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Hey, baseball fans- remember all those steroids Mark McGwire took? Yeah, he says they made no difference Login/Join 
Caribou gorn
Picture of YellowJacket
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quote:
Originally posted by Flashlightboy:
After Barry left baseball I had an occasion to talk with a former pro athlete turned orthopedic surgeon about Barry, his steroids and all that. During his pro days the doctor was good friends with Bobby, Barry's dad. Saw Barry as a kid all the way up through his baseball days.

He says without a doubt Barry is a prick with a huge ego and ego is why he used the PEDs. McGuire, Sosa and others were getting the headlines, money and flash and Barry wanted that too.

That said, he didn't fault Barry or the others for taking them because the steroids didn't give them any faster bat swing or hand eye coordination. These people all had trenendous athletic ability without the PEDs and they all were potential HOF material regardless.

As far as hitting the ball farther, he also said that the sanctuary of revered stats that fans are in love with isn't so sacred in the history of baseball and monkeying around with the game continues to this day.

Owners change the field dimensions for their hitters, they change the distance behind home plate and down the lines to catch more outs that might have gone into the stands.

So yes, McGuire is correct in that he was a natural born hiter who used PEDs to help his talent. Would Hank Aaron have made his record if the mound height hadn't been changed a few years earlier? Players used huge gloves to catch balls they might not catch so the game is messed with by everyone but the core talent doesn't change.

Henry Aaron already had 510 homeruns before they lowered the mound.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: YellowJacket,



I'm gonna vote for the funniest frog with the loudest croak on the highest log.
 
Posts: 10627 | Location: Marietta, GA | Registered: February 10, 2009Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Wait, what?
Picture of gearhounds
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Maybe his hand-eye coordination would have allowed him to hit the ball as many times as he did, but the extra strength, speed, and recovery time all helped him attain the number of homers that might have been base hits or catches at the fence. He is still the same old piece of shit IMO.




“Remember to get vaccinated or a vaccinated person might get sick from a virus they got vaccinated against because you’re not vaccinated.” - author unknown
 
Posts: 15924 | Location: Martinsburg WV | Registered: April 02, 2011Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Irksome Whirling Dervish
Picture of Flashlightboy
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@ Yellow Jacket

Precisely.

Pitching was keeping runs down so MLB wanted more runs leading to the lowered mound.

Aaron played for 22 years. Did the lowered mound extend his career? I think so because you don't modernly see hitters in the league for that long but Aaron definitely had natural talent.

But his numbers were awfully good after they changed the mound in the later part of his career. He hit 44 HRs the year of the change, equalling a number when he was in the true prime of his career.
 
Posts: 4287 | Location: "You can't just go to Walmart with a gift card and get a new brother." Janice Serrano | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Big Stack
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I can't get myself worked up about PED in professional athletics. Pro sports is a show. On PEDs they can put on a better show. I have to question why they're against the rules in the first place.
 
Posts: 21240 | Registered: November 05, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Member
Picture of Ripley
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Originally posted by parabellum:
quote:
Originally posted by Ripley:
I doubt PED's hurt his performance.
Well, uhh, yeah. Confused


My way of saying who knows how much PED's helped?

IIRC the McGwire/Sosa battles were during one of those "lively ball" eras in MLB. But MM played at old Busch Stadium, not a hitter friendly park although the fences had been moved in to facilitate the HR's-win-ball-games metric.

As a disclaimer and a non-Cards fan in enemy territory, every HR MM hit pained me. I do know he was one hell of an athlete and, if anyone could hit that many HR's at that time, MM is your guy.

When the PED info came out at the time, I gladly threw it in the faces of his defenders. They all KNEW it was a non-factor. I thought otherwise and still do.




Set the controls for the heart of the Sun.
 
Posts: 8617 | Location: Flown-over country | Registered: December 25, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Raised Hands Surround Us
Three Nails To Protect Us
Picture of Black92LX
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quote:
Originally posted by BBMW:
I can't get myself worked up about PED in professional athletics. Pro sports is a show. On PEDs they can put on a better show. I have to question why they're against the rules in the first place.


Not always.
I would much prefer a low scoring MLB game with base running, great fielding etc, rather than just homerun knocks all day long.


————————————————
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Posts: 25760 | Registered: September 06, 2003Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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Originally posted by erj_pilot:
But my debate with my dad was that PED's didn't necessarily make hitting the ball "easier", but what it did do was enable the abuser to recuperate and heal faster in those back-to-back-to-back games, thus allowing the abuser to be better rested in the 4th game of that road trip and having the strength to hit those home runs.

Others not taking PED's wouldn't be as rested and therefore not as strong. That's the edge I think PED's gave those guys...


Or be able to play for the duration of the season / career.

PEDs give the athlete an edge over the non-user. Period. Do they grant 'magical ability'? Of course not.

The PED users rationalization is laughable.

They also allow the user to 'steal' the playing time of the other non-using player. So there is an insidious theft component as well.

Also it creates a 'false benchmark' of what is considered a peak for a sport. So there is a lie there.

Lastly - it encourages young athletes to do 'whatever it takes' to make it pro. That's bad for young athletes who want to play clean.

------------------------------------------


Proverbs 27:17 - As iron sharpens iron, so one man sharpens another.
 
Posts: 8940 | Location: Florida | Registered: September 20, 2004Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Irksome Whirling Dervish
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So are you saying that the only 4 players using were Giambi, Sosa, Big Mac and Bonds? Of course not but they got the headlines in the home run derby.

Other players did too thus the game is compromised to the point that you need to put asteriks, if at all, on years for the entire league. Pitchers, catchers, and everyone else took them to extend careers or get great contracts.

After the strike years MLB wanted fans to come back and the owners, pkayets, union and the league all happily took the steroids.

The entire league did itself in and was never going to complain about PEDs.

Big Mac and Bonds ruined nothing about the game.
 
Posts: 4287 | Location: "You can't just go to Walmart with a gift card and get a new brother." Janice Serrano | Registered: May 03, 2005Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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McGwire is full of shit. If he could have hit 70 without being juiced why didn't he? He didn't come close. His career arc changed as he found the right formula.

The 'roid era is part of the history of the game as much as segregation and the guys in the 60s and 70s who were hopped up on greenies. If baseball actually cared they would have done something when the 'roid rumblings started in the late 80s with Canseco and, wait for it, McGwire. Bulked up batters put butts in seats and helped bring fans back after the strike. Money always wins. Baseball cared only when congress threatened the $$$.
 
Posts: 4354 | Location: Peoples Republic of Berkeley | Registered: June 12, 2008Reply With QuoteReport This Post
Ammoholic
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I was an A's fan growing up before we had a team in DC. Bash brothers and Ricky Henderson were my favorite players. It saddens me to think what shitheads the bash brothers became.

I sold Mark McGwires rookie and Olympic cards the season before he broke the record to get money for college. I kicked myself for it the following year, now I am happy I got rid of it.

Fuck him.



Jesse

Sic Semper Tyrannis
 
Posts: 21254 | Location: Loudoun County, Virginia | Registered: December 27, 2014Reply With QuoteReport This Post
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