Weld on?


Or a full length bolt on style


They bring up some good points in this video as to why their full length bolt on connectors are superior.


I am leaning toward the full length bolt on connectors because I can’t weld and I currently have the entire interior stripped and would need to transport it somewhere to get them welded on. Adding a large transport and install cost. When I can just do the bolt ons at the house but still giving me pretty solid results.

I am hoping to be in the 350hp range when I am done. Won’t be doing any drag racing but do hope to do a couple auto cross events, maybe hit a Mid America track day, and big dreams (likely not going to happen) run the Big Bend Road Open Road Race in Texas.
But 95% of the time will be spirited twisty country road driving.

I chose welded for my 66 Mustang convertible. I felt that welded was more secure and “solid” compared to bolt on. Did some research 6 years ago before making the decision. Happy with the choice but I am also not over 300hp as it is a cruiser more than a drag car.

quote:

Originally posted by cruiser68:
I chose welded for my 66 Mustang convertible. I felt that welded was more secure and “solid” compared to bolt on. Did some research 6 years ago before making the decision. Happy with the choice but I am also not over 300hp as it is a cruiser more than a drag car.

I have not seen these style of full length bolt ons before.
The bolt to the K member and the rear torque box.

All the others I researched before just connected the void between the front and rear subframe which seemed less strong.
These are the type I have seen in the past.

IIRC you have a tow vehicle, a full auto trailer rental is $55 a day from uHaul, the two wheel dolly auto trailer is $45 a day.

So for a little over a hundred bucks you could tow it to the shop to be welded on vs bolt on.

Either work, imagine even if you bolted it on that could be welded up later, but by then you'd have the interior done and probably not want to do that.

IMO weld on. My concern is shifting of the connectors from the original bolted on location.

I'd take a serious look at these from Detroit Speed & Engineering --> https://www.detroitspeed.com/p...ctors/parts/010114DS

I'm considering their similar sub-frame connectors for a '74 Formula. The install is a bit more involved, but they're really well thought out and will SERIOUSLY stiffen up the chassis!

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
I'd take a serious look at these from Detroit Speed & Engineering --> https://www.detroitspeed.com/p...ctors/parts/010114DS

I'm considering their similar sub-frame connectors for a '74 Formula. The install is a bit more involved, but they're really well thought out and will SERIOUSLY stiffen up the chassis!

Great googly moogly are they proud of their stuff.
And not a chance in the world I am cutting up my floor plan like that!

Since they aren't required for the drivability of the car, why not wait until you have put the car back together, then drive the car to a shop to be welded?

quote:

Originally posted by Orguss:
Since they aren't required for the drivability of the car, why not wait until you have put the car back together, then drive the car to a shop to be welded?

I’d like to get the interior put back together over the winter and since I am sound deadening the entire interior and installing new carpet don’t want to be welding on the floor pan after that is done.

Then in the spring actually get it driveable and ready for the motor swap.
But as usual time likely won’t allow.

While I would prefer welded versus bolt-on, I can understand where you're coming from as a do-it-yourselfer. I would be hesistant due to the possibility of the bolts loosening due to the hard use the car will see on the track. I guess if you're going to be regularly doing maintenance to the car pre- and post-race, the bolt-ons shouldn't be a problem.

Putting a bow tie on that will do a lot more for it than subframe connectors!

quote:

Originally posted by Orguss:
While I would prefer welded versus bolt-on, I can understand where you're coming from as a do-it-yourselfer. I would be hesistant due to the possibility of the bolts loosening due to the hard use the car will see on the track. I guess if you're going to be regularly doing maintenance to the car pre- and post-race, the bolt-ons shouldn't be a problem.

If they were the traditional style like I posted the picture of I would agree.

How ever this bolts into existing K member bolts and the upper shock bolts on the rear.
Not really too concerned with those coming loose.

