The money that was approved to be spent and was supposed to be there for the next five years has already been spent, says Hungary’s PM

https://rmx.news/hungary/the-e...-orban-at-eu-summit/

The first question asked by Prime Minister Viktor Orbán in his Facebook post is: “The only question everyone is asking here in Brussels is: Where has the money gone?”

Orbán is currently attending the two-day summit of EU leaders in Brussels, and one of the hottest topics is the question as to where the EU’s budget money has disappeared to. The Hungarian prime minister said that the European Commission had submitted a budget amendment proposal asking member states to pay tens of billions of euros.

“The question arises: How did this situation come about and how did they bring the European Union to the brink of bankruptcy?” Orbán asked.



Orbán also noted that the EU is demanding more money from member states, although it is only two years into its seven-year budget. In other words, the money that was approved to be spent and was supposed to be there for the next five years has already been spent.

The prime minister then went on to list what Brussels is demanding for the budget.

“They want to get €50 billion from the member states to give to Ukraine, while they cannot even account for the money we have given them so far. They want more money from the member states so that they can pay the interest on the European Union loans that they have previously taken out. These are loans that Poland and Hungary have not seen a single cent from so far,” Orbán said.

Orbán said the EU commission is asking member states for more money for migration, not for border protection, but to bring in illegal immigrants.

“Of course, they didn’t forget about their own pockets. They are asking for billions of euros to raise the salaries of Brussels bureaucrats,” he said.

“The Hungarian position is clear,” he said. “First, we want to know what the huge amount of money we have given them so far has been spent on. Afterward, we want to know who is responsible for the fact that the European Union is on the brink of bankruptcy.”

Orbán is attending the summit of the Council of EU leaders on Thursday and Friday, where the main topics on the agenda are the issue of additional financial support for Ukraine, mandatory migrant quotas and shaping the EU’s policy toward China.

He's completely correct. We're on the same path, and holding hands with the EU central bank.

Every country on the planet is on the verge of bankruptcy. I can’t think of a single country that’s not debt ridden to the point of insolvency.

quote:

Originally posted by OcCurt:
Every country on the planet is on the verge of bankruptcy. I can’t think of a single country that’s not debt ridden to the point of insolvency.

Somalia.

quote:

Originally posted by Sig2340:

quote:

Originally posted by OcCurt:
Every country on the planet is on the verge of bankruptcy. I can’t think of a single country that’s not debt ridden to the point of insolvency.

Somalia.

That's funny

So an enormous government bureaucracy blew through money like Charlie Sheen in Tijuana? That never happens.

Corruption (those same Brussels bureaucrats lining their own pockets on the sly), bribes, "special projects" that weren't included in the official budget, hookers & blow, etc. You know, all the usual stuff.

Orbán as usual is right on the money. I've been told but don't understand what would happen if the US dollar were replaced with another currency (Yen, Ruble, Pound) that we couldn't just print more money. Is that why the EU just can't increase the debt limit like we do?

“The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.” Former British Prime Minister Margaret Thatcher

quote:

Originally posted by Expert308:
Corruption (those same Brussels bureaucrats lining their own pockets on the sly), bribes, "special projects" that weren't included in the official budget, hookers & blow, etc. You know, all the usual stuff.

Corruption isn’t necessary to explain the financial problems of the EU, or for that matter the US. The simple matter is that we simply cannot be so overly generous with entitlements as we’ve been, collectively, for the last 50 years. You can’t have more people riding the cart than there are people pulling the cart. We are rapidly approaching that point, and that’s why finances are globally critical.

^^^Corruption AND Incompetence should cover it...

It wouldn't have anything to do with the mass migrations of hordes of unskilled, uneducated squalids into Europe and giving them welfare would it?

Naaaaaah.

quote:

Originally posted by Bytes:
Orbán as usual is right on the money. I've been told but don't understand what would happen if the US dollar were replaced with another currency (Yen, Ruble, Pound) that we couldn't just print more money. Is that why the EU just can't increase the debt limit like we do?

It's pretty easy: Literally every line in that "report" is nonsense.

The EU cannot generally incur debt; in fact that's a long-standing bone of contention between the fiscally conservative northern members informally led by Germany, who fear that they would be subsidizing debt service for the southern members informally led by France, who hope that the financial standing of the EU overall would make for better lending conditions than their individual national background if the Union did it on their behalf.

However, as of now, there are only strictly limited exceptions. One was to finance the 800 bn € COVID recovery plan for the members' national economies, which could obviously not be planned for in the regular budget which is only a bit over 180 bn annually; the Union generally has just the money its members give it, and national contributions are negotiated every seven years for the planned total expenses in that timeframe.

Now the 2024 budget proposed by the Commission in June is about to start being negotiated. This does indeed include four billion to service the loans for the recovery plan (total is 189.3 after 186.6 and 182.3 bn in previous years). Hungary stands to gain proportionally much from the recovery plan since it's the biggest per-capita net receiver of EU subsidies. Which BTW are an important source for Orban to secure his domestic rule, since his government directs a lot of them to his cronies who at this point control most of the Hungarian economy.

