Airsoftguy, June 29, 2018
 
Posts: 32308 | Location: Loudoun County, Virginia | Registered: May 17, 2006Reply With QuoteReport This Post
half-genius,
half-wit
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The russian soldier charged with killing a civilian in Ukraine has pleaded guilty, and sentenced to a whole life term of imprisonment.

In a Ukrainian jail.

It will be interesting to see how that pans out.....
 
Posts: 11473 | Location: UK, OR, ONT | Registered: July 10, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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^^^^^^^^^^
Good. The Russians are rumbling about putting the captured Ukranians in Maripol on trial. I would not put it past that regime.
 
Posts: 17643 | Location: Stuck at home | Registered: January 02, 2015Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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