Umm, is there any reason that the bolt-ons can't be welded in place after the vehicle is assembled and drivable??

quote:

Originally posted by Mark in Michigan:
Umm, is there any reason that the bolt-ons can't be welded in place after the vehicle is assembled and drivable??

They are different designs.
Bolt ons aren’t designed with provisions to be welded on and the weld ons aren’t designed with provisions to be bolted on.

Consider studying the Fox body SSP for the CHP. What did Ford engineers do for that speedy Mustang?

Bolted joints are subject to forces and decay that may loosen them over time.

Welded joints will require excellent preparation and follow-on corrosion protection.

Welded connectors, if not correctly aligned, could create a minute twist or torsion preload.

I would, if I had this project, have the bolted on units corrosion-proofed, upgrade the bolts (if needed, based on the specs), prep the areas under the connectors carefully, add significant corrosion protection to the subframes, and enjoy the better connected ride.

Don't forget the brace from strut tower to strut tower over the engine.

quote:

Originally posted by 4MUL8R:
Consider studying the Fox body SSP for the CHP. What did Ford engineers do for that speedy Mustang?

Nothing in regard to chassis stiffening and the only suspension upgrade is/was the upper control arm was a little beefier with stronger bushings.

Could a welder come to you?

Honestly, having viewed to two videos you embedded re: the SSM Bolt-On Connectors, the fact that they are designed such that the bolts mount through elongated slots would make them an absolute non-starter for me! If it were my car, I'd trailer it so someone that can do a proper weld-in installation. If the car belonged to someone I knew (or even someone I happened to meet in a parking lot!), I'd suggest the same thing. If you think the car needs subframe connectors, you should spend the money and do it right.

quote:

Originally posted by nhracecraft:
Honestly, having viewed to two videos you embedded re: the SSM Bolt-On Connectors, the fact that they are designed such that the bolts mount through elongated slots would make them an absolute non-starter for me! If it were my car, I'd trailer it so someone that can do a proper weld-in installation. If the car belonged to someone I knew (or even someone I happened to meet in a parking lot!), I'd suggest the same thing. If you think the car needs subframe connectors, you should spend the money and do it right.

Mind expanding a bit on the elongated holes being the non starter?

quote:

Originally posted by xantom:
Could a welder come to you?

Problem is the vehicle needs to be lifted pretty high and have full weight on the suspension. Don’t really feel like asking someone to come over and do it while the vehicle is on wheel cribs.

quote:

Originally posted by Black92LX:
Mind expanding a bit on the elongated holes being the non starter?

It's simply a bad design IMO. Subframe connectors are primarily designed to mitigate torsional flex/twisting of the chassis. When the torsional forces load & unload the chassis, it will essentially result in longitudinal compression and elongation, the end result being such that the mounting bolts will tend to move forward and rearward in the elongated slots. With the elongated holes/slots (presumably intended to accommodate existing dimensional tolerances which 'may' be the result of an already twisted uni-body chassis) you are relying entirely on the clamping force of the mounting bolts/nuts, as there is no physical limitation from the structure of the subframe connector to resist those forces. In looking at the pics of the SSM Subframe Connectors, the length of the elongated holes/slots at the front mounting position appear to be three times the diameter of the bolt! That's a lot of capacity for forward and aft movement, and again, you're only relying on the clamping force of the bolts!

Per some of your previous posts, I believe we're talking about a '92 Mustang LX here. As originally equipped with the 5.0 L V8, it made 225 HP. As you're indicating you hope to be in the 350 HP range, you’re looking at an add'l 125 HP, which is an increase of over 55%, and a potentially comparable (proportionate?) increase in torque! No doubt you're gonna LOVE launching that car, and you'll undoubtedly be upgrading the tires (drag radials?) in order to improve traction. You may likely be upgrading the suspension as well in order to get it to hook up. Meanwhile, the chassis was marginal at 225 HP, so yeah, sub-frame connectors! Get good ones...And weld them in!