Being as we are a very well rounded and eclectic group here on Sigforum, I figured there must be some horse people on here, and perhaps someone can give me some advice on pulling a trailer.

So here are some specifics. My wife is into horses. Yay for me. It’s fun, but a lot of work and expense. Currently we have only one, but are looking to add another one or two, maybe up to 4 total eventually for each family member. Because of this we are looking at 4-horse trailers with living quarters and I am wondering what would be adequate in terms of a truck to pull the trailer, potentially loaded out (though most likely 2-3 horses max for the immediate future).

I guess my biggest question is do I really need something like a Ford 350 diesel dually? Or could I get by with a 250 diesel with “tow package”? I know she wants a gooseneck style hitch, which allows more towing capacity I think right? I have run some numbers and have found that the 250 can tow up to 14-16,000# with the tow package. I know it matters what size trailer and if it’s all steel or aluminum/steel and how much the horses weigh and so on, but we have figured it shouldn’t be more than 12,000# fully loaded with 4 horses (if we even get to that number of horses). Would that be too much stress on the 250? Is the 350 dually too much truck?

Looking for any advice you can give. Personal experience and knowledge of what others in similar situations would help greatly.

Thanks as always for your time and assistance Sigforumites!

You can NEVER have too much truck when you're towing, so I would vote the dually. But you didn't mention how far you plan on towing the trailer. A diesel 250 would be adequate, provided your mentioned weight is correct, but there will be places and times you wished you had the dually if you're towing it any distance.

Distance would vary from a couple hours each way to possibly across a few states depending on what shows we would be attending. Not sure if it matters but I’m in the Midwest so I’m not trying to go through the mountains or anything.

No real way to answer your question without knowing what specific trailer you're contemplating. Simple rule of thumb is pick a trailer and find its GTWR (Gross Trailer Weight Rating). Then match that up to the trailer towing capacity of your truck choice. Ultimately, a F350/3500 dually will tow about anything you could buy, but might be overkill for a smaller aluminum trailer.

Something else to consider. Are you going to daily drive the truck? If yes, a F250/2500 series non-dually truck will be far easier to manipulate through traffic and in parking lots than a F350/3500 series dually would be.

For towing 12,000~ pounds regularly and the distances you describe, I would want a dually for safety reasons. A single tire blowout at highway speeds with that much weight could be disastrous. I tow just over 6000 pounds regularly with my Tundra and it pulls the weight easily, but with double that weight there is no way I’d want anything other than something with a dually axle, especially with live animals back there. Also with the F-350 you’ll have the future capacity to tow/haul more. You’d be surprised how fast the weight adds up.

The F-350 diesel is the best choice out of the big 3 overall, in my opinion.

Towing a 3-4 horse slant load with living quarters for 2 hours or through a state will be much more comfortable in a dually.

Its more stable and you will appreciate that when you get passed by a Simi and it makes you sway back and forth 2 feet....

The trailer you described requires a dual rear wheels. I tow a three horse with 6ft short wall living quarters with an F250, however I couldn’t go any bigger. Mine is just a 7 wide too. Loaded up with horses, tack, gear, full water tanks, etc it’s a good load.

Also, those towing numbers you mentioned are deceptive. By the time you add any options on that truck your more likely at 12,500-13,000. If you were to still go SRW, at least bump up to the F350. The towing and payload capacities are much better and the extra cost is well worth it. I wish I had.

In my former life I was in the towing business. From light duty to 100 ton wreckers. Drove them all. Lots of miles towing everything you can imagine up and down the road.

I recently was in the horse transportation business with my wife, who is a horse person, I am not.

I wouldn’t go any smaller than a dually, four door diesel truck. Especially with a living quarters trailer. I had a six horse with no living quarters before I sold the business, and routinely took that trailer loaded with six horses all over the country. Mainly East Coast.

You will not be disappointed to have “too much “ truck.

Similar to my former RV totter:

I don't know about horse trailers or gooseneck towing, but I tow a 14,500 (as verified on a CAT scale), 38' long, 13.5' tall 5th wheel with my single rear wheel, 2015 F350 diesel. I believe the advantage of a gooseneck vs. 5th wheel is a gooseneck allows more articulation between the tow vehicle and trailer.

