Page 1 2
Go | New | Find | Notify | Tools | Reply | |
Plowing straight ahead come what may |
 https://www.history.com/this-d...uccessfully-exploded ******************************************************** "we've gotta roll with the punches, learn to play all of our hunches Making the best of what ever comes our way Forget that blind ambition and learn to trust your intuition Plowing straight ahead come what may And theres a cowboy in the jungle" Jimmy Buffet | ||
|
| Member |
Visiting Trinity site is on my bucket list, but I keep putting it off for other trips. It's open to the public one day every April and October. https://www.wsmr.army.mil/Trinity/Pages/Home.aspx | |||
|
| An investment in knowledge pays the best interest |
The Trinity site is pretty underwhelming, even though I have a strong family connection. The blast wasn't really that large (in the news realz it looks gigantic, but in reality was maybe a few hundred yards across). Part of the crater that wasn't bulldozed over, perhaps 100' or so, is still there and protected by a large iron cover. The site also includes the station where the final bomb assembly occurred and the close viewing area. When I was there in April '98, White Sands had a very strong wind storm the night before and radioactive dust had been uncovered at the site. An insufficient amount to keep the public out, but a sufficient amount that my sandles and feet had to be washed off prior to departing. | |||
|
| Just because you can, doesn't mean you should |
I looked at it on Google earth and I looks like not much to see. The Nevada test site on the other hand, has a lot of craters and there is information on most with a click of the mouse. The Plowshares site is an interesting concept that only the government could think up. Peaceful uses for nuclear weapons or some such idea. How to move a lot of dirt with the push of a button, intended for very large construction projects. The only problem is that you can't go in the area for a few years after. ___________________________ Avoid buying ChiCom/CCP products whenever possible. | |||
|
Official Space Nerd |
It definitely is not Disneyland. Meaning, if you don't have an appreciation of just what occurred there, you will likely be VERY bored. I was there in October of 2008, and there was still a lot of Trinitite scattered around the place. It was really worthwhile for me to stand where it all began. . . They also had a semi trailer with a full scale model of the Fat Man (Nagasaki) device there. Somebody was selling books and t-shirts, but it was not a lot. It was a long drive in, and the place is understandably remote. I would go back, but I'm a military history fanatic and I LOVE nukes. . . Fear God and Dread Nought Admiral of the Fleet Sir Jacky Fisher | |||
|
| His diet consists of black coffee, and sarcasm.  |
And less than a month later (August 6 and 9), we built and dropped not one, but two deliverable weapons. | |||
|
Political Cynic |
I want to visit the property in October - been trying to go for the past few years [B] Against ALL enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC | |||
|
| Page late and a dollar short |
While Alamogordo is usually mentioned in stories about the test actually Socorro is more a part of that story. From 79-88 while living there I heard a lot of stories from the locals of their experiences the morning of the test, both in town and a couple of ranchers who lived near the test site. I was told that one building in town has a leftover steel beam from construction of one of the towers, either the one for the bomb or for Jumbo. Was never able to find out more information on that, the person who built it passed shortly after I got to town. Speaking of Jumbo, a piece of it is in Kittrell Park aka the Plaza in the middle of town. Also there were Professors at NMIMT at that time that had been associated with the work at Los Alamos and at Trinity Site, unfortunately I never met any of them. But for all that, I never went to Trinity. -------------------------------------—————— ————————--Ignorance is a powerful tool if applied at the right time, even, usually, surpassing knowledge(E.J.Potter, A.K.A. The Michigan Madman) | |||
|
| Dances With Tornados |
Have You been to the National Museum of Nuclear Science & History in Albuquerque? I highly recommend it, I've been several times. NuclearMuseum.org LINK . | |||
|
Member |
I went on April 1st several years ago. Was interesting, especially seeing the photos of the military officer standing over the remains of the tower with just a normal uniform on. People really didn't know what they were dealing with. Of course I like the desert and roaming around out there. ****************************************************W5SCM "We the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution" - Abraham Lincoln "I have been driven many times upon my knees by the overwhelming conviction that I had nowhere else to go" - Abraham Lincoln | |||
|
| Member |
Make that 75 years ago. Next chance to visit is October 3: https://www.wsmr.army.mil/Trinity/Pages/Home.aspx | |||
|
| Page late and a dollar short |
http://socorro-history.org/HIS...y/200705_trinity.pdf I was acquainted with many of the persons named in this article. Hearing them relating what they experienced during those days was at least for me something I would never tire of. -------------------------------------—————— ————————--Ignorance is a powerful tool if applied at the right time, even, usually, surpassing knowledge(E.J.Potter, A.K.A. The Michigan Madman) | |||
|
| Member |
While I’ll probably never make it out there, I also consider the site to be a true place of history, and would most likely be in awe being there. Also, thanks for the links provided in this post, their content kept me busy for hours.... | |||
|
| Member |
i will forever be amazed Truman had the stones to drop (2) of those on Japan incredible in retrospect and if I feel sorry for Japan for one half of one second I remind myself of the Bataan death march, Unit 731, concentration camps and Nanking, etc ---------------------------------- Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. | |||
