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Semper Fi - 1775 |
I was reading an online blog today and there was a discussion about cel-phones and whether or not having them on (not on airplane mode) during the flight really matters. A few pilots weighed in and said that they can tell on their headphones if someone has a cel-phone on because of the static and sometimes it can really be a hinderance with having good radio contact with the tower. Thoughts? ___________________________ All it takes...is all you got. ____________________________ For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ | ||
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Member |
Here's some discussion: Aircraft Stack Exchange - cellphones It seems to be more a big thing with the FCC rather than the FAA. | |||
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אַרְיֵה |
EFBs (Electronic Flight Bags) are used by many (most?) pilots in airplanes that are not equipped with the latest and greatest navigation systems. These EFBs typically operate on tablets, iPads are the most popular. The EFBs display navigation information and are used in place of paper charts. Many of the EFB apps can be installed on phones, as well as tablets. I used a very popular EFB, "ForeFlight," and while the iPad was my primary device, I kept an updated copy on my iPhone as a backup, so that if the iPad were to go belly up in flight, I would have a choice of using paper charts or the phone. I frequently let passengers use the app on the phone, as well, so that they could track the flight in real-time. I have also had passengers use the phone to make calls in flight, maybe checking on a rental car at the destination airport, or just conducting business. I have never experienced any abnormality in the aircraft systems, nor have I heard any interference in radio communications. True story here: Just over thirty years ago, GPS for aviation was in its infancy. The hot item was a Garmin handheld unit. I was settling in to my seat in business class on the upper deck of a 747 flight from Chicago to Tokyo and I had my handheld Garmin with me. I was fastening the antenna to the window with the suction cup when the flight attendant passed by. She did not know what the gadget was (they were not all that common at the time), she looked a bit alarmed, didn't say anything to me, but went forward to inform the cockpit crew that there might be a problem. One of the pilots came back to my seat with her, looked at it, told the FA that it was the most accurate navigation system on board, and asked me if I would be able to cross-check some flight data with him later in the flight. He did come back, a few hours into the flight, gave me the input data (aircraft heading, pressure altitude, OAT (outside air temperature), airspeed) and had me calculate and confirm our track over the ground, actual groundspeed, and winds at our altitude. I believe that at the time they were using INS (Inertial Navigation Systems) for the polar portion of the flight, so yes, my little portable GPS was more accurate than the 747 systems. הרחפת שלי מלאה בצלופחים | |||
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Ball Haulin' |
Latest studies showing 5G can possibly interfere with radio altimeters on aircraft. The frequency bands are close. This is not good. Radio altimeters control LOTS of stuff on a modern commercial aircraft...for example when conducting an autoland including when the thrust is retarded on the engines. Jury is still out. Older generation cell stuff not so much but there was some issues on the Airbus initially until they shielded things a bit better. The more things become FBW, the more issues I think will crop up. -------------------------------------- "There are things we know. There are things we dont know. Then there are the things we dont know that we dont know." | |||
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PED's or personal electronic devices have been banned on commercial flights for decades; each operator had to test and approve anything they wished to allow. Certain devices, such as CD players, could cause interference with nav signals. When wearing a noise cancelling headset I can tell if someone has a cell phone on, in the airplane. It doesn't take much at all to interfere with nav signals, including GPS, VOR, ILS. as well as VHF, and HF communication. With more and more instrument approaches around the world turning to satellite based navigation, nav gets more accurate, but more susceptible to interference. The specific prohibition on cell phones in airplanes is an FCC issue, rather than an FAA issue, and stems from times when turning on a cell phone at altitude could cause widespread cell issues by attempting to contact multiple towers. The joint FAA/NASA Aviation Safety Reporting System contains thousands of reports of PED interference in aircraft communication and navigation. | |||
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I’m one who thinks a cellphone being on is a non-issue. Just think of the ramifications if it could effect anything important? Many people have them in ‘silent’, so as to be more covert. Yes, much testing & ‘shielding’ is part of the process for critical instruments becoming certified. I’m not saying to ignore any rules while flying, just saying, a phone taint gonna cause an incident. I did get a chuckle out of the scene on ‘Die Hard(er?)’, where they lower the glide slope to cause a crash. The validity of instruments while flying is aviation 101, just about any have ‘cross-check’ instruments to verify. I’ve flown full time since 1985, not saying I know everything. | |||
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From the link: keeping a quiet cabin. As hinted, 150+ passengers all yacking away on their cellphones (and most people tend to shout into the darn things) make one hell of a racket. Bad marketing for the airline. Everyone wants every other passenger to be quiet and behave but want for themselves the right to do whatever they want, other passengers be darned. | |||
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ins, i was using twins back in the 'early '80's!! | |||
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| His diet consists of black coffee, and sarcasm.  |
What does the "airplane mode" on a cell phone actually do? | |||
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| Semper Fi - 1775 |
Turns off your ability to receive wireless signal ___________________________ All it takes...is all you got. ____________________________ For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ | |||
