SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge West Point grad and infantry officer expresses support for Communism and Kaepernick while wearing Che t-shirt under uniform-Army finally booting him!!
Main Page The Lounge West Point grad and infantry officer expresses support for Communism and Kaepernick while wearing Che t-shirt under uniform-Army finally booting him!!Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
Official Space Nerd |
I don't specifically know about West Point, but I am close with many people from the USAF Academy (staff and cadets; we sponsor several cadets in multiple year groups). At USAFA, they wouldn't just let something like this slide. They are very dilligent in weeding out those they feel don't meet standards. I don't believe West Point would just push him through just so they didn't have to bother with him. IMO, the cadet's attitude is the most important part. USAFA breaks down learning/instruction to areas of Academic, Physical Training, Military (standards, marching, military history, uniform wear, etc) and Character. One can always study harder, work out harder/more often; but attitudes are the hardest to adjust. The LtCol should have lit this punk up on the spot. He should not have given him a 'pass' on bis lack of wearing the proper uniform. He definitely should not have let this go on so long. At the FIRST sign of insubordination, the LtCol should have marched him over to his Officer in Charge (whatev the Point calls them) to make this guy's life a living hell. No staff member, ESPECIALLY a LtCol, should have to resort to arguing with a cadet. Fear God and Dread Nought Admiral of the Fleet Sir Jacky Fisher | |||
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I can't imagine that LTC was in Rapone's chain of command. Here's why: If a cadet/soldier in my chain of command is acting like an insubordinate douche, I would never write a sworn statement about their behavior to submit to someone else (unless as evidence in UCMJ action, Art. 32 hearing or a court martial). No, I'd write a negative counseling statement on the cadet and take whatever corrective action was required. It is a college, these 3 cadets were in a professors office having their argument. That is why the LTC gave then so much leeway, professional courtesy to the civilian professor. Finally, he had enough and tried to deal with it. Why did he put up with 5 mins of Rapone? I believe him that he kept expecting Rapone to realize the error of his ways and also the LTC knew he didn't have a lot of power, not being in Rapone's direct COC. Just my educated guess, but I'm not going to blame the one guy we know for a fact did speak up about this clown. “People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik Be harder to kill: https://preparefit.ck.page | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process  |
No experience at the service academies, but at training comands I’ve attended, misconduct, especially gross misconduct, gets you written up. We’ve seen the report in this case. You are part of a unit, a company, a section, etc. The officer in charge of that company and probably his boss get that report and decide how to handle it. You might get a hearing before the company officer, called in, explanation demanded, lots of “yes sir”ing. If you have a really good story, the offense is minor, adequately regretted, maybe you walk for several weeks, punitive marching on Saturday, no liberty. Maybe it would get kicked up to something more formal, a battalion review board, or worse, a regimental review board. Very formal, dress uniforms, green felt table, etc. You’re in a heap of trouble! Who knows what actually occurred here. I spoke with a friend of mine, USNA grad, instructor there back in the day. He had not heard of this. He almost passed out when he saw the report. Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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I agree with all of this and would add that with the eight years of the Muslim-in-chief and his promoting of Islam, I wouldn't hold it against the LTC if he gave greater leeway than would be usual in this situation because he was aware of the career-ending consequences of going up against muslims. Obviously I don't know if that was even a consideration but the Obama administration was toxic on all levels - not the least of which was what he and his cronies did to the military - so I don't fault military personnel for keeping their heads down and trying to do what good they can as best they know how until true change is possible. TGFDT! (Thank God For Donald Trump) | |||
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Right, but the LTC wrote the sworn statement presumably to pass on to Rapone's chain of command (why else would he write it?) It was Rapone's direct chain of command that failed, not this guy. I don't know what USMA is like, until this happened, I couldn't imagine this would be possible, for them graduate a clown like this. When the story broke, I assumed he kept most of his opinions to himself while there and pulled the photo stunt at graduation. Obviously not, it will be interesting to see what the USMA investigation reveals. “People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik Be harder to kill: https://preparefit.ck.page | |||
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| No double standards |
Major Hasan at Ft Hood comes to mind. They knew the Major was an extremist, but with Obama as Commander-in-Chief/Muslim-in-Chief, what to do? "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women. When it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it....While it lies there, it needs no constitution, no law, no court to save it" - Judge Learned Hand, May 1944 | |||
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Telecom Ronin |
Indeed... After reading the statement I wish it would have been a E-7 or above instead of a.light bird, I can just hear "PARADE REST"...." LOCK THAT SHIT UP" ....and then said NCO explaining in very colorful verbiage why CDT fuckstick needed to at ease that shit. Wow.....this nozzle needs to be to find his way to a debilitating accident..... | |||