|
| A day late, and a dollar short  |
Hence the saying, "Made in the USA, tested in Japan".  ____________________________ NRA Life Member, Annual Member GOA, MGO Annual Member | |||
|
Step by step walk the thousand mile road |
Why? The military planners, who had underestimated American casualties in almost every other island campaign, were telling President Truman that invasion of Kyushu, with fairly limited objectives, might cost 450,000 men, including 110,000 killed. Adding in Operation Coronet, the invasion of Honshu (again limited objectives, mostly taking Tokyo) was to cost 1.2 million American casualties, with 265,000 deaths. The planners believed the Japanese would fight to the last man, woman, and child, and would suffer over 6,000,000 casualties, most of whom would be civilian dead. These fears were so bad that the US was considering using chemical weapons (e.g., various mustard agent formulations, phosgene) despite a no-first-use policy by FDR (continued by Truman), and you can see how far our military leaders were willing to go to defeat Japan as quickly and efficiently as possible. I've wondered if bombing the Japanese with conventional ordnance would ever get them to surrender unconditionally. LeMay burned about 16 square miles of Tokyo to a cinder in a single raid, killing over 100,000. XXI Bomber Command also burned IIRC 83 other major Japanese cities, causing massive damage and deaths by the tens of thousands. Given the choice of bombing two cities and killing perhaps 100,000 Japanese against zero American dead and fewer Japanese casualties made the decision a no brainer. A-bomb and conventionally bomb the Japanese until they surrendered. Nice is overrated "It's every freedom-loving individual's duty to lie to the government." Airsoftguy, June 29, 2018 | |||
|
| Member |
There is a tour available. It's always booked solid months in advance so planning is required. https://www.nnss.gov/pages/Pub...reach/NNSStours.html It is truly a fascinating place. I worked there in 1965/66 as well as at the Mississippi test site before the test ban. I can tell you that watching the ground rise is awe inspiring | |||
|
| Why don’t you fix your little problem and light this candle  |
The story of the Secret City, Oak Ridge Tennessee is a favorite of mine. If you do get a chance to visit it is worth your time. This is where much of the fuel was made. Manhattan Project National History Park Atomic Heritage Foundation - Trinity Test This business will get out of control. It will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it. -Rear Admiral (Lower Half) Joshua Painter Played by Senator Fred Thompson | |||
|
| Member |
because they were basically 100% non-military targets. he killed 100,000+ civilians with that decision what percentage of people in the same position would make that decision? it's unknowable -- but its not a big one I'd bet bet you 'modern' politicians wouldn't do it --------------------------------- Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another. | |||
|
| Never miss an opportunity to be Batman!  |
No they weren't, both were legitimate military targets: Hiroshima was a city of both industrial and military significance. Hiroshima was the headquarters of the 2nd General Army 第2総軍 (日本軍) with responsibility for most of western Japan including Kyushu as well as a depot and port of embarkation in the middle of an urban industrial area. It was a good radar target and it was such a size that a large part of the city could be extensively damaged. There are adjacent hills that were likely to produce a focusing effect that would considerably increase the blast damage. Due to rivers, it was not a good incendiary target. It was classified as an AA(Prime)Target. It had a military garrison of about 40,000 men. Hiroshima was the primary target for the August 6 attack, with Kokura and Nagasaki as alternatives. Far from being an innocent city full of civilians, the garrison of 40,000 soldiers were doing calisthenics when the bomb exploded and were in fact the largest single group of casualties in the city. Nagasaki was a major industrial city making torpedoes and ammunition. Mitsubishi Steel, Orikami Ordinance Works and a large engine works dominated the production in the city in addition of a large garrison. There were also a major dockyard used for the transport of men and materials to the north. It, too, was a high priority target but was a secondary target that was only hit if the primary target was too cloud covered for a visual drop on the primary. It should be added that the popular position today that the civilians were not part of the war effort is beyond ridiculous. Every person in every country of the world was contributing to the war effort of their country. Regardless of the country-Germany, Japan, England, the United States, Russia… Everything that every person could do was to help their country win. In the United States almost every family had a "Victory garden" so that they would use less food that could be sent to soldiers. Kids were sent out to pick up metal, extra pots and pans were donated to be melted down for aluminum and steel. In essence, every person in every country was fighting for the success of their country. They may not have been carrying a gun, but they were an essential part of the war effort. Saying that a civilian was not important ignores that fact that the soldier would have no gun, ammunition, food, or transportation without those civilians. So, unbeknownst to the modern generation, the two atomic bombs were, in fact, dropped on military targets that had been warned that they were going to be attacked. Another reason for their selection: neither location had been significantly bombed prior to A-Bombs being used, so battle damage and results could be graphically shown. | |||
|
| Powered by Social Strata | Page 1 2 |
 | Please Wait. Your request is being processed... |
|
© SIGforum 2024