Except of course the EU has started to withhold payments for his violations of European treaty provisions on good governance, rule of law and democratic standards where it is even possible, such as from said recovery program. Naturally in turn Orban is using his essential veto powers to hold up budget decisions which require unanimity IOT pressure the Union to pay. The talk about immigration and stuff is just his usual shtick for public consumption, part of the populist "protecting Hungary from the evil EU and other globalists" cover for the fact that his rule actually depends upon EU money.

Ukraine is a recent addition to this act, since he is a self-declared buddy of Putin, and also Xi Jinping, Recep T. Erdogan and similar strongmen he has been doing his best to protect from EU censure. Additional aid for Ukraine wasn't however even a topic at the summit where he made those remarks. So it's all just posturing to warn the EU they better pay him, or else.

quote:

Originally posted by wcb6092:
“The Hungarian position is clear,” he said. “First, we want to know what the huge amount of money we have given them so far has been spent on..."

That's an easy one...grift.

quote:

So it's all just posturing to warn the EU they better pay him, or else.

Well banshee it sounds like dissolving the EU would be in the best interest of everyone. Then you could stop subsidizing Orban.

Well, if the EU has started to withhold payments for his 'violations of European treaty provisions on good governance, rule of law and democratic standards', then I'd say Orban is probably doing all the right things!

quote:

Originally posted by BansheeOne:
Additional aid for Ukraine wasn't however even a topic at the summit where he made those remarks. So it's all just posturing to warn the EU they better pay him, or else.

You're telling me that Orbán is the problem? Europe has been screaming "Red Menace", "Red Menace" for the last 2 years. Now you're saying the EU (on the brink of insolvency) didn't even discuss issuing debt to fight this "looming disaster" posed by Putin? The EU should look inward. From this side of the Atlantic Orbán seems like the least of the EU's problems.

^^^From this side of the Atlantic, Orbán seems like a 'Hungary First' Conservative!

One of my friends is Hungarian - it’s improving, but the political class is more like “Russia Lite”.

Your house won’t get blown up, if the connected want your business, but you will be arrested and given an offer to sell and leave prison.

Hungarian cronyism is an interesting case study, from afar. Orban's father, brother, son-in-law and best childhood friend have become some of the richest people in Hungary under his premiership, getting more than a quarter of all government contracts between them in the first months of 2020 alone, usually without a bid. That friend, Lőrinc Mészáros, is particularly instructive. Before Orban's re-election in 2010, he ran a gas-fitting company which nearly went bankrupt in 2007. By 2013, he was the 88th richest Hungarian; by 2017, the fifth-richest; and by 2022, the richest. In 2018, 93 percent of the money from public contracts he got were actually EU subsidies for building up tourism, infrastructure etc. He has been quoted with "My fortune is thanks to three factors: God, luck and Viktor Orban."

On the way he assembled a rather diverse business empire - construction, energy, railroad, hotels, banks, and he was among the Orban cronies who bought up 80 percent of private Hungarian media, many in financial trouble due to exorbitant taxes on revenue from advertisments introduced under Orban, and not getting any government-paid advertizing unlike pro-government media. He also established his own print media distribution service, before all media companies acquired by the circle were "donated" to a public foundation in 2018. Then before the last election in 2021, the Hungarian Postal Service, a government agency, suddenly ceased delivery of newspapers on the grounds that it was no longer economically rewarding. So independent media now have to pay more for distribution, and can of course be rejected by the "private" service which is under no official obligation to have them as customers.

That's just what can be easily verified by public records, unlike various stories that you need to be a member of Orban's Fidesz party just to be hired as a kindergarten teacher, people considered unreliable getting purged from public adminstration and government-controlled enterprises, etc. There is of course the rewriting of the constitution, the electoral redistricting and preference given to expat voters, the creation and appropriation of bodies controlling the judiciary and media, and not least Orban having himself voted emergency powers to rule by decree without parliamentary oversight during COVID, then liking it so much he had them extended because of the Ukraine war before they sunset. Plus his links to other authoritarians, having the first overseas campus of a Chinese elite university affiliated with the Communist Party being built in Budapest, turning Hungary into China's spy central in Europe, and so on.

quote:

Originally posted by Bytes:
You're telling me that Orbán is the problem? Europe has been screaming "Red Menace", "Red Menace" for the last 2 years. Now you're saying the EU (on the brink of insolvency) didn't even discuss issuing debt to fight this "looming disaster" posed by Putin? The EU should look inward. From this side of the Atlantic Orbán seems like the least of the EU's problems.

Again, the EU isn't "on the brink of insolvency". The current budget of 189 bn includes four billion Euro for planned debt service, which is well within the scope of the seven-year financial framework agreed in 2021. What is indeed used up are any reserves for additional expenses like more aid for Ukraine; 30 billion have been provided from the last and current annual budget, so any more (the Commission wants another 50 billion until the end of the current financial period in 2027) will have to be negotiated with the member states. If they don't give it to the Commission, that won't happen; and since it has to be agreed unanimously, that's where Orban has essentially a veto to trade for payment of aids Hungary would get from the COVID recovery plan.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: BansheeOne,