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Member |
Cadet Commrade should’ve tried that shit with a Senior Chief or Master Chief outcome would’ve been much different. | |||
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fugitive from reality |
LTC Heffington's sworn statement should have been forwarded to CDT Rapone's TAC. What actually happened is anyone's guess. This can't be the first time the red menace has been in trouble. The TAC mission from the USMA web site: To educate, train, and inspire the Corps of Cadets so that each graduate is a commissioned leader of character committed to the values of Duty, Honor, Country and prepared for a career of professional excellence and service to the Nation as an officer in the United States Army. The members of the BTD accomplish this mission in diverse ways. The TACs and TACNCOs (Company TAC Teams) are the primary leader developers/integrators of the Academy's developmental programs - they oversee each Cadet's individual development in the academic, military, physical, and moral-ethical dimensions within the framework of the Cadet Company. The TAC Teams train, lead, coach, and mentor cadets, with a continual focus on leader development. The TAC is the legal commander of the cadet company, and as such is responsible for the establishment and maintenance of a command climate which fosters individual and unit excellence in all program areas http://www.usma.edu/btd/SitePages/Home.aspx _____________________________ 'I'm pretty fly for a white guy'. | |||
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semi-reformed sailor |
This Chief woulda put a round turn on him. "Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor.” Robert A. Heinlein “You may beat me, but you will never win.” sigmonkey-2020 “A single round of buckshot to the torso almost always results in an immediate change of behavior.” Chris Baker | |||
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| Go ahead punk, make my day |
Yeah, that wanking LTC obviously wasn't combat arms either. But a Chief or Gunny? FORGETABOUT IT. Deadmeat on the spot. | |||
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| wishing we were congress |
A part of this story that has gone quiet is Professor Hosein. He is the muslim West Point instructor who was the mentor of Rapone. Hosein apparently went on administrative leave immediately as the Rapone story broke. West Point said it was not related to Rapone. Hosein is from Canada. Met an American when both were at American University in Cairo. (and later married her) Hosein eventually came to Univ Chicago. In 2011 he was chosen to teach at West Point. (sure sounds like an Obama move here) No further word on whereabouts of Hosein or why he is on admin leave. It was Hosein's office where the argument occurred. | |||
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| Member |
Interesting information, sdy. I should have specified that Prof. Hosein is the muslim I was referring to in my previous post regarding a clash. I don't think the LTC knew Rapone was a muslim (although he may have suspected), but going against a muslim professor (why is there a muslim professor at West Point, or any service academy to begin with?) under the all-but-in-name-only Islamic administration of the time would give anyone pause. | |||
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Oh stop  I keep hearing about the magical Dept. of the Navy senior enlisted and how they would have taken care of it. How exactly? He would be "deadmeat on the spot?" Surely you don;t mean literally, as in they would beat a cadet to death right? So, what do you mean? a. if they lay a hand on a cadet (or soldier/sailor) their career is over. b. this kid is no slouch either and might just give back better than he gets. So, would they yell super-duper mean at him? I've got news for ya, with his background he has been yelled at by some of the meanest the military has to offer...he'll just sneer at them like he did the LTC. Would they yell at him (while he sneers back) and then report him to his chain of command? Well, it seems that is what this LTC did. So, how would a Chief or Gunny handle this? In real, specific terms? Their power goes away when a non-scared target decides they don't GAF. Then is is up to the chain of command to UCMJ or shut up. “People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik Be harder to kill: https://preparefit.ck.page | |||
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| Never miss an opportunity to be Batman!  |
They would in respectful manner to the young officer explain why he needed to get his head out of his ass and follow the program set forth and if they were training instructors they would explain with additional more creative language because his rank doesn't mean that much to them, as he is a trainee. If the officer in question did not change his ways and attitude, the senior NCOs would take their observations and concerns to the unit's ranking NCO and then to the unit's commander. Which is exactly what happened at Ranger School for Comrade Asshat. Remember, he was insubordinate to the LTC at West Point, which was basically being teated as a college during the Obummer era; think of all the shit cadets have got away with during this time frame such as this Black Power Fist by black female cadets , an inquiry was started by West Point but no findings were released. Different environment than active duty Army. Now Comrade Asshat has graduated from West Point and is back in the real Army with no Muslim professor to mentor him. Now he is with working officers (not college teachers), and NCOs judging him by his words, deeds, actions, and attitudes. So far, it has not gone well for Comrade Asshat and I would not be surprised if a Big Chicken Dinner (aka Bad Conduct Discharge) is in his future. As far as the Navy goes, I only know what I heard from friends and family who were in. Basically it boils down to this: Never ever piss off anyone in the Goat Locker. In normal situations a Chief would mentor a young new officer. If the officer was a pompous ass, it was sink or swim time on his or her own with sinking of their career being the usual result. | |||