Early on, I had an issue with the truck itself, towing or not. It would wander slightly in a variable crosswind or when passing semis requiring slight corrections from me at the steering wheel. I solved this with a bigger sway bar in the front and installing a rear sway bar in the rear, both from Hotchkis. My truck now drives straight as an arrow with no effort on my part.

I have no issues with passing or being passed by semis while towing my fifth wheel. I've towed in 25mph cross winds with 45 mph gusts without issue other than it drops my fuel economy. Most horse trailers I've seen are much shorter than my 5th wheel. I haven't towed with a dually and maybe it would be better than my truck.

Safety is if you have a blowout is often brought up as a reason to go with a dually. There maybe some merit to it, but what about the front tires? With the trailer hooked up and the truck loaded with my family, my front tires carry almost the same percentage of their rated capacity (at 65psi) than my rear tires (at 80psi) do, yet nobody seems to worry about the safety of the front tires.

The primary reason to go with a DRW is higher GVWR and higher GCWR than a SRW truck. A trucks payload is its GVWR less what it actually weighs. That's 11,400lbs less 8,300lbs for a payload of 3,100lbs in the case of my truck. The 8,300 included myself and a full tank of fuel plus the 5th wheel hitch. I have 3,100 of payload that gets used quickly with my wife, 3 kids, dog, and kingpin weight of my trailer. I'm at 11,300lbs. At 80psi, my rear tires are rated to carry 7,280lbs and my weight at the rear axle is 6,100lbs. My fronts at 65psi are rated to carry 6,390lbs and the front axle weighs 5,200lbs. The F350 DRW and F450 have a GVWR of 14,000lbs which won't translate directly to a 2,600lb increase in payload over the SWR F350 because the DRW F350 and F450 weigh more. In fact, because the F450 weighs more than the DRW F350, it has less payload than the DRW F350.

That brings us to GCWR. This is the weight of the truck loaded and trailer loaded. My truck's GCWR is 23,500lbs and I'm at 23,350. The difference between the F350 SRW, F350 DRW, and F450 in terms of GCWR is gearing. They are tested according to the same SAE J2807 standard. They all have the same engine and transmission, so why is one rated tow more than the other? Gearing. It doesn't sound like you will be anywhere near the limit of a SRW truck's GCWR.

TL;DR and I don't blame you - a SRW F350 diesel will be fine if you don't exceed its GVWR with the trailer loaded and hooked up and the truck loaded.

Good stuff guys. Looks like the standard 250 is a hard no. Was leaning towards the 350 dually initially. Just don’t like it for a daily driver as much as the 250. Better safe than sorry it seems though. Thanks !

quote:

Originally posted by Johnny 3eagles:
Similar to my former RV totter:

I have a good friend who is into the rodeo circuit with his two sons. They consistently rank nationally and travel all over the country for their “hobby”

The Freightliner pictured above is what they have to tow their 3 horse trailer with living quarters.

They are Ford people and have a couple of F-350 duallies but the tow with the Freightliner..

I have horses, as do a number of my friends. An F-250 will be plenty, and even a gasser instead of a diesel will be fine unless you are hauling hundreds of miles each year. It's a matter of payback on the truck. A late model diesel 250 will be significantly more expensive than a gasser, and while it will pull more weight, you won't get close to it's capabilities with a live in 4 horse.

An acquaintance of mine did the math (acquisition, fuel, maintenance) and he was going to have to put over 350,000 miles on the truck to make the diesel pay. He pulled through the Rockies with his gas version and had no complaints.

The modern 250 class are extraordinarily capable, even in gasoline form.

quote:

Originally posted by trapper189: Safety is if you have a blowout is often brought up as a reason to go with a dually. There maybe some merit to it, but what about the front tires?

Front tires are essentially a fixed risk that cannot be managed except for tire selection, proper inflation and good driving decisions. But the risk of the bad effects of a blowout on the rear axle can be reduced by adding an extra tire on each side. (Notice I didn't claim it reduces a blowout risk, just the potentially catastrophic effects of one.)