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Member |
I was on the mighty Embraer EMB-135/145 Regional Jet for 14 years. We could ALWAYS tell when someone had their phone on and was NOT in airplane mode. We got a mid-tone buzzing in our headsets like a dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat..... To submit full disclosure, we never saw it do anything funky with our instruments. But for FURTHER full disclosure, 98% of our instrument approaches were performed with land-based navigation, i.e., ILS or VOR approaches, so I don't know that cell phone signals would have interfered with those type approaches. Toward the last couple of years before I left, RNAV Overlay Approaches had been certified for the EMB fleet and was slowly transitioning to straight-up RNAV/GPS Approaches as "Overlay" approaches were being phased out. I never noticed interference with our instruments for those approaches either. On the B737, we can do "coupled" RNAV approaches with the auto pilot, as the NAV system is installed with both Lateral and Vertical guidance when performing RNAV/GPS Approaches. The Embraer only had Lateral guidance, so we had to hand fly those approaches. Good times...good times!!  "If you’re a leader, you lead the way. Not just on the easy ones; you take the tough ones too…” – MAJ Richard D. Winters (1918-2011), E Company, 2nd Battalion, 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment, 101st Airborne "Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil... Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel." - Isaiah 5:20,24 | |||
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| Semper Fi - 1775 |
QUOTE: We got a mid-tone buzzing in our headsets like a dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat, dit-dat..... ———————————- Is the sound you are describing the same sound you sometimes get through your FM radio when your phone is too near it? ___________________________ All it takes...is all you got. ____________________________ For those who have fought for it, Freedom has a flavor the protected will never know ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ | |||
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Not an expert in anything related to plane or cell phone. But, I kinda always assumed it was like cell phones and Hospitals/ICUs. We always claimed it was because cell phones would "interfere" with monitoring equipment. But that was/is a load of fertilizer. The equipment is significantly shielded. It is done to control noise levels bc of so many idiots that love using the speaker phone to ensure everyone is very aware of how unimportant their conversation is and how self-absorbed/centered the person is. Now days, we also don't tolerate use in the hospitals due to cameras and patient sensitivity issues. Very valid concern. So, I'm thankful the cell usage is limited to the 5-30 min before takeoffs and after landings. More than once, I've asked individuals to have considerations for others and hold their conversations until in the terminal. One asshat got significantly put off by that. So by the conversation, I determined who his employer was. Thankfully, I owned some of their stock. So I called the home office and spoke with stock-holder relations. Informed them that I was overhearing sensitive information from an employee during a plane trip on that date from departure/destination city. I hope someone reached out and jerked that guy up by the short and curlies. Just my $0.02. Andrew Duty is the sublimest word in the English Language - Gen Robert E Lee. | |||
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I Deal In Lead |
Those are my thoughts exactly. Allowing cell phone use on airplanes would create chaos, closely followed by fistfights. | |||
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paradox in a box |
On my flight to Florida a few weeks ago I forgot to put my phone in airplane mode. We did not crash. These go to eleven. | |||
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| Ball Haulin' |
https://www.icao.int/safety/FS...blem%20statement.pdf -------------------------------------- "There are things we know. There are things we dont know. Then there are the things we dont know that we dont know." | |||
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Yes...kinda like that. "If you’re a leader, you lead the way. Not just on the easy ones; you take the tough ones too…” – MAJ Richard D. Winters (1918-2011), E Company, 2nd Battalion, 506th Parachute Infantry Regiment, 101st Airborne "Woe to those who call evil good, and good evil... Therefore, as tongues of fire lick up straw and as dry grass sinks down in the flames, so their roots will decay and their flowers blow away like dust; for they have rejected the law of the Lord Almighty and spurned the word of the Holy One of Israel." - Isaiah 5:20,24 | |||
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Curious that some can hear interference. Different headsets make a difference? I've never noticed anything on A20s or Zulus. My phone (usually streaming music) and tablet are always with me in the cockpit, same with any passengers. Only fly light twins, so unless there's some difference in larger planes... | |||
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I use a Bose A20 and a Bose Proflight. I can hear it on both. | |||
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Member |
My take on this is that the cellular companies themselves don't want 10's of thousands of devices pinging multiple towers at 250 mph around major airports and major cities. Most cellular signals are signal directed to about 6000' or less these days so this is not really a problem at altitude. When the technology to keep up with the saturation of digital signals is the standard everywhere, this problem will go away on its own. Yes, I've experienced interference on various aircraft over the years but nothing that would have affected navigation safety. It seems to me it is more of an accommodation to the phone companies. Back in the analog cellular days my boss would talk from Miami to New York the whole trip at 35000'. He must have used more than a few cell towers to accomplish that. Digital ended that ability for now. When the airlines figure out how to monetize your phone service it will suddenly be available to everyone all the time much like internet is now. ====== ...welcome to the barnyard...some animals are more equal than others | |||
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