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| Member |
I got news for you, Ranger School is a totally different environment than West Point (or any line unit). They are looking to drop people, they drop and recycle students every single day. At the start of a class, they have about 100 more than they can handle going forward so the PT test on day 1 is a bloodbath. So, encountering this guy's attitude and dropping him or giving him a day 1 recycle is just standard procedure. I can't tell you why West Point put up with his behavior, but they (whomever was in his chain of command) obviously did. So, this fictional encounter with a random Navy enlisted chief would have ended the same. The Chief would bring his concerns to the cadet's chain of command just like you said (like presumably the LTC did with the sworn statement, the reason he wrote it) and nothing would have happened. Whenever I enter into a confrontation I always think through what power I do, and do not have. The worst thing ever is to make a threat you can't back up and then be impotent. The power of anyone encountering this clown who wasn't in his direct chain of command, would be limited to an on the spot correction and letting his chain of command know about the incident. That's it. The only guy we have evidence of who tried to get rid of this guy is taking a beating in this thread and he didn't have the power to ax this clown, anymore than some random Chief would have. Edit: I agree with you that now he is in the real Army, his career is over. No active duty unit will put up with him, but then, we are talking about a completely different chain of command than whatever existed at USMA in '16. “People have to really suffer before they can risk doing what they love.” –Chuck Palahnuik Be harder to kill: https://preparefit.ck.page | |||
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| I believe in the principle of Due Process |
The sort of discipline that consists of making life unpleasant, physically or mentally, doesn’t work after a point. If you don’t mind, it don’t matter. This guy made it through Ranger school, much more demanding than West Point punishments. Ending his career may be throwing him in the briar patch, but what else is there? Luckily, I have enough willpower to control the driving ambition that rages within me. When you had the votes, we did things your way. Now, we have the votes and you will be doing things our way. This lesson in political reality from Lyndon B. Johnson "Some things are apparent. Where government moves in, community retreats, civil society disintegrates and our ability to control our own destiny atrophies. The result is: families under siege; war in the streets; unapologetic expropriation of property; the precipitous decline of the rule of law; the rapid rise of corruption; the loss of civility and the triumph of deceit. The result is a debased, debauched culture which finds moral depravity entertaining and virtue contemptible." - Justice Janice Rogers Brown | |||
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Get Off My Lawn |
Yep, Barry's fingerprints are all over this. "I’m not going to read Time Magazine, I’m not going to read Newsweek, I’m not going to read any of these magazines; I mean, because they have too much to lose by printing the truth"- Bob Dylan, 1965 | |||
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| Never miss an opportunity to be Batman! |
I actually agree with you, while Comrade Asshat was at West Point, it would not have mannered one bit that he pissed off a senior NCO or the entire senior NCO cadre. If a write up from a Light Colonel went nowhere than any actions from a senior NCO would have gone nowhere.....while he was at West Point.....I imagine information would have made it through the NCO grapevine to what ever command he ended up and that is when shit would get real.  | |||
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| Never miss an opportunity to be Batman! |
He didn't make it through Ranger School, he was on Phase II when he was recycled to day 1. He dropped at that time, which is marked as "dropped due to lack of motivation". As an enlisted person he was in the Ranger unit but he had not gone through Ranger School yet. He made it through Basic, AIT, Airborne, Ranger Assessment and Selection and then Air Assault while in the Rangers. From an article I found: "According to Army Special Operations spokesman Lt. Col. Robert Bockholt, Rapone deployed to Afghanistan with 1st Battalion, 75th Ranger Regiment in 2011 before he was “removed for standards” from the regiment for unspecified reasons". Follow on courses dependent upon MOS such as SOCM and other "specialty upgrade" training is also required by certain MOSs attending RASP. Those who are obligated for these follow-on courses also are in jeopardy of losing all affiliation with the Ranger regiment if said personnel fail to complete their follow-on training. These trainees will be realigned to another unit, most often an airborne unit. In other words, he was in the Rangers but had not attended Ranger School and was removed from the Rangers for failure to met standards, ie either not being able to get into Ranger School or funking out in Ranger School or another required course. This did not prevent him from applying to and getting into West Point. | |||
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SIGforum.com Main Page The Lounge West Point grad and infantry officer expresses support for Communism and Kaepernick while wearing Che t-shirt under uniform-Army finally booting him!!
Main Page The Lounge West Point grad and infantry officer expresses support for Communism and Kaepernick while wearing Che t-shirt under uniform-Army finally booting him!!© SIGforum 2024