Cost, convenience and maneuverability in tight parking lots aside, a dually reduces the dangers of a catastrophic blowout by at least 50%. There are other advantages to spreading the power required to tow and stop a trailer across four tires instead of just two. If I were towing trailers and weights the OP is asking about this is something I would definitely put into the Operational Risk Management (ORM) equation.

Buy and maintain what you can afford (engine, tow package, rear axle setup), then acknowledge and manage the risks as appropriate.

I have had horses for some time now.

First if you are hauling anything, especially live weight, look at using 60-70% of mfg rated capacity. Are you going across town or cross country? Go to a horse event and talk to people doing what you want to do and see what works for them.

For me if a little is good more is better, and too much is just right. Safety is the issue. Hauling live weight is a different animal. Pun intended.



QUOTE]Originally posted by LincolnSixEcho:
Being as we are a very well rounded and eclectic group here on Sigforum, I figured there must be some horse people on here, and perhaps someone can give me some advice on pulling a trailer.

So here are some specifics. My wife is into horses. Yay for me. It’s fun, but a lot of work and expense. Currently we have only one, but are looking to add another one or two, maybe up to 4 total eventually for each family member. Because of this we are looking at 4-horse trailers with living quarters and I am wondering what would be adequate in terms of a truck to pull the trailer, potentially loaded out (though most likely 2-3 horses max for the immediate future).

I guess my biggest question is do I really need something like a Ford 350 diesel dually? Or could I get by with a 250 diesel with “tow package”? I know she wants a gooseneck style hitch, which allows more towing capacity I think right? I have run some numbers and have found that the 250 can tow up to 14-16,000# with the tow package. I know it matters what size trailer and if it’s all steel or aluminum/steel and how much the horses weigh and so on, but we have figured it shouldn’t be more than 12,000# fully loaded with 4 horses (if we even get to that number of horses). Would that be too much stress on the 250? Is the 350 dually too much truck?

Looking for any advice you can give. Personal experience and knowledge of what others in similar situations would help greatly.

Thanks as always for your time and assistance Sigforumites![/QUOTE]

The F250 exists for insurance and state regulatory reasons. Many states tax and regulate vehicles with a GVWR over 10,000lbs differently. In fact, you can order an F250 with a GVWR of 9,900lbs because that's the cut off in some states. Insurance companies do this as well with some calling vehicles with a GVWR over 10,000lbs as commercial.

In reality, the difference between an F250 and F350 SRW is a couple spacer blocks between the rear axle and springs, maybe an extra leaf in the rear spring packs or different rear springs, and maybe tires and wheels. Everything else is the same except the yellow and white sticker on the driver's door jamb.

Hope y'all can read this. Those DOT requirements are for commercial use only


https://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/regi...-i-need-usdot-number

You might want to check with your insurance company. A friend, here in Texas, was thinking about getting an F350 for his personal use, but his agent cautioned against it because some carriers consider them commercial vehicles. Instead, he got an F250 that was festooned with toolboxes and his carrier didn’t bat an eye. I’m just saying, not all surprises are pleasant ones.

On the topic of "more tires", when I towed homewares across the country, I went with a bigger trailer to get four wheels on the asphalt. No regrets going with more. Smooth and stable experience.

I have a 2005 Ram 3500 single rear wheel and a Featherlite 4 place draft slant load gooseneck trailer with living quarters. The truck will pull the loaded trailer without complaint and with a decent brake controller, the whole system stops fine. Extra stability especially in cross winds and on uneven roads would be nice.

I had the truck before I had horses. If I could do it again, honestly, I'd want at least a 3500 dually if not a slightly bigger model for the added stability. I've never really felt the need for extra power or torque, but definitely wish I'd known when I ordered this truck and spent the extra cash for the dually.

For trips of two hours to several days, you'll definitely want more than the barest minimum rated truck which will pull your setup on paper. Another thing to consider is durability. Stuff will generally last longer if you aren't running it right up against its rated capabilities every time. Also, with horses come a lot of accessories, tack, feed, hay, water, and all of those things add weight. Make sure to account for that in addition to the weight of people, and all of your stuff, trailer, and everything else.